ESPN Article - At the Watercooler: Talking Big Ten

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MinneStoa said:
I like the part where you explain the thought behind your statement.
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Wisconsin has elite talent. They aren't athletic, but they are talented. Check their recruit rankings.

If you STILL think they take a bunch of D3 kids and do what they do you are delusional.
 

Winasota Gopher said:
Bull*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#. Completley overblown point.
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The comment was about elite talent, and Wisconsin does not get the elite talent. They get good players that would fill in at many D1 schools, but they are not competing for the elite players. The original premise, which I disagree with, is that Pitino's system won't work unless he gets elite players, not just good players.
 


scher215 said:
Wisconsin has elite talent. They aren't athletic, but they are talented. Check their recruit rankings.

If you STILL think they take a bunch of D3 kids and do what they do you are delusional.
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His post said nothing about elite talent. He said elite athletes. You can be a freak athlete without being top-level talent (some would argue that Rodney falls into this category). Likewise you can be a high-level talent without being super athletic.

The two really, really aren't the same thing. Please name the last truly elite athlete that Wisconsin has brought in.
 


MinneStoa said:
His post said nothing about elite talent. He said elite athletes. You can be a freak athlete without being top-level talent (some would argue that Rodney falls into this category). Likewise you can be a high-level talent without being super athletic.

The two really, really aren't the same thing. Please name the last truly elite athlete that Wisconsin has brought in.
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Ah got it. My mistake. Missed the elite athlete distinction and not elite talent.
 




Wisconsin system doesn't "work in the big 10" with average or even "good" athletes either.....
 

The change that people may be overlooking regarding Wisconsin is the fact that the officials are now supposed to be emphasizing calling more defensive fouls, and more blocking fouls. I think that would mitigate some of the advantage of the Wisconsin style in trying to turn every game into a grinder. When you can't grind as much without being benched and eventually disqualified, that will take away some of the edge that they have relied on so often in the Big Ten conference. It's not just a coincidence that the Wisconsin style hasn't been nearly as successful in the NCAA tourney when the whistles are generally more frequent - the efficiency of the UW defense declines when they get into the tourney.
 

But for UW to suffer due to the renewed emphasis on calling defensive fouls, the Big Ten refs will actually have to do it and change their habit of swallowing their whistles. Remains to be seen if the refs will actually do that.
 

i dont mind the grind it out style, there is nothing wrong with playing physical and if you don't like it then go play soccer
 




Basketball has become way too physical. Start calling fouls when players are blocking and tackling. It's turning into a football game...or should I say NHL. Pretty soon we may see 'enforcers'.

The NBA has become a thug league. Make an attempt to block the shot but actually try to punish and knock to the floor. Witness defending S Curry when coming across the lane without the ball..hard body slams with the intent to physically punish. Call them for what they are, intentional fouls.
 

die hard gopher said:
i dont mind the grind it out style, there is nothing wrong with playing physical and if you don't like it then go play soccer
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If you don't like basketball played by the rules, then go play rugby.
 


OSUfan said:
The change that people may be overlooking regarding Wisconsin is the fact that the officials are now supposed to be emphasizing calling more defensive fouls, and more blocking fouls.
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How do you think the new rules will affect Aaron Craft? His style of riding and slapping and fouling on nearly every possession without being called has worked very well thus far. Wonder how much his defense will have to change if the officials really start enforcing the new rules?
 

UWOle said:
How do you think the new rules will affect Aaron Craft? His style of riding and slapping and fouling on nearly every possession without being called has worked very well thus far. Wonder how much his defense will have to change if the officials really start enforcing the new rules?
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If the officials enforce these rules, it will hurt Craft a bunch.
 

Gold Vision said:
Jared Berggren is an elite athlete.
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I wouldn't call him elite, but I can definitely understand your case for him. In my mind, elite is Rodney Williams, Ben McLemore, Patrick Young, etc.

But like I said I can definitely see where you're coming from. It just seems that we have different thresholds for what defines "elite".
 

UWOle said:
How do you think the new rules will affect Aaron Craft? His style of riding and slapping and fouling on nearly every possession without being called has worked very well thus far. Wonder how much his defense will have to change if the officials really start enforcing the new rules?
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Style of riding and slapping and fouling on nearly every possession? Good one. You know, Shannon Scott is on the team as well, so whatever minutes Craft would lose due to having a few more fouls called is not going to be a concern. Wisconsin is clearly the team that needs to be most concerned about the renewed emphasis on calling fouls in the Big Ten.
 

You know the difference between OSU and Wisconsin? When the refs call it tighter in the NCAA tourney, OSU still manages to win their share of games. Wisconsin can't get past the Sweet 16, like almost ever.
 

KyGopherfan said:
I said the same thing and got blasted. Being in Kentucky, I'm all too familiar with the Pitino/Donovan brand of basketball and it's entirely true that you need elite players to execute it, ortherwise Minnesota will just be Alabama of the north. Anthony Grant is a classic example of how lacking elite talent doesn't make that Pitino/Donovan system look so great. Grant did well in the mid-majors but has flopped in the big leagues. Just merely playing up-tempo is no guarantee for success. The rest of the B1G is not gonna roll over and play dead for Richard Pitino. They'll figure it out and adjust. The coaches are just too good in this league.
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86-52 at Alabama is "flopping"? Really?
 

station19 said:
.The NBA has become a thug league. Make an attempt to block the shot but actually try to punish and knock to the floor. Witness defending S Curry when coming across the lane without the ball..hard body slams with the intent to physically punish. Call them for what they are, intentional fouls.
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Ah, I think the Bad Boys of Detroit would disagree with you. The NBA has cleaned-up the physical style a lot from those days. You can still claim it is too physical, but it hasn't just become that way.
 

UWOle said:
How do you think the new rules will affect Aaron Craft? His style of riding and slapping and fouling on nearly every possession without being called has worked very well thus far. Wonder how much his defense will have to change if the officials really start enforcing the new rules?
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I think Craft will be fine, he gets in position as good as anybody in College basketball, he play's the ball but he works to get in position before doing it, it's the guys that do the reach around and hand check the body to keep someone in front of them that should be in trouble.
 


tikited said:
Ah, I think the Bad Boys of Detroit would disagree with you. The NBA has cleaned-up the physical style a lot from those days. You can still claim it is too physical, but it hasn't just become that way.
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Good point. Still way too physical. If someone is scoring too many points on you, guard him. Assaulting someone is for boxing and the NHL.
 




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