Hoff at Point

[Monty519]

i will take that bet of 1st team big ten!

he wasnt good last night at the point. ya he had 20 points, good for him. blake IS A BAD PG AND IT WILL SHOW AGAINST PURDUE. purdue will press us and beat the hell out of our poor ball handling. blake was terrible during the 18-4 run. blake is a terrible ball handler and probably the worst ball handler of any guard in the big ten. blake is a shooter and a very smart player which makes up for his lack of abilities. i love having blake on this team, i have said it a thousand times, but he cant play point.

He just did, last night, leading the team to 81 points on offense, our biggest output since B10 season started. Yes, it was NU and most of it was the inside play, but to say he CAN'T play point is just not accurate, since he just showed he CAN do it. Do it well? Probably not, but good enough to get W's, I think so. We just have to utilize our advantages down low, which we will have against the vast majority of teams in the country.

I wouldn't call his performance stellar, but for the first time doing the role, and basically doing it all game long, against a historically tough to deal with zone, he showed himself to be a solid point. Definitely wouldn't say he's a "bad PG", nor do I think Purdue's gonna do anything extreme that will suddenly turn him into a turnover machine. I do think though we will see more Maverick in this game cause I do think it'll be important to have a couple handlers out there.

 

[march madness]

Blake will have trouble against Purdue, but so will everyone trying to dribble.

 

[GopherJake]

Earlier in the thread, someone stated "cross court passes are how you beat the 1-3-1". Yes, I know about passing over the zone, but think of this play (it was something like that): Blake's dribbling up the right sideline. He lofts a softball pass all the way to Rodney at the other sideline and it's nearly intercepted. Rodney takes one dribble, picks it up, gets a trap and lofts a high arcing pass back to Blake on the other sideline, which is nearly intercepted. Blake dribbles twice and picks it up. He gets trapped. He lofts it back over to Rodney...almost intercepted. Rodney then fires a line-drive pass from the scorers table over to shart[email protected]. Turnover. That's not beating the zone. That's playing scared. You beat the zone by passing, yes. But the passes need to be faster and fluid. Not catch, hold, dribble, hold, pass, catch, hold, dribble. I want pass, pass, pass, penetrate, pass, zing, pow, bam! Hammer dunk!

We had 3 second half turnovers using our 3rd string PG (who scored 20 points) in this complete mess of an offense you describe. We also had a ton of points in the paint including several dunks.

Again, have you seen MN vs. NW's 1-3-1 the past few years?????

Regarding Blake picking up his dribble. How many turnovers were a result of that? Zero? Would you rather have him try to dribble through every double team? I doubt it. He quite effectively escaped using the skills he has. Smart player.

Game one, playing 38 minutes at PG, against that goofy, sometimes stifling defense? Stellar.

 

[khoffman43]

i will take that bet of 1st team big ten!

You bolded part of a sentence. I said if Blake averages 20pts, 4 rebounds and 3 assist for the rest of the Big Ten season he will be first team all big ten. He wont average that, so it doesn't matter.

 

[lakesgopher]

How else do you start a fast break outside of missed buckets and steals? Either way you are still wrong. They were in halfcourt sets basically the whole game. Ours bigs had nice position because they were posting against a 5'10" PG and 2 foul happy Europeans.

!!!!!

you dont have a clue! i think you may be a bit slow in terms of basketball knowledge

when a team has to scramble to prevent transition buckets they are unable to set the 1-3-1 properly because they are trying to prevent layups/dunks/trailers. what happens is the spacing is a mess and its easier for a post to establish offensive position. it has nothing to do with fastbreak points, half court sets, etc. it has everthing to do with spacing.

so yes, NU was in a half court set all night. but it wasnt effective because of how poorly they shot. when they shoot well and can set their defense properly they are tough. that is why they were able to make the run at the end of the first half.

rodney and mbakwe, and iverson were always flying up the court looking for a dunk/lay up and whether blake pushed or not(which blake didnt) it caused NU problems on defense.

 

[Gold Vision]

My only gripe last night was that Blake gets a little over ambititious with his full court passes. Granted 2 of them glanced off the hands of our bigs last night, I could go for less of the full court lobs.

 

[Gold Vision]

you dont have a clue! i think you may be a bit slow in terms of basketball knowledge

when a team has to scramble to prevent transition buckets they are unable to set the 1-3-1 properly because they are trying to prevent layups/dunks/trailers. what happens is the spacing is a mess and its easier for a post to establish offensive position. it has nothing to do with fastbreak points, half court sets, etc. it has everthing to do with spacing.

so yes, NU was in a half court set all night. but it wasnt effective because of how poorly they shot. when they shoot well and can set their defense properly they are tough. that is why they were able to make the run at the end of the first half.

rodney and mbakwe, and iverson were always flying up the court looking for a dunk/lay up and whether blake pushed or not(which blake didnt) it caused NU problems on defense.

You did not watch the same game I did if you saw NU scrambling for defensive position, period. They weren't scrambling to prevent transition baskets whether it came off of missed shots, made shots, or turnovers. You keep ignoring this, but the NU had plenty of time to set up their 1-3-1 defense. It was effective until we started going High-Low with Ralph at the free throw line with two posts. Like I said, the 5' 10" PG at the back of the 1-3-1 zone is not difficult to establish position with.

 

[Moonlight]

We had 3 second half turnovers using our 3rd string PG (who scored 20 points) in this complete mess of an offense you describe. We also had a ton of points in the paint including several dunks.

Again, have you seen MN vs. NW's 1-3-1 the past few years?????

Regarding Blake picking up his dribble. How many turnovers were a result of that? Zero? Would you rather have him try to dribble through every double team? I doubt it. He quite effectively escaped using the skills he has. Smart player.

Game one, playing 38 minutes at PG, against that goofy, sometimes stifling defense? Stellar.

Totally agree, Jake.
It was frustrating to watch at times, but hey - that is any game against NU - that is their game plan. Frustrate and force you to play their game. It was hard to see Blake hesitate, but it wasn't due to lack of confidence or ability. He was planning where the ball would go when the inevitable double team happened. At first I didn't get it. But when the Gophs stayed steady with a plan the only way Nu had a chance was if we shot lower than 40% from the line, because they wouldn't be able to stop us from penetrating and scoring w/o fouling. We don't have a dribble drive team. In general, getting the ball inside requires patience, which Blake and the team showed last night.
Blake and the team did exactly what they needed to do to beat Nu's odd style of play even as they were learning a new style of their own.
Yes - stellar indeed!

 

[jamiche]

Totally agree, Jake.
It was frustrating to watch at times, but hey - that is any game against NU - that is their game plan. Frustrate and force you to play their game. It was hard to see Blake hesitate, but it wasn't due to lack of confidence or ability. He was planning where the ball would go when the inevitable double team happened. At first I didn't get it. But when the Gophs stayed steady with a plan the only way Nu had a chance was if we shot lower than 40% from the line, because they wouldn't be able to stop us from penetrating and scoring w/o fouling. We don't have a dribble drive team. In general, getting the ball inside requires patience, which Blake and the team showed last night.
Blake and the team did exactly what they needed to do to beat Nu's odd style of play even as they were learning a new style of their own.
Yes - stellar indeed!

As someone who has been a proponent of Blake getting more time at the point, it was apparent last night that the adage of "be careful what you wish for" might apply. He does so many things well that it becomes easy to overlook his fundamental lack of quickness and ballhandling skills. He was barely able to get away with it against NU because their perimeter players are no more athletic than he is but I anticipate that he will really struggle against tOSU, MSU, Purdue, Illinois and Taylor Battle of PSU. Ahanisi will get his chance because Blake will struggle against full court and other kinds of pressure defenses.

If the team gets to 10 wins in the B10 regular season the coaching staff and players should be congratulated.

 

[lakesgopher]

You did not watch the same game I did if you saw NU scrambling for defensive position, period. They weren't scrambling to prevent transition baskets whether it came off of missed shots, made shots, or turnovers. You keep ignoring this, but the NU had plenty of time to set up their 1-3-1 defense. It was effective until we started going High-Low with Ralph at the free throw line with two posts. Like I said, the 5' 10" PG at the back of the 1-3-1 zone is not difficult to establish position with.

you didnt watch the game if this is your analysis

 

[GopherJake]

you didnt watch the game if this is your analysis

I heard Tubby speak after the game and this morning. Both times he mentioned how valuable Ralph at the top of the key was to breaking the 1-3-1. Maybe Tubby doesn't know what he's talking about though.

 

[Moonlight]

I knew you weren't going to agree w/me!

As someone who has been a proponent of Blake getting more time at the point, it was apparent last night that the adage of "be careful what you wish for" might apply. He does so many things well that it becomes easy to overlook his fundamental lack of quickness and ballhandling skills. He was barely able to get away with it against NU because their perimeter players are no more athletic than he is but I anticipate that he will really struggle against tOSU, MSU, Purdue, Illinois and Taylor Battle of PSU. Ahanisi will get his chance because Blake will struggle against full court and other kinds of pressure defenses.

If the team gets to 10 wins in the B10 regular season the coaching staff and players should be congratulated.

You may be right, but I don't think the NU game is one to draw too many conclusions from. Nor will the game against OSU.

 

[lakesgopher]

I heard Tubby speak after the game and this morning. Both times he mentioned how valuable Ralph at the top of the key was to breaking the 1-3-1. Maybe Tubby doesn't know what he's talking about though.

i never brought up ralph so im not sure why you did

 

[NurumbiCongo]

I like people complaining about Blake have a very-very good game. When Devoe (former ugliest player in the B10) was needed to play the point most you candy a#ses defended him because it wasn't his natural position.

 

[GopherJake]

i never brought up ralph so im not sure why you did

No, Gold Vision did. But you replied that his analysis was "broken."

You did not watch the same game I did if you saw NU scrambling for defensive position, period. They weren't scrambling to prevent transition baskets whether it came off of missed shots, made shots, or turnovers. You keep ignoring this, but the NU had plenty of time to set up their 1-3-1 defense. It was effective until we started going High-Low with Ralph at the free throw line with two posts. Like I said, the 5' 10" PG at the back of the 1-3-1 zone is not difficult to establish position with.

you didnt watch the game if this is your analysis

 

[jags1998]

When I went to bed last night this thread had 3 replies. Now 44. I'm starting to think that Hoff and anything about him brings out discussion like nothing else except the Twins or Vikings.

Thanks for the comments. For those that disagree with my use of stellar, let me say again that I'm using stellar in comparison to his natural ability to play point at this level ... which is limited at best. I'm expecting Purdue to give us some problems.

 

[underground629]

Are you just trying to not get your hopes up or do you honestly believe there's no chance? It's hard to say right now, but I'd guess he'll be back. Senior year, best team he's had, if there's ANY chance he can play, he will.

Not that it adds to this discussion but Al is done. I don't think there is any circumstance in which he comes back this year unless it's an act of God. I think we should get used to this.

 

[underground629]

I wouldn't read into that too much. I've been around tooons of injured players, and it's pretty typical for players to say stuff like that and then come back.

Sadly, the Twitter stalker in me, is simply going by what Al seems to saying-



And also-



I was kind of thinking about starting an Al Nolen tribute thread that seems a bit premature. Anything could happen I guess but I think he's done. He can still play a huge role on the bench for us, but as far as playing even if he is able to come back he's going to go through some therapy, building his stamina and legs back up, it would seem it would take him a bit to get back into game shape.

It's really unfortunate and not for us but for him. All indications were that he was done after being ineligible last year but he worked extremely hard to get back and it's sad that he's likely done.