Gophers #112 in initial KenPom rankings

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MissouriGopher said:
Did you grow up in Minnesota? I ask because people from the state seem to have a much higher opinion of St. Thomas than people outside of Minnesota. There are quite a few schools that I'd add to the Big East before St. Thomas .
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For the most part, yes.

Grade school years in Illinois, junior high & HS years in Minnesota. (and yes, a St. Thomas grad)

I don't disagree.

Dayton and Loyola-Chicago would seem to be potential fits. The conference realignment wheel probably won't stop spinning for a while, so the Big East because of its uniqueness (not dicatated by football) can afford to be selective with who they add (if they do). Getting to 16 schools (currently at 11) would seem reasonable.
 

One of the UST guys made this point a while back, but it will be interesting to see their recruiting strategy once they are eligible for postseason play. I'm not sure when that is, but will be telling; if they get another Rohde, will they throw a $ amount out that can rival the big names?
 

MonikerSchmoniker45 said:
One of the UST guys made this point a while back, but it will be interesting to see their recruiting strategy once they are eligible for postseason play. I'm not sure when that is, but will be telling; if they get another Rohde, will they throw a $ amount out that can rival the big names?
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That's a great question. They certainly miss Rohde, and not being eligible for the NCAA & NIT certainly doesn't help right now if they have a guy that can make the jump to a major conference.

St. Thomas is not eligible for NCAA/NIT until 2026-27 season, unless NCAA moves it up a season. Because UST is first school making the transition from Division 3 (not D2), they have 5 "sit-out" seasons instead of 4. I'm holding out hope they'll be eligible in 2025-26.
 

MissouriGopher said:
Did you grow up in Minnesota? I ask because people from the state seem to have a much higher opinion of St. Thomas than people outside of Minnesota. There are quite a few schools that I'd add to the Big East before St. Thomas.
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This is the exact reason St. Thomas went D1. To increase the prestige and profile of the school. Outside of the Midwest nobody cares or knows. Now. That’s what they want to change.
 

SelectionSunday said:
For the most part, yes.

Grade school years in Illinois, junior high & HS years in Minnesota. (and yes, a St. Thomas grad)

I don't disagree.

Dayton and Loyola-Chicago would seem to be potential fits. The conference realignment wheel probably won't stop spinning for a while, so the Big East because of its uniqueness (not dicatated by football) can afford to be selective with who they add (if they do). Getting to 16 schools (currently at 11) would seem reasonable.
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You can just scour the A10 for potential fits, including Duquesne and the Billikens of St. Louis.

The gap between the Summit League and the Big East is massive, though, and schools with that kind of aspiration usually take at least one step up before being admitted. Butler was once Horizon League, but hung out in the MVC before going to the BE. The way these things happen may not be the same as in the past, however. Still, it'd be more realistic for UST to look at joining a league in between like the MVC.
 


formerlybis said:
You can just scour the A10 for potential fits, including Duquesne and the Billikens of St. Louis.

The gap between the Summit League and the Big East is massive, though, and schools with that kind of aspiration usually take at least one step up before being admitted. Butler was once Horizon League, but hung out in the MVC before going to the BE. The way these things happen may not be the same as in the past, however. Still, it'd be more realistic for UST to look at joining a league in between like the MVC.
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A lot of those A10 schools do not have the money that UST has.

UST's endowment absolutely dwarfs that of Duquesne, St. Joes, St. Bonny, UMASS, George Mason, or LaSalle. It's more in line with Davidson and Dayton.

I don't know if that means anything but the UST crew seem eager to spend.
 


Bob_Loblaw said:
A lot of those A10 schools do not have the money that UST has.

UST's endowment absolutely dwarfs that of Duquesne, St. Joes, St. Bonny, UMASS, George Mason, or LaSalle. It's more in line with Davidson and Dayton.

I don't know if that means anything but the UST crew seem eager to spend.
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There are 8 schools in the A10 with a larger endowment than UST and 15 with a more storied basketball program. Davidson’s endowment is double that of UST’s and is only the fifth largest in the A10. That’s just one conference. The AAC, WCC, MVC, and random other conferences also have richer schools that spend big on basketball with a lot of history.
 

MissouriGopher said:
There are 8 schools in the A10 with a larger endowment than UST and 15 with a more storied basketball program. Davidson’s endowment is double that of UST’s and is only the fifth largest in the A10. That’s just one conference. The AAC, WCC, MVC, and random other conferences also have richer schools that spend big on basketball with a lot of history.
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I’m not sure where the false story that St. Thomas is rich ever started and how it perpetuates. Maybe is just anti private school bias. The so called wealth doesn’t find its way to faculty and staff. They had a massive campaign in the 90s that was heavily facilities related and not endowment.
 



MissouriGopher said:
There are 8 schools in the A10 with a larger endowment than UST and 15 with a more storied basketball program. Davidson’s endowment is double that of UST’s and is only the fifth largest in the A10. That’s just one conference. The AAC, WCC, MVC, and random other conferences also have richer schools that spend big on basketball with a lot of history.
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Clearly they have a more storied basketball program this is all a discussion based around the conversation of UST making a massive move up. The numbers that I've seen on endowments (which could be wrong), would be UST right in the middle of the A10 in terms of endowment size with other programs with a lot of money.

I'm not 100% sure what school's in the WCC have to do with the conversation. I was responding to a post about the A10.

Yes, there are schools with a lot more money than UST and just about every single school in D1 has a much more storied history - that's kind of the subject of the conversation.
 

Holy Man said:
I’m not sure where the false story that St. Thomas is rich ever started and how it perpetuates. Maybe is just anti private school bias. The so called wealth doesn’t find its way to faculty and staff. They had a massive campaign in the 90s that was heavily facilities related and not endowment.
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I think it's because of the massive leaps they've made in the last 15-20 years.

Within that span, they wanted to build a business school and viola, they built a business school right in DT Mpls. They then wanted a law school during a time there were way too many lawyers and somehow the bar approved adding another law school. Note- that crushed Hamline and William Mitchell which are now merged. They wanted to go D1 in basketball and football, and it was done.

So maybe it's just such a juxtaposition from how things are normally done in the state of MN but it certainly gives the impression that they wanted to change their regional and now national perception and they know how to get it done. It's one of my biggest concerns with the U competing against them in 5-6 years in terms of NIL, the U will drag their feet and UST doesn't seem to.

I think that sort of ability to get things done gives the perception that they have money, probably more money than they really do.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
I think it's because of the massive leaps they've made in the last 15-20 years.

Within that span, they wanted to build a business school and viola, they built a business school right in DT Mpls. They then wanted a law school during a time there were way too many lawyers and somehow the bar approved adding another law school. Note- that crushed Hamline and William Mitchell which are now merged. They wanted to go D1 in basketball and football, and it was done.

So maybe it's just such a juxtaposition from how things are normally done in the state of MN but it certainly gives the impression that they wanted to change their regional and now national perception and they know how to get it done. It's one of my biggest concerns with the U competing against them in 5-6 years in terms of NIL, the U will drag their feet and UST doesn't seem to.

I think that sort of ability to get things done gives the perception that they have money, probably more money than they really do.
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I think paying athletes as employees will stop any gain by ST. And I believe that is right around the corner. Will kill the non P2 schools everywhere.
 

march madness said:
Most starting 5's have role players?

His role is to make non-challenged 3 pointers, open 2's, finish on breaks. Not try to create off the dribble and stop ball movement, not to go one on one against quicker players. With two great guards he has embraced his role well.
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I wish Battle had a post up game? We had no counter when other teams put a quick little guard on him.
 



Gopher_In_NYC said:
6-4 now.

Will be interesting to see how year2 ends up comparing to year 1.

Correct me I’m wrong, but aren’t most small private Catholic schools the only D1 scholarship school on their market?

Like Marquette & Villanova?
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UW Milwaukee is down the road, and the Badgers about an hour away...

I think they just need a bit of prestige- no idea why Marquette is good at bball lol!!
 

NYtoWItoMN said:
UW Milwaukee is down the road, and the Badgers about an hour away...

I think they just need a bit of prestige- no idea why Marquette is good at bball lol!!
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I must have missed that post asking to be corrected if they were wrong - maybe I thought it was sarcasm. Only UConn is not catholic and urban in the BE, and all of them have other D1 programs in their market.
 

march madness said:
I wish Battle had a post up game? We had no counter when other teams put a quick little guard on him.
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It's why you play him with three other guards. Make a post player play him on the perimeter (where he is comfortable and they are uncomfortable) instead of at the basket.
 

Next two games are against teams that are leading their leagues... Might push us up these rankings quite a bit, right?

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 




Bob_Loblaw said:
So maybe it's just such a juxtaposition from how things are normally done in the state of MN but it certainly gives the impression that they wanted to change their regional and now national perception and they know how to get it done. It's one of my biggest concerns with the U competing against them in 5-6 years in terms of NIL, the U will drag their feet and UST doesn't seem to.

I think that sort of ability to get things done gives the perception that they have money, probably more money than they really do.
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Having worked at public and private educational institutions, I'd say that's a typical contrast between the two. In general, public institutions are far more bureaucratic with various layers of approval and multiple committees getting involved in even fairly minor proposals while private institutions are leaner and quicker from proposal to decision to implementation. I would say that public institutions in Minnesota might be even more that way than average. Remember that public institutions also have multiple layers of management and approval outside of the institution (i.e., system wide management and the legislature).
 
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Any word on Dawson and the ankle? Was optimistic at first, but after seeing how long a couple NBA guys took to return from a sprained ankle, pessimism set in. Realize there are degrees. Hopefully his wasn’t too bad.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
It's why you play him with three other guards. Make a post player play him on the perimeter (where he is comfortable and they are uncomfortable) instead of at the basket.
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You could but he wasn't a good rebounder or help defender.
 


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