Gopherhole's Sports Huddle Recap: Coach P.J. Fleck - 2/19/17

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PMWinSTP said:
I got this same speech from my Dad...35 years ago. When I left for college I knew how to cook, do laundry, grocery shop, etc., and how to treat women. It's called parenting. If I forgot the last one, one of my older sisters would make sure I remembered.

All this stuff he's promoting, and believe me, that's what he is doing, is great. But to make it sound like stuff like this wasn't already going on is silly.

The vast majority of these young men come with a solid foundation. To think otherwise is doing them a great disservice.
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Better safe than sorry though, especially with what's happened.
 

mnsportsgeek said:
You went on a 3 paragraph rant because someone agreed with PJ that things like learning to cook, dressing nicely, and pulling the headphones out of their ears once in a while will teach young adults how to be better fathers, husbands, and employees.

And somehow that makes him a "fleckophile." Whatever that is. It clearly hit a nerve.
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You think that things that I respond to on Gopherhole "hit a nerve"? You just sent a two paragraph response to me saying something isn't a big deal. I am not dumb enough to think you're emotionally invested in this argument.

I'll clue you in, college kids wearing headphones while they workout will never hit a nerve. I will point out when I think people are being silly (like by comparing GPA and APR to going to cooking classes), but I'm not emotionally invested in how good of cooks Josh wants this program to have. I will keep pointing it out though.
 

37score said:
Cooking is an essential to living a healthy lifestyle and being a good dad.
Maybe if you think it's the 1950's, you didn't cook. But it's refreshing to see the culture change at so many levels where these players will be equal partners in a working relationship as parents of the next generation.
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LOL. Ok. Hopefully Fleck sets up some diaper changing classes too. That seems like a fit for the football program.
 

This back-and-forth goes to the bigger issue:

If Fleck said he was having the players take juggling lessons, someone would come on here and proclaim it was a necessary part of the culture change and will move the program forward.
In other words, anything Fleck does is good.

It's his program now - he can do anything he wants. But next season, if the team doesn't play well, all this other stuff doesn't mean squat.

I am NOT saying Fleck is a bad coach. I am NOT saying he's going to fail. I AM saying that I will wait to see what his team looks like ON THE FIELD next year before I can really form an intelligent opinion about what type of a coach he will be at the major conference level.

When the Gophers are protecting a 3-point lead late in the game, and they need to convert a 3rd-and-short to maintain possession, I don't give a bleep whether the left tackle took a cooking class. I do give a bleep whether the left tackle can block the DE and give the RB room to run for a 1st down.
 

joshvanklomp said:
These are more of the underrated parts of the culture change. Better husbands, better fathers, better employees. That last one is why the headphone rule was put into place, if I remember correctly. Similar to the collared shirt rule and keeping your locker organized.

These are things that won't show up in the team's GPA or APR score. But they will show up down the road for these players after college.
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And they will show up in recruiting (parents)
 


short ornery norwegian said:
This back-and-forth goes to the bigger issue:

If Fleck said he was having the players take juggling lessons, someone would come on here and proclaim it was a necessary part of the culture change and will move the program forward.
In other words, anything Fleck does is good.

It's his program now - he can do anything he wants. But next season, if the team doesn't play well, all this other stuff doesn't mean squat.

I am NOT saying Fleck is a bad coach. I am NOT saying he's going to fail. I AM saying that I will wait to see what his team looks like ON THE FIELD next year before I can really form an intelligent opinion about what type of a coach he will be at the major conference level.

When the Gophers are protecting a 3-point lead late in the game, and they need to convert a 3rd-and-short to maintain possession, I don't give a bleep whether the left tackle took a cooking class. I do give a bleep whether the left tackle can block the DE and give the RB room to run for a 1st down.
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Why don't you grab a bottle of Akvavit and some pickled herring and relax. No one is asking you to give a definitive opinion about how the next season plays out. Some of us are enjoying all the changes and we hope they result in more victories.
 

The jokes are writing themselves for the first time a player slips up. Nothing wrong with team building, life skills classes, and motivational speeches and those things can be beneficial but let's be real: young people are overflowing with hormones, short on impulse control and "common sense", and prone to fits of rage and passion. If Fleck can motivate even one guy to reach higher, treat other people with respect, and stay within the law and whatever moral guidelines he sets an example of I think that's great. But, how many different ways can "be the man you'd want your son to become" and "practice the golden rule" be said? Ultimately some of the guys will prove to not be a good fit here, or in society at large. No number of classes, speeches, or good role models will reach "bad seed". And I won't blame Fleck.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
I am NOT saying Fleck is a bad coach. I am NOT saying he's going to fail. I AM saying that I will wait to see what his team looks like ON THE FIELD next year before I can really form an intelligent opinion about what type of a coach he will be at the major conference level.

When the Gophers are protecting a 3-point lead late in the game, and they need to convert a 3rd-and-short to maintain possession, I don't give a bleep whether the left tackle took a cooking class. I do give a bleep whether the left tackle can block the DE and give the RB room to run for a 1st down.
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There's more to life than football.
 

You guys need to lighten up. I work at a place that has a cooking school as part of it's offerings and many times during the year businesses bring their employees in for a cooking class. NOT because it is necessary to run their business, and certainly not because they feel their employees need to be better cooks, but because it is a fun, team-building event. Every single one of these events gets great reviews by all who attend and the business owners are always happy with the results. Not everything that leads to a successful football program, happens on the field of play.
 



Love Fleck. Elite coach, will build Elite men.
 

go4rob said:
You guys need to lighten up. I work at a place that has a cooking school as part of it's offerings and many times during the year businesses bring their employees in for a cooking class. NOT because it is necessary to run their business, and certainly not because they feel their employees need to be better cooks, but because it is a fun, team-building event. Every single one of these events gets great reviews by all who attend and the business owners are always happy with the results. Not everything that leads to a successful football program, happens on the field of play.
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Those that think it's just about cooking are small picture people. Not a visionary in the lot....
 


Never thought I'd see a pissing match about guys learning to cook or headphones but hey it is GH, so I guess I shouldn't be shocked. DL - thanks for the report. It is too bad that your threads turn into ridiculous arguments
 






Some people on here are (I suspect deliberately) missing my point.

Every program in the country does team-building activities of one type or another. Fleck may be promoting his efforts a little more publicly as part of the whole "culture change" initiative. Fine - it's his program - he can do whatever he wants.

But - next season - the Gopher FB program will be judged on what happens on the field - Wins and Losses.
If they win a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will be on here saying they won the game because the players took a cooking class.

And, if they lose a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will care if the players took a cooking class.

This need by some to present everything Fleck does as wonderful and revolutionary just escapes me.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
I'm fine with the change. . . but really? You are comparing academic success with wearing a collared shirt in college and being able to cook? I have no issue with the collared shirt thing, but cooking? Do you think we should put them in sewing classes? Landscaping classes?

A team's GPA and APR is so much more important than any of that stuff. The world is full of extremely successful people who wore a hoodie to college classes. The world is full of kind and successful people who wear headphones when they work out (go to a gym, most of the people doing the MOST work are wearing headphones).

I guess all of this kind of stuff can be a fun team activity, but it's silly to think this stuff generates success. I like some of it (sitting in the front, even the collared shirt thing, I get), but some of it isn't about preparing these guys for stuff down the road.
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Wow. Dressing for success is not some sort of false mantra.

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People wear headphones to work out because they don't want to be bothered, not so the can "concentrate". Football and success are about confidence and communication.

My experience has been that people that brag about getting to dress like a slob at work are usually a slob at work. Just sayin'.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Some people on here are (I suspect deliberately) missing my point.

Every program in the country does team-building activities of one type or another. Fleck may be promoting his efforts a little more publicly as part of the whole "culture change" initiative. Fine - it's his program - he can do whatever he wants.

But - next season - the Gopher FB program will be judged on what happens on the field - Wins and Losses.
If they win a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will be on here saying they won the game because the players took a cooking class.

And, if they lose a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will care if the players took a cooking class.

This need by some to present everything Fleck does as wonderful and revolutionary just escapes me.
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Well stated Shorty.

Fleck is not a magician or an inventor. He is a football coach who, like other, do some interesting things.

Culture this, culture that........do this, do that....etc. Its amazing how many here gobble it up and go over the top. I would much rather see Fleck spend time of football rather than cooking, sewing or whatever.

Like all the other Gopher coaches the past 5 decades, Fleck has a monumental task to elevate the program to the point where it wins big and wins often. Getting his players to do things better on the field is his job. I just hope he has the makings to get it done.
 

Bayfieldgopher said:
Well stated Shorty.

Fleck is not a magician or an inventor. He is a football coach who, like other, do some interesting things.

Culture this, culture that........do this, do that....etc. Its amazing how many here gobble it up and go over the top. I would much rather see Fleck spend time of football rather than cooking, sewing or whatever.

Like all the other Gopher coaches the past 5 decades, Fleck has a monumental task to elevate the program to the point where it wins big and wins often. Getting his players to do things better on the field is his job. I just hope he has the makings to get it done.
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Like stated before, this does impact football via recruiting. Parents will trust Fleck more with their sons if they believe that he is going to take care of their son, and prepare him to be a successful adult. Parents will gobble up the Cooking classes, and making sure their son is in class, and all that other jazz.
 

Taji34 said:
Like stated before, this does impact football via recruiting. Parents will trust Fleck more with their sons if they believe that he is going to take care of their son, and prepare him to be a successful adult. Parents will gobble up the Cooking classes, and making sure their son is in class, and all that other jazz.
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So did they gobble it up when Claeys did it last year? Or just when Fleck does it? As stated above, this is not revolutionary and is likely done by many if not most programs in one fashion or another. Don't think it is that big of a deal.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Some people on here are (I suspect deliberately) missing my point.

Every program in the country does team-building activities of one type or another. Fleck may be promoting his efforts a little more publicly as part of the whole "culture change" initiative. Fine - it's his program - he can do whatever he wants.

But - next season - the Gopher FB program will be judged on what happens on the field - Wins and Losses.
If they win a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will be on here saying they won the game because the players took a cooking class.

And, if they lose a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will care if the players took a cooking class.

This need by some to present everything Fleck does as wonderful and revolutionary just escapes me.
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Agreed.

Biggest thing I take from all the stories being put out now is they are positive/good about U of M football.
There is an excitement around the program that will hopefully transfer to more fans in the stands and then wins will keep them there.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Some people on here are (I suspect deliberately) missing my point.

Every program in the country does team-building activities of one type or another. Fleck may be promoting his efforts a little more publicly as part of the whole "culture change" initiative. Fine - it's his program - he can do whatever he wants.

But - next season - the Gopher FB program will be judged on what happens on the field - Wins and Losses.
If they win a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will be on here saying they won the game because the players took a cooking class.

And, if they lose a big game, I seriously doubt that anyone will care if the players took a cooking class.

This need by some to present everything Fleck does as wonderful and revolutionary just escapes me.
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People get your point. You make it over and over again excessively. Fleck will be judge on wins and losses not some off the field program activities.

Some posters want to buy into everything Fleck does as so be it. Yet for whatever reason that bothers you.
 


scools12 said:
Some posters want to buy into everything Fleck does as so be it. Yet for whatever reason that bothers you.
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Buying into everything Fleck does is great. Sincerely. It's a problem when people act like this is all new and hasn't been done before. Of course, part of that is that they can't just be glad for what we have now - they have to pretend that the previous coach, his results, and everything involved with him was garbage. It's stupid. Culture change!
 

dpodoll68 said:
Buying into everything Fleck does is great. Sincerely. It's a problem when people act like this is all new and hasn't been done before. Of course, part of that is that they can't just be glad for what we have now - they have to pretend that the previous coach, his results, and everything involved with him was garbage. It's stupid. Culture change!
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"culture change" quite the hot button issue on GHole.


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The 'Culture Change' with the team, will be mere tweaks, compared to what needs to happen between the team, the fans, the other students, the University as a whole and the greater community. For the most part, the team has good kids, that work hard and get good grades. There was really only one incident, under the previous staff, but it was a bad one. It will be interesting to see what happens with the next one. Young men being away from home for the first time, will occasionally make bad choices, with eighty five scholarship players plus walk-ons, it's inevitable.
 

I have listened to many PJF interviews. I paid $ to watch him speak in person on signing day. I really enjoy listening to him even if I do roll my eyes from time to time. One thing he has said over and over is some people won't like his approach/sayings/etc. Then he says he is OK with that. He thinks maybe some will later on, and some never will. Then he says he is OK with that. Seems odd that many of his biggest supporters aren't OK with it when PJF himself is.


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Spoofin said:
I have listened to many PJF interviews. I paid $ to watch him speak in person on signing day. I really enjoy listening to him even if I do roll my eyes from time to time. One thing he has said over and over is some people won't like his approach/sayings/etc. Then he says he is OK with that. He thinks maybe some will later on, and some never will. Then he says he is OK with that. Seems odd that many of his biggest supporters aren't OK with it when PJF himself is.
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I don't think it's that Fleck supporters aren't ok with the discomfort with some of the characteristics of his style. I think it's raising it as an issue that most find it as unsupportive. Even if it's not a Gopher fan's preferred style, why not just let it be? If it doesn't end up producing a winning program, then it's totally fair to question it. Why not give it a chance first, at least to the extent of criticizing it publicly, and see if it works for Gopher Football? That's all.
 


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