How many regular season wins poll!

[RememberMurray]

No s__t Sherlock.

No one is saying that 7-5 is acceptable in perpetuity. Of course not. Year three it is acceptable if years four and five are breakouts.





Then good riddance.

Thing is, when 2020 is a 9+ win campaign, you'll be pushing over small children in order to clamber back onto the bandwagon. Maybe we'll save you a seat, at the back. Maybe...

Oh, man... I'm so relieved to know that you don't find 7-5 seasons acceptable "in perpetuity". That's good. Hmmm... maybe I'm confused over exactly what it is you're trying to say.

It's also comforting to know that you do, in fact, have actual, red-blooded, non-milquetoast 'expectations'... and that the clock starts (for you) next year, in Year Four.

I think I've got your range now. Carry on.

 

[RememberMurray]

Who is “we”. I’m curious who is aligning themselves with you.

I think he may be using the royal "we".

 

[Gophers_4life]

I think he may be using the royal "we".

Her life, was in your hands!!

 

[Spoofin]

Oh, man... I'm so relieved to know that you don't find 7-5 seasons acceptable "in perpetuity". That's good. Hmmm... maybe I'm confused over exactly what it is you're trying to say.

It's also comforting to know that you do, in fact, have actual, red-blooded, non-milquetoast 'expectations'... and that the clock starts (for you) next year, in Year Four.

I think I've got your range now. Carry on.

Everyone knows that is the range all non-glib football fans use.


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[RememberMurray]

Everyone knows that is the range all non-glib football fans use.


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Sigh... so many divisions these days.

— Whites vs. people of color

— Gays vs. straights

— Republicans vs. Democrats

— Flecksters vs. Claeysters

— Gophers vs. Badgers

And, now...

— Glibbers vs. Non-glibbers

Can't we all just get along, people?

 

[Gophers_4life]

Would be great if someone could refresh me on all those cases over the past couple decades where a football program brought in a new head coach for a rebuilding job and demanded that he get 9+ wins by year two or three.

It's always four years. That's been the yard stick for quite some time.


Watch, spoof will quote Ohio State or something like that. You talk about just not getting it.

 

[Spoofin]

Would be great if someone could refresh me on all those cases over the past couple decades where a football program brought in a new head coach for a rebuilding job and demanded that he get 9+ wins by year two or three.

It's always four years. That's been the yard stick for quite some time.


Watch, spoof will quote Ohio State or something like that. You talk about just not getting it.

Who is demanding anything? It’s a fan message board and people are voicing their opinion and expectations. Talk about not getting it.


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[Gophers_4life]

Who is demanding anything?

You and others here, are saying the season will be a disappointment, saying the team will be mediocre, even saying the coach might be on the hot seat if we "only" get seven regular season wins.

Don't try to turn it into some silly semantics argument (oh wait, this is the internet ...). It's the same thing.

 

[Spoofin]

You and others here, are saying the season will be a disappointment, saying the team will be mediocre, even saying the coach might be on the hot seat if we "only" get seven regular season wins.

Don't try to turn it into some silly semantics argument (oh wait, this is the internet ...). It's the same thing.

I will be very disappointed if we only get 7 wins. I’ll be disappointed if we only get 8. Who gives a rat’s as@ if I’m disappointed? Who exactly am I demanding something of? What are the consequences if my “demands” aren’t met.

Get a grip. You are an odd duck G4L.


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[Gophers_4life]

I will be very disappointed if we only get 7 wins. I’ll be disappointed if we only get 8. Who gives a rat’s as@ if I’m disappointed?

If it were only you, that'd be fine. But I think we both know that your words here represent the feelings of far more of the fanbase than just yourself. The posts of several others on the board definitely indicate that to me.

Perhaps I should say that my sentiments aren't meant to be directed at you (or anyone personally) per se, but come off that way because I have to respond to someone.


That said: I challenge you (or anyone in your 9+ wins cohort) to find a DI-A/FBS program in the last two decades, reasonably similar-ish to what Minnesota's situation is/has been in the years leading up to Fleck (and I'm not talking about the scandal, I'm talking about general well-being of the program, from facilities, to revenue, attendance, historical performance, etc.), that was able to get a significant win total (9+ for 12 game regular seasons, perhaps 8+ for 11 game regular seasons) in year three of a new coach hire/rebuilding job. I don't think it's out there, is my gut feeling.

I just think such an expectation is hopelessly flawed. And I just don't understand where it comes from. Where is the evidence that it has even been done before??

 

[bemidjigopher]

All I'll say is Kill inherited a far worse situation and won eight games his third year. I think with the schedule and how last year finished and who is coming back, anything less would be a disapointment

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[RememberMurray]

If it were only you, that'd be fine. But I think we both know that your words here represent the feelings of far more of the fanbase than just yourself. The posts of several others on the board definitely indicate that to me.

Perhaps I should say that my sentiments aren't meant to be directed at you (or anyone personally) per se, but come off that way because I have to respond to someone.


That said: I challenge you (or anyone in your 9+ wins cohort) to find a DI-A/FBS program in the last two decades, reasonably similar-ish to what Minnesota's situation is/has been in the years leading up to Fleck (and I'm not talking about the scandal, I'm talking about general well-being of the program, from facilities, to revenue, attendance, historical performance, etc.), that was able to get a significant win total (9+ for 12 game regular seasons, perhaps 8+ for 11 game regular seasons) in year three of a new coach hire/rebuilding job. I don't think it's out there, is my gut feeling.

I just think such an expectation is hopelessly flawed. And I just don't understand where it comes from. Where is the evidence that it has even been done before??

Sigh.

I suppose it makes no difference that we were "rebuilding" (ahem) from a 9-4 record the season immediately preceding Fleck's hire.

It makes no difference that Kill/Claeys had clearly — clearly — raised the program profile immediately before Fleck got here.

And, naturally, it makes no difference that Coyle made it clear when P.J. Fleck was hired that expectations were quite high in recruiting, attendance, and success on the field (wins and losses).

Nope.

It's 7-5 in Year Three, here we come! Anyone who expects more than that is simply... what's the word you used? Unreasonable?

Look: you have your 'expectations' (such as they are), and others have their's. Good enough? Can you give it a rest?

 

[PMWinSTP]

The father back you go, the more you can/should discount that evidence.

You did state a lot of evidence from 2018. Makes a very compelling case that if Minn played Purdue in a neutral site after their bowl games last season, Minn would’ve won.

Each new season is significantly different though, I don’t think you question.

2017 is...less than two years ago and the last time Gophs played at Purdue. It is very relevant. Led the game with less than 2 minutes to go. Destroyed Purdue in 2018. Bringing back a boatload of starters and players with game experience. Many JRs and Srs were at that 2017 game.

Based on how Gophs have played Purdue the last two years why do you believe more in Brohm and staff than Fleck and staff? Does not compute.

 

[Gopher Gildy]

I think we get to 8 regular-season wins. Here’s my rationale for my prediction:

- No Robb Smith at DC. It was clear last year that he was an absolute hindrance to this team. Can’t wait to see a whole season of a Rossi-coached defense.

- Healthy Antoine Winfield Jr. Yes, he’s that important to our defense. The epitome of a game-changer.

- RB depth. Returning leading rushers from 2015, 2016, 2017, and 2018. If I’m an opposing defense, I’m not looking forward to 60 mins of Smith, Brooks, and Ibrahim.

- WR star-power. Johnson is a stud, and this year I think we see the emergence of Bateman as an elite B1G receiver - close to 1,000 yards and 7+ TDs

- Surrounding cast: Don’t forget Seth Green I’m short-yardages/wildcat. Don’t forget about the coming-of-age of the 2016 “Empire” class in Coughlin, Martin, and Barber on defense. Look for Dew-Treadway (Notre Dame grad transfer) to eat on the DL, and look for Faalale + Dunlap Jr. to eat on OL.

- Discipline. Most people are too caught up in Mr. Flecks rah-rah style to realize that his teams show discipline: they don’t beat themselves. Penalty yardage is kept to a minimum. In a very competitive West division, this will make a huge difference in 2019.

My point is that, despite CFB being a weird sport in which you should expect the unexpected, this team has a very high ceiling in 2019. I foresee a Holiday/Outback/Capital One type of bowl game for us.



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[Dano564]

I will be very disappointed if we only get 7 wins. I’ll be disappointed if we only get 8. Who gives a rat’s as@ if I’m disappointed? Who exactly am I demanding something of? What are the consequences if my “demands” aren’t met.

Get a grip. You are an odd duck G4L.


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If you're disappointed, we (other GH'ers) will have 8 non-football months of a disappointed Spoofin to deal with here on Gopherhole.

 

[Dano564]

I think we get to 8 regular-season wins. Here’s my rationale for my prediction:

- No Robb Smith at DC. It was clear last year that he was an absolute hindrance to this team. Can’t wait to see a whole season of a Rossi-coached defense.

- Healthy Antoine Winfield Jr. Yes, he’s that important to our defense. The epitome of a game-changer.

- RB depth. Returning leading rushers from 2015, 2016, 2017, and 2018. If I’m an opposing defense, I’m not looking forward to 60 mins of Smith, Brooks, and Ibrahim.

- WR star-power. Johnson is a stud, and this year I think we see the emergence of Bateman as an elite B1G receiver - close to 1,000 yards and 7+ TDs

- Surrounding cast: Don’t forget Seth Green I’m short-yardages/wildcat. Don’t forget about the coming-of-age of the 2016 “Empire” class in Coughlin, Martin, and Barber on defense. Look for Dew-Treadway (Notre Dame grad transfer) to eat on the DL, and look for Faalale + Dunlap Jr. to eat on OL.

- Discipline. Most people are too caught up in Mr. Flecks rah-rah style to realize that his teams show discipline: they don’t beat themselves. Penalty yardage is kept to a minimum. In a very competitive West division, this will make a huge difference in 2019.

My point is that, despite CFB being a weird sport in which you should expect the unexpected, this team has a very high ceiling in 2019. I foresee a Holiday/Outback/Capital One type of bowl game for us.



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I agree with the high ceiling.
I agree we can be very good.
But if the cards don't fall right, I'm not going to be disappointed in the progress of Fleck in three seasons here.
Continue down this path of 2020, 2021, 2022 never getting over 7, or barely touching 8 with a win over an unranked bowl team to make it 9, then I'll be disappointed.

Seven should be a minimum and running the table this year should be the goal with what we have. Doesn't mean Nebraska might not beat us by 20 again.

 

[RememberMurray]

I agree with the high ceiling.
I agree we can be very good.
But if the cards don't fall right, I'm not going to be disappointed in the progress of Fleck in three seasons here.
Continue down this path of 2020, 2021, 2022 never getting over 7, or barely touching 8 with a win over an unranked bowl team to make it 9, then I'll be disappointed.

Seven should be a minimum and running the table this year should be the goal with what we have. Doesn't mean Nebraska might not beat us by 20 again.

We all have different expectations. It's a free country.

But... Nebraska beating us by 20 again (!?!?)

That would be a complete disaster. We shouldn't lose by 20 to anybody on the 2019 schedule. Not in Year Three. Not if we're ever actually going where Fleck wants to take us.

Kill/Claeys had us farther along than that. We should be past that point by now.

AGAIN: Just my opinion.

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

I agree with the high ceiling.
I agree we can be very good.
But if the cards don't fall right, I'm not going to be disappointed in the progress of Fleck in three seasons here.
Continue down this path of 2020, 2021, 2022 never getting over 7, or barely touching 8 with a win over an unranked bowl team to make it 9, then I'll be disappointed.

Seven should be a minimum and running the table this year should be the goal with what we have. Doesn't mean Nebraska might not beat us by 20 again.

What does "barely touching 8" even mean? Seems like a team either gets to 8 or it doesn't.

 

[Spoofin]

What does "barely touching 8" even mean? Seems like a team either gets to 8 or it doesn't.

It means including * wins.
It allows lessening of a past coach’s results when desired.


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[Dano564]

It means including * wins.
It allows lessening of a past coach’s results when desired.


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Yeh, Spoofin gets it.

This video shows what "Barely touching" is.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBv5DBl9SjE

 

[salzie]

I'm going with 8 wins and 0 games we get embarrassed in

 

[Some guy]

It means including * wins.
It allows lessening of a past coach’s results when desired.


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I think people are more willing to forgive close wins against bad teams for 10-2 teams than 8-4 teams.
People are also more willing to forgive close wins against bad teams when you suck.

When you are average to above average and are trying to become good, making people sweat it out against bad teams is annoying.

 

[Spoofin]

I think people are more willing to forgive close wins against bad teams for 10-2 teams than 8-4 teams.

In this case, I think it had zero to do with the overall record and everything to do with who was coach. In fact, I’m certain of it.


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[bleedsmaroonandgold]

I think people are more willing to forgive close wins against bad teams for 10-2 teams than 8-4 teams.
People are also more willing to forgive close wins against bad teams when you suck.

When you are average to above average and are trying to become good, making people sweat it out against bad teams is annoying.

In any year, with any coach, I'll be content with a close win against anyone on the schedule, from South Dakota State to Wisconsin. I'm not into downplaying wins for my team.

 

[PMWinSTP]

In this case, I think it had zero to do with the overall record and everything to do with who was coach. In fact, I’m certain of it.


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<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Qw9oX-kZ_9k" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Now you've done it...

 

[GSUsTALON]

I agree with the high ceiling.

But if the cards don't fall right, I'm not going to be disappointed in the progress of Fleck in three seasons here..

No cards needed. You are not playing 21 or poker. You have to execute in every game.

Even GSU has to execute on every play against the P5 Gophers to stand a chance!

 

[Dano564]

I think people are more willing to forgive close wins against bad teams for 10-2 teams than 8-4 teams.
People are also more willing to forgive close wins against bad teams when you suck.

When you are average to above average and are trying to become good, making people sweat it out against bad teams is annoying.

I'm more forgiving of a bad win when you have a couple really good wins to go with it.
It's less impressive when you have bad wins and your good wins are against teams who might not have been the best coached teams ever.

They had 5 Big Ten wins that year.
One over Pat Fitzgerald, and the rest over this Mt. Rushmore of Big Ten Coaching Royalty:
1st year coach Chris Ash
1st year coach DJ Durkin
1st year coach Lovie Smith
Last year coach Darrell Hazell

I know it isn't quite Hayes, Schembechler, Paterno, and Hayden Fry, but it's gotta be close.

 

[Dano564]

No cards needed. You are not playing 21 or poker. You have to execute in every game.

Even GSU has to execute on every play against the P5 Gophers to stand a chance!

Hey Bird-dude, you're in the wrong thread. We have a South Georgia University Screaming Eagles thread somewhere else on this forum.

 

[rugger14]

In this case, I think it had zero to do with the overall record and everything to do with who was coach. In fact, I’m certain of it.


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That season was solid. The come from ahead loss against PSU on the road felt like a Glen Mason type loss. That would have been a huge win that might have saved him his job.

 

[RememberMurray]

That season was solid. The come from ahead loss against PSU on the road felt like a Glen Mason type loss. That would have been a huge win that might have saved him his job.

They were, indeed, ahead. And there's no question that that fact alone makes the loss very disappointing.

But it must be said that the Gophers took the eventual B1G Champions to overtime — on the Nittany Lions home field, in front of a huge, hostile crowd.

They also went 9-3 over the remainder of that season.

"Solid" is a very good word to describe that team, and that season.