ESPN's Bennett: Fleck's biggest challenge will be uniting the team; 6 wins realistic

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jmag21 said:
I was as down on Mitch as anybody. But surely guys that can't even get a SNIFF of playing time over a quarterback who was as bad as Mitch last year can't inspire much confidence. I suspect that most people would have been expecting 6 wins next year for Claeys, and blaming the administration for the suspension of the players for the reason. But it doesn't really matter. What's done is done. And Fleck is now our coach. I hope he wins 10, but if he wins 6 or 7, and has a good recruiting year, I'll be satisfied.
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Yeah, I don't have much confidence in our QB next year. But I'd be shocked if we didn't get as much if not more production from that position next season. The bar is that low.

Realistically, I expect 6-7 wins. I just don't think that would be the expectations if Claeys was coming back. I was on record as saying that 8-4 is a good season at MN (regardless of trying to argue about schedule). So going 7-5 is OK for next year. I just think there is a bizarre amount of hypocrisy from the people who hated 9-4 last year.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
WR - - Yeah, we won't be very good. But we lost MORE in Maye (% of receiving yards) last year than we will lose in Wolitarsky this season. Plus we will be adding Lingen. It won't be good, but it should be equally as bad as last year (shouldn't be worse).
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Completely false. Wolitarsky had 38% of our receiving yards this year. Maye had 28% last year.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Yeah, I don't have much confidence in our QB next year. But I'd be shocked if we didn't get as much if not more production from that position next season. The bar is that low.

Realistically, I expect 6-7 wins. I just don't think that would be the expectations if Claeys was coming back. I was on record as saying that 8-4 is a good season at MN (regardless of trying to argue about schedule). So going 7-5 is OK for next year. I just think there is a bizarre amount of hypocrisy from the people who hated 9-4 last year.
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I think anybody who hated 9-4 last year is being as silly as the people who have apparently decided that Fleck has to win 10 games or he should be fired. Last year was (with an admittedly weak schedule) still a good year for Gopher football. This year was always going to be a down year after the suspensions. I, for one, am more confident in Fleck than Claeys going forward, but it frankly doesn't matter. I bleed maroon or gold, so I'm ride or die with Fleck as long as he's the coach. Excelsior.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Fleck was/is recruiting Estes. I think Estes is pretty similar to the Mark Williams of the world in style (hopefully a QB but athletic enough to play WR if that doesn't work out).

Who else did Kill/Claeys really recruit who wasn't a QB? Leidner?
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Streveler comes to mind.
 




jmag21 said:
I think anybody who hated 9-4 last year is being as silly as the people who have apparently decided that Fleck has to win 10 games or he should be fired. Last year was (with an admittedly weak schedule) still a good year for Gopher football. This year was always going to be a down year after the suspensions. I, for one, am more confident in Fleck than Claeys going forward, but it frankly doesn't matter. I bleed maroon or gold, so I'm ride or die with Fleck as long as he's the coach. Excelsior.
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My expectation is 8 regular season wins...and I've outlined why in several posts. Should get 9-10 regular season wins in 2018, and a shot at running the table in 2019.

Has there really been posters who say 10 wins or fire him? Crazy if there are. If PJ doesn't get 8, I'll be disappointed, that's it.
 

Lakeville Goldy said:
I guess I wouldn't assume MSU will stay in the dungeon next season. But you make a legitimate point - the schedule isn't as scary as maybe it was at the beginning of last year. The other thing to think about is Michigan lost all 11 starters on defense. So that will hopefully make them at less unbelievably good.

That said, with Croft (who had supposedly been passed by Green and Williams) as the only option at QB as of now and no experience in the secondary (depending on the hearing and signing day, etc.) and a bunch of guys at receiver that can't catch a ball, I won't count any chickens until they hatch.
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Just curious ... where did you hear this about Croft, not including speculation on Gopherhole?
 

GopherHomer said:
Okay - in an effort to take the coaching change out of the equation (since that seems to be fueling everyone's opinions one way or another) next year will likely depend on two positions. QB and DB - both kind of an unknown at this point. Even the suddenly vocal Claeys regime backers can admit that QB recruiting under him/Kill was underwhelming. If our existing QBs are garbage (contrary to popular opinion there is a basement WAY below Leidner) we will struggle. Likewise, if our DBs are gutted because of suspensions it could be a long year. Basically there are some mitigating factors that give Fleck at least a year to get things on track. I'm sure many WMU fans were ready to jump off a boat after their 1-11 first year - worked out great for them.

Leidner, if you consider his running ability, was a very prolific QB for our program (maybe the best ever?). If we can duplicate his production and field a competent secondary, I agree that we should win more than 6 games next year. I am not, however, going to pin my decision on the hire based off of next year's record.

LOL at the person trying to compare losing Rutgers and replacing with MSU based on their record this past season...just stop. You obviously don't want this program to win. Seriously - quit talking about the President and AD. Who cares? Support the product that will be on the field. I don't care if we are sleazy. Most successful programs are. Wins are wins and losses are losses - talk to me in 2019.

Also - the negatives seem to be keen on commenting on the losses of our rival programs but claim that we should just reload. How long have they been fans of the Gophers? Fact is - hiring Fleck was the best, most dynamic move this University has made in the last 30 years and we should be excited. Everything else is just some misguided anger over University politics. Get over it.
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Well said. Couldn't agree more.
 



Six wins is realistic, but it's at the low end of the realistic range. I could see anywhere from six to nine wins this first year under Fleck but I think seven or eight wins is the likely outcome.
 



Hates Monikers said:
Just curious ... where did you hear this about Croft, not including speculation on Gopherhole?
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I read that from a couple of the Gopher beat writers as well as speculation on Gopherhole (some of which was based off folks watching practice and inferring that based off playing time, what group they played with, etc.).

I think one specific one about Williams was when he started practicing at WR one of the writers said he had surpassed Croft, but that may have been puffery. I know I saw it written that Green had passed Croft by a few local guys. I believe someone wrote that there was overall disappointment in Croft's development as well as surprise at Green's and Williams' development.

All of the above could be based on millions of different things - Croft was hurt and nobody said anything, Green and Williams were just that much better, Croft was spending time w/ lower tier players just to get different experience, who knows.

Regardless, from what little I know and have seen of Croft and Rhoda (didn't realize Fleck had convinced Rhoda to stay when I made my previous comment), to say QB won't be a concern next year because Leidner was disappointing this year is beyond naive. As a friend of mine was fond of saying, things can ALWAYS get worse. They can't always get better, but they can ALWAYS get worse.

The fact that Claeys was trying to sign a JUCO transfer to start (according to Burns I believe?) before Williams and Green were suspended should tell you everything you need to know about how much confidence we should have in that position.
 



Lakeville Goldy said:
I read that from a couple of the Gopher beat writers as well as speculation on Gopherhole (some of which was based off folks watching practice and inferring that based off playing time, what group they played with, etc.).

I think one specific one about Williams was when he started practicing at WR one of the writers said he had surpassed Croft, but that may have been puffery. I know I saw it written that Green had passed Croft by a few local guys. I believe someone wrote that there was overall disappointment in Croft's development as well as surprise at Green's and Williams' development.

All of the above could be based on millions of different things - Croft was hurt and nobody said anything, Green and Williams were just that much better, Croft was spending time w/ lower tier players just to get different experience, who knows.

Regardless, from what little I know and have seen of Croft and Rhoda (didn't realize Fleck had convinced Rhoda to stay when I made my previous comment), to say QB won't be a concern next year because Leidner was disappointing this year is beyond naive. As a friend of mine was fond of saying, things can ALWAYS get worse. They can't always get better, but they can ALWAYS get worse.

The fact that Claeys was trying to sign a JUCO transfer to start (according to Burns I believe?) before Williams and Green were suspended should tell you everything you need to know about how much confidence we should have in that position.
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Thanks. I read most of the Gopher news in the two daily papers and haven't seen any of that. Maybe I just missed it. I have heard Ryan Burns on multiple occasions say that Green could be very good in a couple years (plural), but he's not ready yet. That's all I've heard or read outside of this board.

I didn't have a great deal of concern about replacing Leidner before the suspensions. Graduation happens in college football. The coaches know better than I about the need for a JUCO; it could be that they didn't think anyone on the roster was ready. Or it could be that we needed a little more experienced depth and competition to go with a sophomore and two freshmen.
 

Hates Monikers said:
Thanks. I read most of the Gopher news in the two daily papers and haven't seen any of that. Maybe I just missed it. I have heard Ryan Burns on multiple occasions say that Green could be very good in a couple years (plural), but he's not ready yet. That's all I've heard or read outside of this board.

I didn't have a great deal of concern about replacing Leidner before the suspensions. Graduation happens in college football. The coaches know better than I about the need for a JUCO; it could be that they didn't think anyone on the roster was ready. Or it could be that we needed a little more experienced depth and competition to go with a sophomore and two freshmen.
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It's Rhoda and Croft. Both looked pretty decent in the Fall practices. Again, PJ's offense is similar but the paasing game is based on easy reads and high success completions. Fits these two better.
 

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