GopherLady STrib blog: Is the Gopher Basketball fan base too old?

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Nicely done, GL. Positive solutions to the "problem." As I would now be in the old category of fan, I need to respond. I really believe the atmosphere in the Barn has been hurt much more by the in house commercials than the make up of the crowd. Those timeout adds are rally killers.

Your idea about the adjustment of the student section is excellent. As the team gets better, so will the crowd. Since we have had this conversation before, I won't belabor it, but if the U posted an etiquette list that encouraged standing at appropriate times, it might help as well.
 

Good post, GL. The recent grad section is a very pressing need. I don't see the Maturi Administration doing it though. They are very proud of spending the exact amount they take in, and this would cost some small $$ short-term.
 

Great post, GL - ever the solutions lady!
I agree with Holy Man - the ads are a real crowd energy killer
 

Good post G.L. I was one of the old folks in Puerto Rico. I assure you these people screamed and yell through all three games. These where among the most loyal and enthusiastic of the older fan base. But,from my seat at the barn I see that many of the fans never leave their seats. They don't all have gray hair.

I have long said that the students should get better seats, from the first row to the last row where they can stand through the game and give their support, without disturbing anyone. Still, I have heard people on this board say they take pride in standing with their " butts in the faces" of older fans that lack that kind of energy.

In this case we have to weigh callous disregard for others against the need to give this kind of support to the team. If the people in front of me stand and yell, I stand and yell, as do those behind me. But, if I where asked to sit down, I would sit down. there is no need for common manners to disappear because we want to win the game. Better to sit and yell.
 


Holy Man said:
Nicely done, GL. Positive solutions to the "problem." As I would now be in the old category of fan, I need to respond. I really believe the atmosphere in the Barn has been hurt much more by the in house commercials than the make up of the crowd. Those timeout adds are rally killers.

Your idea about the adjustment of the student section is excellent. As the team gets better, so will the crowd. Since we have had this conversation before, I won't belabor it, but if the U posted an etiquette list that encouraged standing at appropriate times, it might help as well.
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Exactly. The 'fakeness' of crappy recorded music played through a sound system that's lacking, along with the advertisements, just kills the life out of the games.
 

Excellent job Nadine!!!

I didn't want to comment on awag's last article because it's the same argument over and over. I am always in the 2nd row in the Student Section, and it is by far the loudest section...

Heck, at the Virginia game, there was a lady KNITTING!!!

It was quite ridiculous behavior for someone at a college basketball game as intense as that one.

I would love to have the sidelines be reserved for students, but I doubt the athletic department would go for that. You gave some great ideas for keeping the recent graduates involved with the program. I hope they take them into effect.

Awesome job GL!
 

Thanks GL. As a former member of the band I can appreciate the wording that the band is "not allowed" to be as rowdy as the students. Some of the most hardcore fans are in the band, but due to the U getting some sort of money for showing "good sportsmanship" or whatever, the members of the band aren't allowed to do much of anything on free throws or other situations. Nice work.
 

The recent grads thing is a good thought, but completely idiotic from a u of m budget perspective.
 



I struggle with the fans are "too old" angle. Don't we all aspire to be loyal, long-time gopher fans. I am 44 and have had season tickets for 21 years. I hope to have them for at least 21 more. I don't stand the whole game, but I can get loud. Not as loud as I once was with my voice, but I can whistle pretty damn good and my clapping is annoyingly emphatic. I do stand during big points of a game. I also stand when I see a big play coming or after one has just happened. Is there just a licensing test we could take to prove our passion and allow us in the building :)?
 

So all of you old farts should stop going to the games.

Well, she goes on to say that it's not really a problem with age. So, then, why bring it up at all? And as for using Puerto Rico as part of your evidence, well, of course, who's got the time to fly down there for a couple days?

I think she is on to a problem, sure, but the presentation just undermines what she's trying to say. Age indeed.
 

PR

I was one of the fans that traveled to PR. My wife and I are in our late 30's and we were definitely younger than most. However, I must take offense to those complaining (bitching more like it) that the PR crowd was too old.

Buy a F'ing plane ticket and stop you moaning. Otherwise, don't complain. WV and UNC had the same amount of old folks at the game, but WOW, they also had their young fans there as well. I rode taxi's with many of them. They were not part of some large group shuttled in by their school. They were fans who 1) planned ahead, 2) save money and 3) Made the trip a priority.

Attendance in PR is not correlated to seating at the barn. It is correlated to the fact that Dan Monson killed a whole generation of young fans from being interested. The Monson era Gopher fans should be in a career now and have some money to spend, yet they don't..

Blame Monson, not our old fans.

PS- it was a good artile Nadine.. not directed at you.. as the barn needs to wake up!
 

Remember, the alternative to becoming an "older" Gopher fan is becoming a dead Gopher fan . . .
 



I do agree that the problem is more "corporate" than age related. Also, as a very recent alumni that is cherishing my last season in the student section, I would love the idea of the "recent alumni" section!!! Nadine, is there any way you could have an influence on the higher ups to getting this done?!?

If we want to see improvement, something has to be done with the seating arrangement. LIke many have mentioned, people want to stand up but people behind them b*tch and complain. If we could have both end lines "standing" seats aka benches, that would definitely help. People would be able to stand without being hollered at!

Personally, I think it is most fun when we get everyone standing....I get chills when it happens! Too bad it doesn't happen very often....:(
 

I totally challenge your Dan Monson bash...it was clem haskin's tragic cheating...

and the NCAA "near death" penalty that came about ENTIRELY because of clem haskin's tragic cheating that very nearly killed the Men's Hoops Program at the U of M. It gutted the spirit at the BARN. It brought on all kinds of sanctions, losses of scholarships and even restricted the recruiting visits that could be offered. His realization that the NCAA meant business and sent a SEVERE warning to The University of Minnesota Men's Basketball Program is one of the few things I respect badger joel maturi for in his position as ad at the U. The U of M Hoops Men's Program became the poster-child case depicting possibly the WORST academic fraud basketball scandal in the modern history of the NCAA. And it still impacts the basketball program today. There is ZERO room for error with any questionable situation today. The nightmare of last season regarding players not being granted elegibility to play until all legal questions were resolved was directly related to the way clem haskins had cheated and utilized academic fraud to win basketball games. There is NO room for further error.

You say Monson wrecked things Rouser? Are you trying to revise history?????? It was haskins...it was the haskin's scandal. THAT is what killed the atmosphere in the BARN. That is, was and ALWAYS will be the driving force for EVERY move the Men's Hoops Program at the University of Minnesota has made ever since the time bomb went off in 1999, as clem was taken off the plane as it was headed to an NCAA tourney game. At that tourney, he coached his last game and lost to Gonzaga. Dan Monson was then hired. He was brought into an impossible situation with all the NCAA scandal...loss of scholarships...abandoned games...recruiting restrictions and sanctions and all the hatred of the college basketball world directed at our Gopher's Men's Hoops Program, locally and nationally. When it all started going down in 1999 it was the beginning of the end for business as usual at the BARN. Nothing has ever been the same...and it had better NEVER be business as usual for the Men's Hoops Program at the U of M. The haskins scandal put an end to that. The NCAA will forever be incredibly watchful as it insures that this haskinized academic fraud does NOT repeat itself at this institution.

And we Gopher Fans need to NEVER forget who it was and what it was that brought the BARN to it's knees. IF you try to sugar-coat the history, you just may repeat the history. And, IF there is ever another scandal at the U of M, OR loss of institutional control, the NCAA will bring it's wrath swiftly and severely down on the perpetrating athletic department. The U of M Hoops Program has two strikes against it...mussleman, the madison incident (loss of institutional control) and finally the haskin's scandal created an "end of the line" situation for the Men's Hoops Program.
 


Rouser said:
I was one of the fans that traveled to PR. My wife and I are in our late 30's and we were definitely younger than most. However, I must take offense to those complaining (bitching more like it) that the PR crowd was too old.

Buy a F'ing plane ticket and stop you moaning. Otherwise, don't complain. WV and UNC had the same amount of old folks at the game, but WOW, they also had their young fans there as well. I rode taxi's with many of them. They were not part of some large group shuttled in by their school. They were fans who 1) planned ahead, 2) save money and 3) Made the trip a priority.

Attendance in PR is not correlated to seating at the barn. It is correlated to the fact that Dan Monson killed a whole generation of young fans from being interested. The Monson era Gopher fans should be in a career now and have some money to spend, yet they don't..

Blame Monson, not our old fans.
PS- it was a good artile Nadine.. not directed at you.. as the barn needs to wake up!
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Good grief. Fans still blaming Monson for the pathetic atmosphere at the arena???? He didnt get it done at MN. Obvious.

Blame Monson 4 years after he is gone, and not one word about the current coaches responsibility???

Weak. In fact, less than weak.

What about the constant turmoil and the police blotter during the Smith regime??

Thats right, the sacred cow.
 

imthewalrus said:
and the NCAA "near death" penalty that came about ENTIRELY because of clem haskin's tragic cheating that very nearly killed the Men's Hoops Program at the U of M. It gutted the spirit at the BARN. It brought on all kinds of sanctions, losses of scholarships and even restricted the recruiting visits that could be offered. His realization that the NCAA meant business and sent a SEVERE warning to The University of Minnesota Men's Basketball Program is one of the few things I respect badger joel maturi for in his position as ad at the U. The U of M Hoops Men's Program became the poster-child case depicting possibly the WORST academic fraud basketball scandal in the modern history of the NCAA. And it still impacts the basketball program today. There is ZERO room for error with any questionable situation today. The nightmare of last season regarding players not being granted elegibility to play until all legal questions were resolved was directly related to the way clem haskins had cheated and utilized academic fraud to win basketball games. There is NO room for further error.

You say Monson wrecked things Rouser? Are you trying to revise history?????? It was haskins...it was the haskin's scandal. THAT is what killed the atmosphere in the BARN. That is, was and ALWAYS will be the driving force for EVERY move the Men's Hoops Program at the University of Minnesota has made ever since the time bomb went off in 1999, as clem was taken off the plane as it was headed to an NCAA tourney game. At that tourney, he coached his last game and lost to Gonzaga. Dan Monson was then hired. He was brought into an impossible situation with all the NCAA scandal...loss of scholarships...abandoned games...recruiting restrictions and sanctions and all the hatred of the college basketball world directed at our Gopher's Men's Hoops Program, locally and nationally. When it all started going down in 1999 it was the beginning of the end for business as usual at the BARN. Nothing has ever been the same...and it had better NEVER be business as usual for the Men's Hoops Program at the U of M. The haskins scandal put an end to that. The NCAA will forever be incredibly watchful as it insures that this haskinized academic fraud does NOT repeat itself at this institution.

And we Gopher Fans need to NEVER forget who it was and what it was that brought the BARN to it's knees. IF you try to sugar-coat the history, you just may repeat the history. And, IF there is ever another scandal at the U of M, OR loss of institutional control, the NCAA will bring it's wrath swiftly and severely down on the perpetrating athletic department. The U of M Hoops Program has two strikes against it...mussleman, the madison incident (loss of institutional control) and finally the haskin's scandal created an "end of the line" situation for the Men's Hoops Program.
Click to expand...

Please.. The days of using the santions has passed, that ship sailed. Perhaps the first 2 or 3 years after, but 7! Pahhlease! Did the sanction recruit what's his name (the bulk of Monson's recruits were "what's his name"). Monson killed anything the scandal did not.. don't even try to argue he did not. If so, you didn't attend games before AND after the scandal. I did and witnessed the slow death myself.
 

In the first few years after the destruction of the program...

by the NCAA so that the U of M could pay for the sins of the haskin's scandal, who in their right mind was going to come and play on an NCAA sanctioned "near death" sentenced men's hoops program IF they had any other options at all?????????

Sorry...the stench coming from the haskin's scandal was SO bad that they might just as well have killed the program off for five years. In essence, they had killed the program. It was intense. It was all over. It was going to be water torture every step of the way. Actually, when Monson brought his team into any kind of post-season play, it was pretty amazing.

The intent of the NCAA was to slowly kill anything and everything about the Gopher Men's Hoops Program...and they are darn good at doing that. And, they did that. And, the U of M Men's Hoops Program deserved that because of what haskins had premeditated, and then DID for all those seasons. He had set up a fifedom designed to break rules. He had NO respect for the program, for the student athletes and for the spirit and soul of the University of Minnesota as an academic institution.

You think everything goes away just because some fans are ready for things to go back to business as normal?

The last three seasons (under Coach Smith are even further removed from the scandal. Do you think he EVER would have considered coming here two or three years after the haskin's scandal? ) There STILL is NO room for error.

Go ahead and say his name, Rouser. haskins. He tore this program down...with the assistance of mussleman and the lack of institutional control during the dutcher era. Any coach who has EVER failed to be the keeper of the NCAA rules and regulations re: academics, recruiting or institutional control was right there in assisting haskins bring the U of M's BARN down. Every other coach since then...Monson and now Smith have had to pay for those sins of long ago and far away.

But, we Gopher fans had better NEVER forget what we have seen go wrong. We must demand only the HIGHEST regard for honoring all the rules and regulations. Wins tainted by scandal and lack of institutional control and lack of academic integrity can be thrown out the window and down the drain. Being able to have an NCAA Division I Men's Hoops Program is a privilige and NOT a right. IF a program breaks the rules there will be a very heavy price to pay. IF you want to know what went wrong with the BARN...look no further than mussleman, the madison incident/mitch lee problem and the haskin's scandal. The problems started there. The NCAA had the last word. Things will never be quite the same. These transgressions marked "the end of the innocence" for the University of Minnesota Men's Basketball Program. There is a mighty long, very narrow and very straight path for the program to take as a direct result of these offenses. The BARN is still feeling the effects of what has happened. It still doesn't sell out consistantly. There is a very good reason why. Take the high road...ALWAYS take the high road.
 

Rouser said:
I was one of the fans that traveled to PR. My wife and I are in our late 30's and we were definitely younger than most. However, I must take offense to those complaining (bitching more like it) that the PR crowd was too old.

Buy a F'ing plane ticket and stop you moaning. Otherwise, don't complain. WV and UNC had the same amount of old folks at the game, but WOW, they also had their young fans there as well. I rode taxi's with many of them. They were not part of some large group shuttled in by their school. They were fans who 1) planned ahead, 2) save money and 3) Made the trip a priority.

Attendance in PR is not correlated to seating at the barn. It is correlated to the fact that Dan Monson killed a whole generation of young fans from being interested. The Monson era Gopher fans should be in a career now and have some money to spend, yet they don't..
Blame Monson, not our old fans.

PS- it was a good artile Nadine.. not directed at you.. as the barn needs to wake up!
Click to expand...

This is true. I don't understand those who blame the lack of noise on ads during timeouts or the seating chart. Fifteen years ago, if someone hit a three-point shot to break a tie late in the game against a top-10 team, the noise would've been ear-splitting for the entire ensuring defensive possession. Now, Al Nolen hits a three against Purdue, there's a big roar for a few seconds, then mostly silence. No ads playing at that time to blame it on. Everybody in every part of the areana is allowed to make noise, but few do.

I really think that started when Monson's early teams would hit a big shot, the crowd would cheer for the entire defensive possession, only to watch the opponent score. Every time. And as the years wore on, the number of opportunities to get loud decreased. We forgot how to do it.
 

BarnBurner said:
Good grief. Fans still blaming Monson for the pathetic atmosphere at the arena???? He didnt get it done at MN. Obvious.

Blame Monson 4 years after he is gone, and not one word about the current coaches responsibility???

Weak. In fact, less than weak.

What about the constant turmoil and the police blotter during the Smith regime??

Thats right, the sacred cow.
Click to expand...

None of it is his fault.
 

Rosemountian said:
The recent grads thing is a good thought, but completely idiotic from a u of m budget perspective.
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How is selling recent grads seats in the student section (which isn't sold out) for more money than the regular students pay a bad business decision? Because that was what GL was suggesting.

She also suggested selling recent grads unsold season tickets elsewhere in the building. While technically cheaper than the normal seats, they'd be filling seats that are currently unsold. So I'm not sure where the loss of revenue is on that one either...
 

Watching the game on tv.
Have to agree with everything Nadine said. It looks like Sunday church for a bunch of Lutherans.
That lower level is comatose.
 

Rouser said:
Please.. The days of using the santions has passed, that ship sailed. Perhaps the first 2 or 3 years after, but 7! Pahhlease! Did the sanction recruit what's his name (the bulk of Monson's recruits were "what's his name"). Monson killed anything the scandal did not.. don't even try to argue he did not. If so, you didn't attend games before AND after the scandal. I did and witnessed the slow death myself.
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The days of Monson have long passed. That ship sailed over 4 years ago.

Have been at Williams for 16 years. I have witnessed it all. Monson did not succeed. Thus far, Tubby has not won any more games in the NCAA tournament that Monson did.

And the Barn atmosphere is on Tubby at this point in time, and has been for 4 seasons.

Blame Monson.... nice try.
 

I'm one who agrees that the problem is that there's a self-suppressing element to the crowd. It's the same reason I stopped going to Timberwolves games - you stand up and yell and the people in front of you turn around and look at you like you're crazy and the people behind you complain that they can't see.
 

Maybe the people just can't see with you standing in front of them and maybe you do look like your crazy to them. Don't the people sitting behind you have a right to look at you like you're crazy when they can't see because of what you are doing? It's a two way street. It does work both ways. It's a real problem. Once in a while is one thing, but, do you really want to be responsible for blocking someone's view of the game just because you want to do what you want to do when ever and as often as you want to do it. Do you have that right? That person bought their ticket and you bought your ticket. What about a code of ticket buyer's rights and responsibilities. Everyone has some rights in a sports arena. No one should have their entire experience ruined. It's a real problem. Eveybody's right...everybody's wrong. It's a stiuation that no one can win and everyone will lose. Tough spot to be in. It is a real problem. I think you have to "...give a little....take a little....that's the story of...that's the glory of..." the BARN!
 

imthewalrus said:
Maybe the people just can't see with you standing in front of them.........It's a real problem. Once in a while is one thing, but, do you really want to be responsible for blocking someone's view of the game just because you want to do what you want to do when ever and as often as you
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You don't need to stand up to be loud.

I sit the majority of the time, for the very reasons you give. I will leap out of my seat to applaud a big play or stand for an important possession, but for the most part, I find it just as easy to scream and yell while seated. And the folks behind me aren't forced to stand in order to see, which is quite irritating to some.

If you are a student, that's cool, you have your own section and everyone expects you to stand.

I have to say, I watched a lot of the games on TV since this topic exploded (again) and as far as I can tell, students stand up and non-students don't.
 

Actually, I've been attending major sporting events with some frequency since I was five years old in 1979 (Twins v Angels at the old Met) and I am acquainted with proper sporting etiquette. I do know when to stand up and when to sit down, and when to yell or whistle or chant or razz or clam up. The thing is, the normal etiquette doesn't apply at a Wolves or Gophers basketball game. That's my point, as one who does know when to stay seated and when to be quiet; at Target Center and Williams Arena it seems that there's never a right time to be excited.

But thanks anyway for the advice.
 

everybody knows my name said:
Actually, I've been attending major sporting events with some frequency since I was five years old in 1979 (Twins v Angels at the old Met) and I am acquainted with proper sporting etiquette. I do know when to stand up and when to sit down, and when to yell or whistle or chant or razz or clam up. The thing is, the normal etiquette doesn't apply at a Wolves or Gophers basketball game. That's my point, as one who does know when to stay seated and when to be quiet; at Target Center and Williams Arena it seems that there's never a right time to be excited.

But thanks anyway for the advice.
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If it is indeed as you describe, then eff 'em. Since you and I "understand" how to be a fan in the sit-down climate that is The Barn, then it's our right to do what we want, within those boundaries. The woman next to me tonight - who was quiet as a churchmouse the entire game - thought I was crazy.

And I didn't care.
 

BarnBurner said:
The days of Monson have long passed. That ship sailed over 4 years ago.

Have been at Williams for 16 years. I have witnessed it all. Monson did not succeed. Thus far, Tubby has not won any more games in the NCAA tournament that Monson did.

And the Barn atmosphere is on Tubby at this point in time, and has been for 4 seasons.

Blame Monson.... nice try.
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Did you attend games during Monson's last two years? Obviously not. While the Barn is not near the Clem years, its 100% better than Monson's last years. It was half full! As a season ticket holder throught the Monson years, you cannot even compare the barn during his last years and now. We have a lot of room to improve, but its not even close. Also, my comments were about PR for God's sake. So the fact we didn't get better attendance in PR is because of Tubby's police blotter team, or what reason? Its because a generation of fans that should now have disposable income witnessed a team that made the tourney 1 year out of 7. Pretty sure the students now will be much more attached to the Gophers when they graduate and beyond.
 

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