Gophers507
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ur right it doesn't...we'll all know the answer come spring
Gopher's best pro prospect...
- Thread starter centerofmn
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ur right it doesn't...we'll all know the answer come spring
Read the post, homie. I listed 25 guys off the entire roster that I said appear to have the physical capabilities to be pro prospects. I said multiple times that their play has to be high quality and that I never said these guys WOULD be NFL players. But I'll still humour you
- apparently you know more than Kiper as well. Last year nobody thought Campbell, Sherels or NTA would ever be in an NFL camp. Both Wills and Alford have the size to get a look and Royston is going to have a very good year IMO and get some looks at CB as well.
- Cmon son. Edwards was arguable just as good as Small and Brown last year despite being 2 years yougner and Brown is still in an NFL camp. Edwards is also 330 with a great first step for a man his size. Dude is easily an NFL prospect at this point. Only knock is that he's a bit short and doesn't have a great motor. Tinsley has the size at 245 and the speed. He's faster than Campbell was and has flashed a lot of ability in his short stints. And his legal troubles are far less than many other guys on the NFLs radar. And if Beal is as good as people think he can be, that's no knock on Tinsley. Beal was a 5 star recruit. TS has been the best return man in the B10 for 2 years. Apparently for you that's not good enough to even get a tryout in the NFL despite him having 2 years to get better. As for Lair, the kid is 6'3" and runs a legit 4.5 at the TE spot. That's excellent speed. And you're knocking him for being a backup to a guy that's in NFL camp? lol. I guess that means all our LBs must be bums too.
So because Gray hasn't started his first 2 years he's automatically not a QB? Please don't fall into that trap because it's silly. 2 years ago Weber was a clear NFL prospect, last year he struggled and the coaches didn't want to throw a true frosh who hadn't played football in 2 years (injured his senior year in HS and sat out in 08) to the wolves in an offense a 4th year junior had trouble grasping. Now Weber, who still has some very good tools, beat him out for the job (as any good program would actually want a 5th year, 3 year starter to beat out a true soph) and now the kid can't play QB? Either way he's 6'5", 230 with a strong arm and excellent speed. The kid has all the physical tools to play QB (or WR if you want to argue that)
- Cooper has literally never been a safety. He played LB in HS and has always been an LB here. Plus the kid is 225 (not 210 as you think for some reason. Please take a look at the updated roster weights on gophersports.com) and already as big as Simoni was last year, but for some reason you think Cooper needs to move to safety to get a look in the NFL when Simoni went to the combine after playing at the same weight and Cooper is even faster than Simoni was? I spose...
As I said, I named the guys that appear to have NFL potential based on their size/strength/speed and perceived potential for the sake of argument. I've said multiple times that their play has to dictate whether or not they get there. At this point I'd say you're less of a realist and more of a pessimist seeing as how you went negative on most of those guys despite not being really informed about them at all (no offense but your analysis of guys like Cooper and Edwards were way off). I actually consider myself a realist
I respect Kiper and everything that he does but he literally looks at tape and does evals for hundreds and hundreds of kids. So is it a surprise that Wills is on the list?? Not entirely. Most of the kids he does evals on don't get drafted cause he does so many. Everyone says he has a great work ethic cause he dropped all that weight. Where was that great work ethic before he got fat??? I've said it before and I'll say it again, Alford will not make an NFL team. Everyone's 40 times are inflated. 4.5 oooooooooook. 4.7-4.8...which is still fast but do you really believe he is a 4.5?? If you do then you are delusional.
Tinsley does have less legal troubles than some NFL dudes but he also has a lot more legal troubles than A LOT of NFL dudes. Do you seriously think the NFL is going to take a chance on someone who is already been in more trouble than most players?? And not for minor infractions either. Probably not, unless like I said, he is awesome which I hope to God he is. TS has not been the best return man. Gilreath, Keyshawn Martin, and Koulianos are better. Ok Coop is 225 How many 225 pound LB's are there?? And Simoni went to the combine, ok, where did that get him?? Based on what you saw last year you think Gray will be an NFL QB?? If so, you are delusional, again.
I want the gophers to have 12 NFL prospects cause that would be awesome but, come on ppl, lets be real here. And I think Jewhan will be good but I don't think from what he has done so far that he is a legit NFL prospect yet.
Sportsfan24
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Classic Gopher Fan......
If you play for the Gophers you suck.
Classic Badger, Buckeye, Wolverine and Hawkeye fan; if you play for our team you are great.
Do this: take the gophers roster and compare man for man to the favored teams. Are there gopher players who could possible start over a player on those teams. My answer is there are more gophers each year who could, ie the talent gap is closing.
Look, not to sound like a homer but the gophers are getting better. Unlike some, I thought Coach Mason did an outstanding job coaching the gophers but the talent level of coach Brewsters team is considerably different. The type of player walking around gopher facilities today looks completely different than they did 5 or 6 years ago.
The NFL as noticed this, maybe the fans one day will also.
If you play for the Gophers you suck.
Classic Badger, Buckeye, Wolverine and Hawkeye fan; if you play for our team you are great.
Do this: take the gophers roster and compare man for man to the favored teams. Are there gopher players who could possible start over a player on those teams. My answer is there are more gophers each year who could, ie the talent gap is closing.
Look, not to sound like a homer but the gophers are getting better. Unlike some, I thought Coach Mason did an outstanding job coaching the gophers but the talent level of coach Brewsters team is considerably different. The type of player walking around gopher facilities today looks completely different than they did 5 or 6 years ago.
The NFL as noticed this, maybe the fans one day will also.
GoAUpher
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Are you sure your reading the post correctly? Because he didn't say that you weren't a fan.
Alright bro-ham I'll break this down for you. I respect your opinion and all but you're arguing something completely different than me and completely ignoring every disclaimer and qualification I've mentioned. Remember what the original statement was
To which I replied:
notuce I specifically said SHOTS, and SPECIFICALLY said I doubt 12 will make the team. For some reason you're not getting that. Also notice I didn't mention guys like Bennet because no matter how well he performs I don't think his size/speed combo will ever be good enough for the NFL. The guys I mentioned of some NFL qualities physically. Now onto your other points:
If Wills shows improved feet and pass blocking this year, he has a shot to get into someone's camp. Dude is huge and while I don't think he'll ever play in the NFL, its possible he'll get a look somewhere. If you disagree, that's fine because I don't feel too strongly about him
Alford has been very good when healthy and has enough athleticism and size to get a look in the NFL at RT or RG. I don't think he'll ever make a team but that's not what we're discussing. I think he's good enough to get a free agent contract and a tryout, IF he performs this year.
As for Lair, funny that you call me delusional with no real knowledge of his speed. I know as well as anyone that Rivals (and all other services) exagerate speeds and use hand times instead of electronic times. However Lair was on a state championship 4x100 relay team in Texas, and ran 100 meter times that correlate to excellent speed. I have no doubt that he was a legit 4.5 guy when he came out of HS. Now he may be a few steps slower now after bulking up but even if he's a 4.7 guy that's plenty fast for an NFL TE. Now he may not be big enough to make the NFL but if he performs up to his potential he'll definitely get a look if for nothing other than his speed and reportedly excellent hands.
Tinsley does have less legal troubles than some NFL dudes but he also has a lot more legal troubles than A LOT of NFL dudes. Do you seriously think the NFL is going to take a chance on someone who is already been in more trouble than most players?? And not for minor infractions either. Probably not, unless like I said, he is awesome which I hope to God he is. TS has not been the best return man. Gilreath, Keyshawn Martin, and Koulianos are better. Ok Coop is 225 How many 225 pound LB's are there?? And Simoni went to the combine, ok, where did that get him?? Based on what you saw last year you think Gray will be an NFL QB?? If so, you are delusional, again.
QUOTE]
If Tinsley stays out of trouble for the next 2 seasons I doubt his character will be a big issue for teams, but hey, that's just my opinion. If the kid can play, he'll get a shot because he has the size and enough quickness to be on the NFL's radar.
TS led the conference in KR yards as a frosh and was second by a few yards last year. I suppose we have different definitions of 'best'.
What's your point about Coop? If being 225lbs at LB automatically disqualified a player from being in the NFL why did Simoni get an invite to the combine and a FA contract, which is all I'm talking about (not making the team)? And Coop is a soph with 2 more years to put on 10-15 lbs on his frame which is certainly within the realm of possibility
And LO freaking L at that Gray statement. By your logic anyone that thinks any QB that's yet to start has NFL potential is delusional. Gray has the size, arm strength and athleticism to play QB in the NFL. Does he have the accuracy, smarts or poise? Who knows and he'll have to prove it on the field but my point has always been that he has the POTENTIAL to be an NFL prospect. Plus even if he sucks at QB the kid is a good enough athlete to get a look in the NFL as a project to WR or TE. But I'm the delusional one
Lastly Edwards. You really don't think that a kid that was both bigger and nearly as strong as 2 seniors (both of whom got NFL looks, one is still in camp) when he was just a soph and arguably played just as well despite being 2 years younger ISN'T an NFL prospect? If he isn't then why was Brown? Please explain that to me because I'm interested in your logic.
Alright bro-ham I'll break this down for you. I respect your opinion and all but you're arguing something completely different than me and completely ignoring every disclaimer and qualification I've mentioned. Remember what the original statement was
To which I replied:
notuce I specifically said SHOTS, and SPECIFICALLY said I doubt 12 will make the team. For some reason you're not getting that. Also notice I didn't mention guys like Bennet because no matter how well he performs I don't think his size/speed combo will ever be good enough for the NFL. The guys I mentioned of some NFL qualities physically. Now onto your other points:
If Wills shows improved feet and pass blocking this year, he has a shot to get into someone's camp. Dude is huge and while I don't think he'll ever play in the NFL, its possible he'll get a look somewhere. If you disagree, that's fine because I don't feel too strongly about him
Alford has been very good when healthy and has enough athleticism and size to get a look in the NFL at RT or RG. I don't think he'll ever make a team but that's not what we're discussing. I think he's good enough to get a free agent contract and a tryout, IF he performs this year.
As for Lair, funny that you call me delusional with no real knowledge of his speed. I know as well as anyone that Rivals (and all other services) exagerate speeds and use hand times instead of electronic times. However Lair was on a state championship 4x100 relay team in Texas, and ran 100 meter times that correlate to excellent speed. I have no doubt that he was a legit 4.5 guy when he came out of HS. Now he may be a few steps slower now after bulking up but even if he's a 4.7 guy that's plenty fast for an NFL TE. Now he may not be big enough to make the NFL but if he performs up to his potential he'll definitely get a look if for nothing other than his speed and reportedly excellent hands.
Tinsley does have less legal troubles than some NFL dudes but he also has a lot more legal troubles than A LOT of NFL dudes. Do you seriously think the NFL is going to take a chance on someone who is already been in more trouble than most players?? And not for minor infractions either. Probably not, unless like I said, he is awesome which I hope to God he is. TS has not been the best return man. Gilreath, Keyshawn Martin, and Koulianos are better. Ok Coop is 225 How many 225 pound LB's are there?? And Simoni went to the combine, ok, where did that get him?? Based on what you saw last year you think Gray will be an NFL QB?? If so, you are delusional, again.
QUOTE]
If Tinsley stays out of trouble for the next 2 seasons I doubt his character will be a big issue for teams, but hey, that's just my opinion. If the kid can play, he'll get a shot because he has the size and enough quickness to be on the NFL's radar.
TS led the conference in KR yards as a frosh and was second by a few yards last year. I suppose we have different definitions of 'best'.
What's your point about Coop? If being 225lbs at LB automatically disqualified a player from being in the NFL why did Simoni get an invite to the combine and a FA contract, which is all I'm talking about (not making the team)? And Coop is a soph with 2 more years to put on 10-15 lbs on his frame which is certainly within the realm of possibility
And LO freaking L at that Gray statement. By your logic anyone that thinks any QB that's yet to start has NFL potential is delusional. Gray has the size, arm strength and athleticism to play QB in the NFL. Does he have the accuracy, smarts or poise? Who knows and he'll have to prove it on the field but my point has always been that he has the POTENTIAL to be an NFL prospect. Plus even if he sucks at QB the kid is a good enough athlete to get a look in the NFL as a project to WR or TE. But I'm the delusional one
Lastly Edwards. You really don't think that a kid that was both bigger and nearly as strong as 2 seniors (both of whom got NFL looks, one is still in camp) when he was just a soph and arguably played just as well despite being 2 years younger ISN'T an NFL prospect? If he isn't then why was Brown? Please explain that to me because I'm interested in your logic.
oleboy you are right, i got you confused with the third poster of this thread, schnoodler. I apologize. He said 12 gophers will play in the NFL eventually which got me started. Ill make my last points and you can yours then I am done with this argument. ok? DEAL!
Wills, I think we agree he probably won't play in the NFL. So thats done.
Alford, I still think he is terrible but thats just me.
I wasn't aware of the Lair and HS sprinting. Just makes me think that he could have played ahead of TA. Maybe his blocking isn't very good yet??
Coop, I think the NFL was looking at Lawrence as a S. I was watching the NFL combine and I believe they mentioned it. He worked out with the LB's but the NFL wanted him as a S. So I stil l think his NFL position is SS.
Gray, I truely believe that they want to him to a WR full time so Alipate can be QB. Which is what i think should happen.
Edwards, I just want to see more of him before I tag him as a prospect.
Tinsley, yes the ability is there but I would put money on he will run into trouble again before he cleans his act up.
Ok I am done oleboy. Can we be friends again?
dpodoll68
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Years of scientific study have proven that once a young man achieves 20 years of age, he can no longer get bigger or stronger. No matter the amount of weight and speed training he does, he has reached his maximum capacity in both areas. There is a plethora of peer-reviewed articles to support this fact, if you do not believe me. Therefore, since Keanon Cooper is 20 years old (yes, that's correct...he's not yet able to drink legally), he can never get bigger than 225 lbs. That is his maximum. Yep, that's the ticket.
(There was so much idiocy to parse in your post that it was difficult to pick out just one thing. Congratulations. But this particular point made me LOL the most.)
Schnoodler
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dpod, in the spirit of gopher unity I'm going to unblock you. promise to behave.
march madness
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225 lb linebackers
I believe quite a few 225 lb college linebackers have played in the nfl. Granted most get to 230-235, but they were 225 as college seniors. I belive Vilma was, Ernie Sims, Greg Jones at mich st. an inside backer and one of the top in the nation, Derrick Brooks a potential future hall of famer.
The nfl would prefer a 240-250 lb that can run especially in the 3-4. But there are a few smaller linebackers in the 4-3.
I believe quite a few 225 lb college linebackers have played in the nfl. Granted most get to 230-235, but they were 225 as college seniors. I belive Vilma was, Ernie Sims, Greg Jones at mich st. an inside backer and one of the top in the nation, Derrick Brooks a potential future hall of famer.
The nfl would prefer a 240-250 lb that can run especially in the 3-4. But there are a few smaller linebackers in the 4-3.
dpodoll68
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May I ask what I have done so evil that it forced you to stick your fingers in your ears?
Schnoodler
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flame wars on unimportant minutia. now let's move on to an exciting gopher season.
Unregistered User
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Funny...I was thinking about Brooks specifically when people had started putting too much emphasis on the weights of LBs. I remember watching him a lot at FSU, and imagining what a monster he would be as a safety in the NFL. I just assumed at the time that he would be, and remain too small to play LB at the next level. Shows you what I know.
WolfontheProwl
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Wills.
Anyone who thinks he is an NFL player missed him play last season. Yes his pass blocking is terrible because he is so slow but he run blocking is as bad for the same reason. The guy cant move. He has no shot at playing in the NFL unless he loses about 50 pounds heck maybe 70 pounds. He is not a good enough athlete to be in the NFL no matter how big he is.
Anyone who thinks he is an NFL player missed him play last season. Yes his pass blocking is terrible because he is so slow but he run blocking is as bad for the same reason. The guy cant move. He has no shot at playing in the NFL unless he loses about 50 pounds heck maybe 70 pounds. He is not a good enough athlete to be in the NFL no matter how big he is.
KoolAid
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We're talking about Willis, not Wills. Willis is definitely a pro prospect
His run blocking improved a ton as the year progressed. I wouldn't put any money on him ever being an NFL player but the kid improved a lot but most fans refused to change their opinion of him regardless.
Schnoodler
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If Wills is good enought to hold onto his job all year, and avoid significant injury he is pretty much a lock to be in an NFL camp. Once he does that, he's got a decent chance to make it onto a development squad. I wouldn't count him out. With his size, people want him to succeed and they will make room if he shows any potential.
I'm not as sold on Willis as Kool Aid is.
I'm not as sold on Willis as Kool Aid is.
KoolAid
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You must have missed the Billy Mays draft special (one of the last things he did). He was sellin Willis and I was buyin.