Game 6 Gophers v Liberty in Cav Classic (11-27-22)

MNGolfer

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You must have missed the Virginia game when she had 5 turnovers. Battle is awesome! but still making freshman mistakes too.
No. I watched every game. Amaya could play it safe and have next to no turnovers. Her role called for her to be aggressive, hence some turnovers I would classify her point guard play as aggressive due to having to initiate scoring. I would classify Katie’s turnovers as due to reckless guard play. Big difference. The top point guards make turnovers. It just is a fact. Lindsay averages just over 3 a game during their final four year. She still was one of the two or three best players in college ball. Amaya will be awesome, but will always get a few turnovers. She needs some freedom or she becomes just an average point guard. Katie makes you hold your breath. 😘
 

MNGolfer

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well yesterday she was attacking the basket for rebounds and had 10.. only had 2 today.. and we really didn't look to run much for her.. so just wondering if her ankle wasn't 100%
It is not an ankle issue. More plantar issue.
 

Ragnor

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No. I watched every game. Amaya could play it safe and have next to no turnovers. Her role called for her to be aggressive, hence some turnovers I would classify her point guard play as aggressive due to having to initiate scoring. I would classify Katie’s turnovers as due to reckless guard play. Big difference. The top point guards make turnovers. It just is a fact. Lindsay averages just over 3 a game during their final four year. She still was one of the two or three best players in college ball. Amaya will be awesome, but will always get a few turnovers. She needs some freedom or she becomes just an average point guard. Katie makes you hold your breath. 😘
I took the post "Battle doesn’t." as meaning Battle literally doesn't or does very little. I don't think hyperbole is particular helpful and is overly critical of Katie in a backhanded way. Maybe that was the goal, I hope not. I think they are both phenomenal talents and have their strengths. I suspect Battle has more upside due to her size but I think they are both awesome!

I think most people know point guards will always get turnovers that is why the metric of assist to turnover was invented. Point guards should have a assist to turnover ratio at least 2:1 and niether Battle or Katie are there over the last 3 games (Battle is at 2.0 on the season due to her tremendous start). In the women's game the top 50 assist to turnover rates range from 8.0-2.44.

Yes, I would agree Katie has had more turnovers due to bad decisions but that will also be easier to improve upon. They both have turned it over too much lately (3 games) based on the 2.0 metric.

Assist/TO over last 3 games

Battle 5/4, 6/5, 5/3

Katie 5/3, 1/7, 5/4
 

MNGolfer

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I took the post "Battle doesn’t." as meaning Battle literally doesn't or does very little. I don't think hyperbole is particular helpful and is overly critical of Katie in a backhanded way. Maybe that was the goal, I hope not. I think they are both phenomenal talents and have their strengths. I suspect Battle has more upside due to her size but I think they are both awesome!

I think most people know point guards will always get turnovers that is why the metric of assist to turnover was invented. Point guards should have a assist to turnover ratio at least 2:1 and niether Battle or Katie are there over the last 3 games (Battle is at 2.0 on the season due to her tremendous start). In the women's game the top 50 assist to turnover rates range from 8.0-2.44.

Yes, I would agree Katie has had more turnovers due to bad decisions but that will also be easier to improve upon. They both have turned it over too much lately (3 games) based on the 2.0 metric.

Assist/TO over last 3 games

Battle 5/4, 6/5, 5/3

Katie 5/3, 1/7, 5/4
I was probably too flippant in my initial response. Sorry about that.

All stats are not equal in that with this one some of it involves who is playing with the point guard. Who runs the floor well, who receives passes (and pocket passes) well, who allows for good spacing intuitively, and who moves without the ball instinctively.

I know these little stats items make for good argument, but as a former high school coach, I trust the eye test. The team is stable with Battle. With Katie there will be highs and a lot of lows until she plays a more controlled game. She goes for the spectacular play when the simple one is required. A good example is the inbounds with 9 seconds to go in the Virginia game. When she is “on”, all is well.

I like both of them. Amaya will be a top college player, and Katie can be a solid player. She just can’t work her “magic” against this level of competition as she did way up north in high school where she was just about a one person team (at least as far as shooting is concerned). I am rooting for her.

As far as the ratio is concerned, if our 3point shooters made more 3pointers from the corner, as Hammond did in the 4th yesterday, Amaya’s asst/to ratio might look pretty good.

Just my opinion.
 

Bfan

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Minnesota game highlights.


 


MNGolfer

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This tweet from Minnesota Women’s Basketball yesterday:

“Just going to put this out there.. @battle_amaya is a STUD 🤩🤩

- No. 1 rebounding freshman in @B1Gwbball (7.2) & No. 9 overall
- No. 1 freshman in B1G assists/game (5.2), No. 5 overall
- 12th overall in AST/T.O. ratio (2.1)
- 10th overall in BLK/game (1.2)
- Averaging 11.3 PPG”
 

Bfan

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Young team. It's exciting to see them play so good so soon. At stretches they looked veteran in the last two games. I thought good stretches in the 2nd half of Virginia was their best yet.

Surely Borowicz, a redshirt freshman, will improve towards performance targets.

To me Borowicz is more of a shooting guard type that looks to generate points. Teams need points. She hits 3's, tied for most 3's on the team and on fewer attempts than Braun, and with a .458 3's percentage. Is 3rd on the team in points, and with a .464 average on field goals. That's a point generator.

Amaya Battle to me is the the point guard of the -- and an ultimate point guard, the kind of player you dream of running the point in a tournament. Battle is just 1 point behind Borowicz. That position takes longer to learn so I think the Battle we see at the start of next season is going to be super exciting, maybe even by the time of the 2023 Big Ten Tournament. Patience.

I like the way the Gophers have substituted. Different looks. I assume Whalen is figuring out what works with all the new players. I like it. The Gophers have also worked themselves out of bad stretches and surged with the game adjustments.

Borowicz seems to substitute out and in to point guard and shooting guard positions. Sometimes Battle and Borowicz play together. I like that.

I'm excited to see what this team will look like next year. It takes time to work things out.

I think handling pressure defense is the one area that's maybe a vulnerability. Minnesota had 22 turnovers against Virginia. I think the rebounding I was previously concerned about looks to be on solid ground. I think the team is gelling on defense overall. Good improvements, adjustments, and continuing to gel.

All the comments made previously have been informative. I wouldn't know those movement, passing, judgement nuances. I love hearing about the deeper game aspects.


I like the contributions from the second wave players the last few games. I like the patience from Whalen as they've seemed to play a little better.

It will really help the team if Gradwell can finish the season with decent averages. We know she can. The first couple games the shots didn't fall in but the last couple were better.
 

tripledouble

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bfan, you've mentioned many times that Gopher fans need to be patient and 'wait til next year'. Although I agree with that, I will also caution Gopher fans to bridle their optimism for next year a bit, as we don't yet know which players we'll have. As we all know, the current transfer portal has changed the game substantially, and, as a result, year-to-year rosters are very fluid and subject to change.The Gopher program itself has provided evidence of this. So, although I'm hoping that this group of players is here to stay (and I think they are), I would caution people to get too excited about next year until we see how this year's team improves and until we know who is on next year's roster. It would be nice if they Gophers could get their roster to a point where the Gopher program would be a desirable destination for coveted transfers.
 

thatjanelpick

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bfan, you've mentioned many times that Gopher fans need to be patient and 'wait til next year'. Although I agree with that, I will also caution Gopher fans to bridle their optimism for next year a bit, as we don't yet know which players we'll have. As we all know, the current transfer portal has changed the game substantially, and, as a result, year-to-year rosters are very fluid and subject to change.The Gopher program itself has provided evidence of this. So, although I'm hoping that this group of players is here to stay (and I think they are), I would caution people to get too excited about next year until we see how this year's team improves and until we know who is on next year's roster. It would be nice if they Gophers could get their roster to a point where the Gopher program would be a desirable destination for coveted transfers.
...and, again, as far as we know the Gophers won't have an actual back-to-the-basket post on the roster next year, either.
 



MNGolfer

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...and, again, as far as we know the Gophers won't have an actual back-to-the-basket post on the roster next year, either.
In two years we will. There is still the transfer portal possibilities for next year.
 

Bfan

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Wouldn't it be great if the Big Ten Tournament was a statement event for the Gophers? Will they be ready and synced by then?

4 freshmen, 1 redshirt freshman, 2 returning sophomores, a few crafty veterans, and some walk ons. I love it. They have what it takes but need to prove it.

Like the tweet today about how Battle works for it.

 




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