Fleck

Donate To GopherHole
Fleck needs to grow as a coach. His constant conservatism has put the team in really bad positions at times. On top of that.....there have been some extremely questionable decisions at times. In this game alone:

-3rd and long.....rushing three on an inexperienced QB and letting him sit around in complete safety until someone gets open and allows for an easy first

-Kicking a 53 yard field goal.....down a point.....when we've had troubles kicking anywhere outside the 40. I get that there is a confidence issue with the offense. But that only backs the idea that the OC is an issue. Third year senior starting QB with the most experienced line in NCAA football.....did Fleck think the offense couldn't get that close again? Outside of a few big plays.....the Iowa offense wasn't moving all that well. How do you not punt the ball there?

-Down eight points and the offense continues to run the play clock 25-30 seconds on every play.....with less than half a quarter to play. Doesn't make any sense. What in the hell is the coaching staff thinking? Does nobody realize that if we don't get the two point conversion.....we are destroying our opportunities? It's pure incompetence. Entire clock management is an issue. Run the playclock down to zero and hope that nothing goes wrong. Whoops....false start because guys are scrambling. Whoops....delay of game. What the hell!?

I still think we are in a better spot than we've been in quite a while.....but Fleck needs to "improve his best".....by a lot. His record in games where we are losing at half says it all. The games against BG and Illinois this year reinforce the issue. The in game coaching is nonexistent. When something isn't working....the coaching staff has no ability....or has an unwillingness....to make changes.

Maybe PJ will be content being a middling to good team. Because the team will never be great if PJ and the staff cannot manage to alter a gameplan that isn't working.
 

stocker08 said:
Blah blah blah blah. Fleck has the program on an upswing that we haven't seen since the early 00's. He's still young and has time to adapt. He needs a better OC around him.
Click to expand...

The problem is that upswing can't be proven with wins or titles. Just by how much a small group of people like him.

I mean are you judging by wins and losses? Fan interest? Rivalry success? Entertaining style of football? I know that the "Fleck Buddies" have their own measuring stick and he is killing by whatever that is, but the fanbase in general may need something more to point to of this success we haven't seen in decades
 
Last edited:

I was just looking at game logs from Zach Terrell's 2016 season.
Most games he threw for 25-30 attempts.

This offense we are running right now is nothing like his 2016 Western Michigan team.
This appears to be an OC issue with PJ not trusting the QB and OC or something else.
 

WoodburyTim said:
The problem is that upswing can't be proven with wins or titles. Just by how much a small group of people like him.
Click to expand...

Wait....it can't be proven win wins? Want to try that again?
 

Just be careful what you ask for. Texas has all the resources you could ever want, and they are about to lose to Kansas. They keep throwing millions at the program and here they are. No doubt this should be a good/great year for Gophers esp w that experienced o-line. But there are programs at their wits end and Gophers are not one of them….
 


stocker08 said:
Wait....it can't be proven win wins? Want to try that again?
Click to expand...

19-22 in the Big 10. Jerry was 14-21. Claeys was 5-4.

I suppose by a few percentage points that makes Fleck better than Kill and a little worse than Claeys. I guess the word upswing makes me think of a little more than that.
 

USAF said:
Relax. Disappointed, for sure. But I have faith Fleck will get this program to new heights. Just not this year.
Click to expand...
He’s successfully kept it slightly at what he inherited. Five years in and they will finish with a record worse than the year before he came. He hasn’t advanced the program, he’s held serve barely.
 
Last edited:

dlnavra said:
Just be careful what you ask for. Texas has all the resources you could ever want, and they are about to lose to Kansas. They keep throwing millions at the program and here they are. No doubt this should be a good/great year for Gophers esp w that experienced o-line. But there are programs at their wits end and Gophers are not one of them….
Click to expand...

Texas is fighting for win #5.

And they are Texas.
 






dlnavra said:
Fleck is an overall asset to the program, though some curious decisions for sure. What would things look like if he could have Ciarrocca back as they had some chemistry that’s missing now. Ciarrocca found out he had a good thing going w Gophers, and Fleck hasn’t had quite the golden touch since. Yes maybe QB play also has regressed.

Curious is what is with what seems pre-determined fair catch on all punts received, as if it is a win to catch it. Giving up a lot of field position…..do Gophers not have a guy who can field a punt and do something w it?
Click to expand...
They are coached not to return a kick off or punt, and at times it appears not to even attempt to field the punt.

It is truly astonishing.

Then again, our coach admits he plays for field goals before halftime, we kick FGs from the 2 against our rivals after not having a lead against them in over four straight games, we punt from our other rivals 37 on 4th and 2, we run the ball more than any team outside the service academies. But for some reason, we try a 55-yard FG with our kickoff specialist when everything said that was the time to punt.

I mean…..
 

stocker08 said:
Fleck needs to grow as a coach. His constant conservatism has put the team in really bad positions at times. On top of that.....there have been some extremely questionable decisions at times. In this game alone:

-3rd and long.....rushing three on an inexperienced QB and letting him sit around in complete safety until someone gets open and allows for an easy first

-Kicking a 53 yard field goal.....down a point.....when we've had troubles kicking anywhere outside the 40. I get that there is a confidence issue with the offense. But that only backs the idea that the OC is an issue. Third year senior starting QB with the most experienced line in NCAA football.....did Fleck think the offense couldn't get that close again? Outside of a few big plays.....the Iowa offense wasn't moving all that well. How do you not punt the ball there?

-Down eight points and the offense continues to run the play clock 25-30 seconds on every play.....with less than half a quarter to play. Doesn't make any sense. What in the hell is the coaching staff thinking? Does nobody realize that if we don't get the two point conversion.....we are destroying our opportunities? It's pure incompetence. Entire clock management is an issue. Run the playclock down to zero and hope that nothing goes wrong. Whoops....false start because guys are scrambling. Whoops....delay of game. What the hell!?

I still think we are in a better spot than we've been in quite a while.....but Fleck needs to "improve his best".....by a lot. His record in games where we are losing at half says it all. The games against BG and Illinois this year reinforce the issue. The in game coaching is nonexistent. When something isn't working....the coaching staff has no ability....or has an unwillingness....to make changes.

Maybe PJ will be content being a middling to good team. Because the team will never be great if PJ and the staff cannot manage to alter a gameplan that isn't working.
Click to expand...
Post of the day!!!

We were running down the clock to the point where we pick a delay of game penalty. While we were losing late in the fourth quarter. On 3rd and 2.

I mean, we should have been snapping that effing ball with 15 seconds on the clock.
 



Ozzy&Ray said:
He’s successfully kep it slightly under what he inherited. Five years in and they will finish with a record worse than the year before he came. He hasn’t advanced the program, he’s held serve barely.
Click to expand...
Fair enough and can’t disagree. Who do see as a potential upgrade. USC is also searching and others. Texas thought they had their guy in Sark, Matt Campbell will probably stay put since Iowa State has cooled and honestly doubt seriously he would see Gophers as above other options. There is also Washington who is struggling and maybe closely mirrors Minnesota history.

It’s not super easy finding that perfect coach. Thinking Fleck and Gophers are a good match given all the other scenarios i see unfolding. See Texas, USC and many others, esp SEC.
 
Last edited:

Breakin' The Plane said:
If I told you in January of 2017 that the next 5 years following a 9-4 season were two seasons with no bowl, a Motor City Bowl, a Music City or Pinstripe Bowl and an 10-2 record that only got you to the Outback Bowl, a 1-9 record vs. Iowa and Wisconsin and zero trips to Indy, would you still hire P.J. Fleck?
Click to expand...
No, I wouldn't, and certainly not at the rate he's being compensated. I hoped, prayed and expected for far better than this from Fleck, but other than that one very special season when we had NFL caliber talent on both sides of the ball, his tenure to me has been 'meh' at best. Just spinning our wheels again mired in deep mediocrity and with the ongoing and continued inability to beat our rivals to boot. The frustration with that is just about unbearable at times.

Had I known all the above going in, I'd have absolutely bypassed Fleck and taken a shot on someone else. Maybe that wouldn't have worked out either, but hey. You've gotta try and go for it.
 

Hungry and Starving said:
It is shocking how conservative Fleck is as a coach. It is unfathomable. I would pay for the moving company to take him to USC at this point. He's not worth the contract.
Click to expand...
Conservative yet he tries that 1 in a million FG? He’s lost the plot.
 


Ozzy&Ray said:
He’s successfully kep it slightly under what he inherited. Five years in and they will finish with a record worse than the year before he came. He hasn’t advanced the program, he’s held serve barely.
Click to expand...
I’d be curious to compare strength of schedule though
 

Fleck is unjustifiably conservative in 90% of the situations, and then takes an unnecessary risk in an absurd situation (like running out your backup kicker to try a field goal that your starter won't make).

Also, why are we always trying to kill clock in games we are losing in the second half? Isn't eating clock generally what the team with the lead wants to do?
 

CentralGopher said:
I’d be curious to compare strength of schedule though
Click to expand...
At least based on Big Ten schedule, the Gophers played the exact same schedule in 2016 and 2019 (ignoring home/road). The difference? Gophers lost in Happy Valley in OT and got beat in Lincoln by a ranked Huskers team before it fell off the face of the earth.
 


Replacement Gopher said:
Post of the day!!!

We were running down the clock to the point where we pick a delay of game penalty. While we were losing late in the fourth quarter. On 3rd and 2.

I mean, we should have been snapping that effing ball with 15 seconds on the clock.
Click to expand...
That’s what really irritates me. Taking 20 to 25 seconds to run a dam play when you are behind In the 4th quarter. In this situation PJ still hasn’t learned that Iowa wasn’t the enemy, the clock was. When will he learn???
 

Bulldog13tv said:
Eh… he won big games in the past with a different OC. He is a GM style coach. Need good coordinators. He made the wrong OC hire and its haunting him.
Click to expand...
Don't forget he also hired Robb Smith. If his plan is to hire good coordinators, he is not very good at it. And then he takes longer than the fans to realize it isn't working out.
 

WoodburyTim said:
19-22 in the Big 10. Jerry was 14-21. Claeys was 5-4.

I suppose by a few percentage points that makes Fleck better than Kill and a little worse than Claeys. I guess the word upswing makes me think of a little more than that.
Click to expand...

Is Fleck's winning percentage worse or something? When I hear the word "upswing"....I think improvement. Is winning double digit games in a season for the first time in over 50 years no big deal or something?

Please tell me how things have not been going better.
 

stocker08 said:
Fleck needs to grow as a coach. His constant conservatism has put the team in really bad positions at times. On top of that.....there have been some extremely questionable decisions at times. In this game alone:

-3rd and long.....rushing three on an inexperienced QB and letting him sit around in complete safety until someone gets open and allows for an easy first

-Kicking a 53 yard field goal.....down a point.....when we've had troubles kicking anywhere outside the 40. I get that there is a confidence issue with the offense. But that only backs the idea that the OC is an issue. Third year senior starting QB with the most experienced line in NCAA football.....did Fleck think the offense couldn't get that close again? Outside of a few big plays.....the Iowa offense wasn't moving all that well. How do you not punt the ball there?

-Down eight points and the offense continues to run the play clock 25-30 seconds on every play.....with less than half a quarter to play. Doesn't make any sense. What in the hell is the coaching staff thinking? Does nobody realize that if we don't get the two point conversion.....we are destroying our opportunities? It's pure incompetence. Entire clock management is an issue. Run the playclock down to zero and hope that nothing goes wrong. Whoops....false start because guys are scrambling. Whoops....delay of game. What the hell!?

I still think we are in a better spot than we've been in quite a while.....but Fleck needs to "improve his best".....by a lot. His record in games where we are losing at half says it all. The games against BG and Illinois this year reinforce the issue. The in game coaching is nonexistent. When something isn't working....the coaching staff has no ability....or has an unwillingness....to make changes.

Maybe PJ will be content being a middling to good team. Because the team will never be great if PJ and the staff cannot manage to alter a gameplan that isn't working.
Click to expand...
Great post but how many fucking years and how many losses to rivals does he need? He has to grow. Agreed. But he’s had a half decade to grow. He hasn’t. Conservative on 4 and 2 at the goal line. Wildly aggressive from midfield with a bonkers FG. The risk / reward is appallingly out of balance in this dude’s head. It’s like he’s got it all backward. My patience is worn thin. I just can’t with this guy any more.
 

stocker08 said:
Is Fleck's winning percentage worse or something? When I hear the word "upswing"....I think improvement. Is winning double digit games in a season for the first time in over 50 years no big deal or something?

Please tell me how things have not been going better.
Click to expand...
Neglecting to learn from your signature wins in 2019 sure doesn't feel like a continuation of an upswing. We've essentially reached stall stage on the upswing.
 

stocker08 said:
Is Fleck's winning percentage worse or something? When I hear the word "upswing"....I think improvement. Is winning double digit games in a season for the first time in over 50 years no big deal or something?

Please tell me how things have not been going better.
Click to expand...
Well, we did lose at home to the worst team in the FBS. With very veteran team. Sooooo…..
 

bleedsmaroonandgold said:
Don't forget he also hired Robb Smith. If his plan is to hire good coordinators, he is not very good at it. And then he takes longer than the fans to realize it isn't working out.
Click to expand...
Yep. A CEO that hires terrible employees is….a terrible CEO. Doesn’t really matter how bad the oc is. PJ continues to walk into the same rakes
 

CentralGopher said:
I’d be curious to compare strength of schedule though
Click to expand...
Yep, probably easier this year. West has been as mediocre as it has ever been, and other than OSU our cross-over games were as favorable as possible. And, we played no one non-conference.
 

stocker08 said:
Is Fleck's winning percentage worse or something? When I hear the word "upswing"....I think improvement. Is winning double digit games in a season for the first time in over 50 years no big deal or something?

Please tell me how things have not been going better.
Click to expand...

Yeah you are right. We are a little better than the Kill era, overall not as good as the Claeys year. I guess if that is an upswing, then so be it.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom