GopherHole's Sports Huddle Summary: Coach Jerry Kill - 1/13/13

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ruppertflywheel said:
How do you consider 21 kids a small class? Coach Kill said they would ink 17-18 kids and go 3 over
due to transfers, early graduation, etc.
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Your the one complaining about the class ranking at 69th with 14 kids committed. It will not be 69th if we get to 21 commits.
 

Doll never said 60s would get the team to the Rosebowl in yr 5. the onus is not on him.
 

ruppertflywheel said:
Same as the Boise State situation. Look at the conference they were in. Tell you what Dips, put some money where your mouth is. If Coach Kill continues to have top 60 classes into his 5th year bolster your confidence and tell me they will be in the Rose Bowl. Talk is cheap son. Talk to the hand, the face don't hear you. Have a nice day in what seems to be a shallow, condescending life for you.
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I never said they could or would do it. I'm just saying it's not impossible, contrary to what you have stated. TCU disproves your "point". I'm quite certain that the Northwestern recruiting classes leading up to their Rose Bowl appearances in the 90s would've been terrible by Rivals standards as well. Don't get salty because you made a terrible post with a terrible "point". Lower rated recruiting classes make it more difficult, but certainly not impossible. That's what some on here don't seem to grasp.
 

nsmike said:
Your the one complaining about the class ranking at 69th with 14 kids committed. It will not be 69th if we get to 21 commits.
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Again, selective reading. I said if by his 5th year his classes rank that high it will be hard
To be above .500 in the expanded B1G. This is not a complaint, it is a "point"
Period, end of story.
 

dpodoll68 said:
I never said they could or would do it. I'm just saying it's not impossible, contrary to what you have stated. TCU disproves your "point". I'm quite certain that the Northwestern recruiting classes leading up to their Rose Bowl appearances in the 90s would've been terrible by Rivals standards as well. Don't get salty because you made a terrible post with a terrible "point". Lower rated recruiting classes make it more difficult, but certainly not impossible. That's what some on here don't seem to grasp.
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Where did I say it was impossible? What I'm saying it is improbable and I'm
willing to state a prediction after the 5th year if the rankings remain that high
We will not be moving past .500. You're giving me "pie in the sky" example of
TCU who had a banner year in a mediocre conference. Northwestern had some pretty
good recruiting classes under Barnett when they got to the Rose Bowl. Jeez, Doll, show some balls
and address the Gopher situation at year 5 and make a prediction. That is all the OP was intended to be.
 


ruppertflywheel said:
Where did I say it was impossible?
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Right here:

ruppertflywheel said:
Top 60's classes don't equate to Rose Bowls.
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Obviously, they sometimes do. You were wrong. If you meant to say "improbable", then say it. What you did was make an absolute statement, were called out on it being incorrect, and now you're whining. Either man up and stand behind your statement, or admit you were wrong. Either way, quit whining.

I'm not in the predictions game. Generally, they make you look stupid. Your posts in this thread a case in point.
 

Whooooo Boy, GH Admin... Do I detect a pi$$ing contest coming? Or is already game on in this thread?
 

Dr. you can put away the sample cup cuz this battle is over. Rupp is on the mat and needs to tap out. I was once embroiled in a prediction battle with doll. I lost.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Right here:



Obviously, they sometimes do. You were wrong. If you meant to say "improbable", then say it. What you did was make an absolute statement, were called out on it being incorrect, and now you're whining. Either man up and stand behind your statement, or admit you were wrong. Either way, quit whining.

I'm not in the predictions game. Generally, they make you look stupid. Your posts in this thread a case in point.
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"equate and impossible," same meaning? Do you own a newer version of Webster's I'm not familiar with? BTW, Dipster TCU finished 4-5 in the Big 12 and 7-6 overall; losing to a very average MSU team in their bowl game.That was with their last two classes in the top 40. If you believed in what you were spewing you would man up and make a "prediction" This is the internet Dipster,it is not a life threatning situation. Your problem is you would melt like the wicked witch if your wrong. I said earlier this year that Becky would lose on the road to Oregon State. If I had been wrong, so be it. " Dipster, " Yes tomorrow is another day"
 



ruppertflywheel said:
"equate and impossible," same meaning? Do you own a newer version of Webster's I'm not familiar with? BTW, Dipster TCU finished 4-5 in the Big 12 and 7-6 overall; losing to a very average MSU team in their bowl game.That was with their last two classes in the top 40. If you believed in what you were spewing you would man up and make a "prediction" This is the internet Dipster,it is not a life threatning situation. Your problem is you would melt like the wicked witch if your wrong. I said earlier this year that Becky would lose on the road to Oregon State. If I had been wrong, so be it. " Dipster, " Yes tomorrow is another day"
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You're an imbecile. Nothing I said had anything to do with making predictions. Your initial statement was false, and provably so. Get over it, lick your wounds, and move on. Stop whining.
 

dpodoll68 said:
You're an imbecile. Nothing I said had anything to do with making predictions. Your initial statement was false, and provably so. Get over it, lick your wounds, and move on. Stop whining.
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mind
dpodoll68: "A legend in his own mind".. and starting a new version of Webster's.Annnd ma boy, the wound licking is on your part. You
haven't been this beatup since somebody put a banana in your fly and turned a monkey loose. Cheers!
 

ruppertflywheel said:
mind
dpodoll68: "A legend in his own mind".. and starting a new version of Webster's.Annnd ma boy, the wound licking is on your part. You
haven't been this beatup since somebody put a banana in your fly and turned a monkey loose. Cheers!
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Stick to making posts about the ratio of Gopher gear to Vikings gear you see among the retirees in Crosslake. That type of post seems to be more your speed.
 

TIME OUT!!!!!!!!



As I recall, this thread started out discussing Kill's comments on the Sports Huddle - and got sidetracked onto yet another pointless argument about class ratings. (or, if Wren was still here, "Fantasy HS Star ratings.")

Look - nobody ever won a game, let along a league title, based on class rankings. Now, in general, teams with higher-rated recruiting classes tend to have more success than team with lower-rated classes, but there are exceptions. And that is assuming you accept the validity of the groups doing the rankings. If the rankings were so freakin' important, you wouldn't have to play the games - just add up the average rating for each team, and award the victory to the higher-rated team.

I have a radical suggestion - let the season play out and see who's more successful.

One more thought - If the Gophs receive a favorable rating, most people on this board are thrilled. But, if the Gophs receive a low rating, then many of those same people quickly proclaim that the ratings don't matter, because Kill will "coach them up." You can't have it both ways - either the class rankings matter, or they don't.
 



ruppertflywheel said:
How do you consider 21 kids a small class? Coach Kill said they would ink 17-18 kids and go 3 over
due to transfers, early graduation, etc.
Click to expand...


From my math, it'll be around 18 WITH the 3 additional recruits due to attrition.

But for the sake of argument, lets assume you're right. 21 is still a relatively small class. Keep in mind that every school has quite a bit of attrition (not as much as us, but some). Our class last year was 27, in 2011 it was 26, in 2010 we had 26, etc. So it's not shockingly low, but it's certainly a small enough class to alter the ratings significantly.

For instance, Illinois currently has the 4th ranked class with 26 commits at 2.8 star avg (I realize more goes into the rankings). MN is 11th at 14 at 2.8, Purdue is 12th with 12 at 2.8, Michigan State is 9th at 15 at 3.1.

My point...the number of recruits matters if you really like those rankings and even a small variance (3-7 recruits) could have a big impact.
 


Bob_Loblaw said:
From my math, it'll be around 18 WITH the 3 additional recruits due to attrition.

But for the sake of argument, lets assume you're right. 21 is still a relatively small class. Keep in mind that every school has quite a bit of attrition (not as much as us, but some). Our class last year was 27, in 2011 it was 26, in 2010 we had 26, etc. So it's not shockingly low, but it's certainly a small enough class to alter the ratings significantly.

For instance, Illinois currently has the 4th ranked class with 26 commits at 2.8 star avg (I realize more goes into the rankings). MN is 11th at 14 at 2.8, Purdue is 12th with 12 at 2.8, Michigan State is 9th at 15 at 3.1.

My point...the number of recruits matters if you really like those rankings and even a small variance (3-7 recruits) could have a big impact.
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Once a class reaches 20, the quantity doesn't matter because they only use your top 20 players for team rankings anyway:

http://footballrecruiting.rivals.com/content.asp?SID=880&CID=1364602

Theoretically, they would give you bonuses if your 21st-ranked player is in the Rivals 250, but I highly doubt a single school will ever have that many ranked so highly, so it's almost certainly a moot point.
 

Parski1 said:
Question then....What would be more accurate than Rivals? Scout or ESPN? Heck, Scout still has Nate Andrews listed as a "Soft Verbal".
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Honestly, I seriously doubt any of these are very accurate. I know they don't have staff in every state and mostly focus on a handful of states (Fla,Tx,Ca,Pa,Oh), the rest they rely on coaches and local media, or kids that are invited for Jr Day visits to top football programs for information on players. I do not know how they determine a 3 star from a 4 star recruit, considering that they don't really track players outside of their "top 300", nor have they ever seen most of the players in person or on video.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
TIME OUT!!!!!!!!



As I recall, this thread started out discussing Kill's comments on the Sports Huddle - and got sidetracked onto yet another pointless argument about class ratings. (or, if Wren was still here, "Fantasy HS Star ratings.")

Look - nobody ever won a game, let along a league title, based on class rankings. Now, in general, teams with higher-rated recruiting classes tend to have more success than team with lower-rated classes, but there are exceptions. And that is assuming you accept the validity of the groups doing the rankings. If the rankings were so freakin' important, you wouldn't have to play the games - just add up the average rating for each team, and award the victory to the higher-rated team.

I have a radical suggestion - let the season play out and see who's more successful.

One more thought - If the Gophs receive a favorable rating, most people on this board are thrilled. But, if the Gophs receive a low rating, then many of those same people quickly proclaim that the ratings don't matter, because Kill will "coach them up." You can't have it both ways - either the class rankings matter, or they don't.
Click to expand...

+ 1 Billion!

But you are wasting your time Shorty. Surely you must understand that scores and gadzilliion GH-ers get their rocks off going over Rivals ratings?

Where is Wren when we need him?
 

Bayfieldgopher said:
+ 1 Billion!

But you are wasting your time Shorty. Surely you must understand that scores and gadzilliion GH-ers get their rocks off going over Rivals ratings?

Where is Wren when we need him?
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I have heard that he is now a special advisor to Norwood Teague.
 

I spoke with a friend of mine today that works directly with Rivals and he told me that "they will change a 2 star to 4 stars if they are unable to get the number of top recruits to play in one of their "Top 100" games. He also said that will increase a recruits rating if he has a paid profile, gets invited to play in the Under Armour or Army HS game. His other comment was "Rivals ratings are as unscientific as they come".

This friend is well connected in the SEC and has his finger directly on the pulse of high school football across the country. His final comment to me was "most of these websites like Rivals, operate off of hype, so people shouldn't take what they post too seriously".
 

EliteHSscout said:
I spoke with a friend of mine today that works directly with Rivals and he told me that "they will change a 2 star to 4 stars if they are unable to get the number of top recruits to play in one of their "Top 100" games. He also said that will increase a recruits rating if he has a paid profile, gets invited to play in the Under Armour or Army HS game. His other comment was "Rivals ratings are as unscientific as they come".

This friend is well connected in the SEC and has his finger directly on the pulse of high school football across the country. His final comment to me was "most of these websites like Rivals, operate off of hype, so people shouldn't take what they post too seriously".
Click to expand...

You and your friend are free to think whatever you want, but the correlations don't lie.
 



dpodoll68 said:
You and your friend are free to think whatever you want, but the correlations don't lie.
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This isn't opinion, these are facts, based on personal experience and dealing directly with them. You can choose to believe everything that Rivals spits out, but they are owned by Yahoo and are much more interested in making money than accuracy.
 

EliteHSscout said:
This isn't opinion, these are facts, based on personal experience and dealing directly with them. You can choose to believe everything that Rivals spits out, but they are owned by Yahoo and are much more interested in making money than accuracy.
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Damn capitalists!!:p
 

EliteHSscout said:
...I spoke with a friend of mine today...He said they (Rivals) will increase a recruits rating if he...gets invited to play in the Under Armour or Army HS game...
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Sounds rather logical to me.

Those high school all-star games are generally loaded with studs, who deserve a high ranking.

Nowadays, the Michael Floyds and Seantrel Hendersons who populate the all-star game rosters, and who become college freshmen contributors/starters at the biggest of the big-time programs, should be the high 4 and 5 star guys.
 

dpodoll68 said:
You and your friend are free to think whatever you want, but the correlations don't lie.
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Correct. A year or two ago, there was a similar argument. I think I found the correlation to be a .578 or .678 between Scout's "points" and number of wins over a four year period. I couldn't find my post when doing a search...sorry for no link.
 

EliteHSscout said:
This isn't opinion, these are facts, based on personal experience and dealing directly with them. You can choose to believe everything that Rivals spits out, but they are owned by Yahoo and are much more interested in making money than accuracy.
Click to expand...

Regardless of the veracity of your friend's claims, which I doubt, there is a vast discrepancy between believing everything they say and completely discrediting everything they say. The truth is in the middle. Again, you can't argue with correlation.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Regardless of the veracity of your friend's claims, which I doubt, there is a vast discrepancy between believing everything they say and completely discrediting everything they say. The truth is in the middle. Again, you can't argue with correlation.
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I didn't say you can completely disregard everything, but you have to take it with a grain of salt. They aren't the end all of rating players, in fact, I would wager that they haven't see all of their "Top 100" in person or on video. Just keep in mind that when it is all said and done, Rivals and Yahoo are about making money and they do that by driving traffic to their websites.
By the way, you can doubt my friend all you want, but he has worked directly with Rivals for a few years, along with the Under Armour Elite 7 on 7 and both the Army and Under Armour game. If anyone knows how these things operate, he does.
It is easy to disregard his opinion, but since you have zero experience with any of these, it should be difficult for you to argue this point.
 

I don't think anyone looks at a recruit's star ranking anyway, and if they do they take it with a grain of salt. To judge a recruit, I always just look at their offer list. Division 1 college coaches are much better judges of talent than Rivals' scouts. And Rivals updates their star ratings for every recruit, what, 3 times per class? I'm pretty sure they don't make any changes whatsoever during the high school season. And Scout and ESPN are even worse.
 

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