Doogie: The "U's" real problem: Average Joel (Maturi)

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The health angle on Kill amazes me. His dad died at 66. Big fat deal. My mom died at 35. Should I never get a job since I'm 37 (yes, I understand its millions of taxpayer money)? If he's recovered, and healthy and the docs agree I think his health should be a non-issue.
 

His cancer is in remission and has been for the past two years, so I question the health angle too.
 

No proof

Don't say things you can't back up Doogie. Just trying to make a name for yourself. Maturi made a bad hire in Brewster. No doubt about that. If you look at his body of work he has done a good job as Athletic Director. I also think he made a solid hire in Kill. You have no idea of what went on in the hiring or search process. He never promised a Tubby Smith hire. He said he would like to get someone of that caliber. Maybe he did ... time will tell.
 

MNSpaniel said:
Don't say things you can't back up Doogie. Just trying to make a name for yourself. Maturi made a bad hire in Brewster. No doubt about that. If you look at his body of work he has done a good job as Athletic Director. I also think he made a solid hire in Kill. You have no idea of what went on in the hiring or search process. He never promised a Tubby Smith hire. He said he would like to get someone of that caliber. Maybe he did ... time will tell.
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We found the one Joel Maturi fan. Good job what? Anyways, a 2-12 record vs. FBS teams that finished above .500 in the last three years scares me.
 


jags1998 said:
The health angle on Kill amazes me. His dad died at 66. Big fat deal. My mom died at 35. Should I never get a job since I'm 37 (yes, I understand its millions of taxpayer money)? If he's recovered, and healthy and the docs agree I think his health should be a non-issue.
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Agreed. While I am with Doogie on the Maturi sentiments 100%, I don't get the health angle. He's not a JoPa-like 83-years old. If his health catches up with him and something happens, you move on, just like you would with any unexpected tragedy. My cousin had leukemia when she was 10, and it is in remission just like Kill's cancer. Should LSU have not accepted her into their Veterinary school?

I don't understand the health argument for the same reason I don't understand the "stepping-stone" job argument. Are we really supposed to be concerned about hiring someone because they might move to a better job? For one, how could you ever possibly decipher that this could be a possibility in the future? Even if it did happen, we should consider ourselves fortunate, as that probably means the current coach was making our program better.
 


Get a clue

Being an AD is about running an entire program. Look at how many programs across the nation fire coaches every year. Is every AD that made a bad hire incompetent. How many on this board are in charge of hiring and firing. Have you not hired someone who blew you away in an interview ...only to find out they blew smoke up your rear. Not every hire is a good one. If you don't have tunnel vision you can see he has done a good job overall.
 

MNSpaniel said:
Being an AD is about running an entire program. Look at how many programs across the nation fire coaches every year. Is every AD that made a bad hire incompetent. How many on this board are in charge of hiring and firing. Have you not hired someone who blew you away in an interview ...only to find out they blew smoke up your rear. Not every hire is a good one. If you don't have tunnel vision you can see he has done a good job overall.
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Careful, taking a sane look at things will only get you crushed on this board.
 



weird, doogie has now taken multiple shots at kfan for the chryst tweet. how come doogie didn't take shot at joe schmitt for the story he made up about fedora being on campus which was 100% false.
 

Spot on Doogs.

It's clear that Maturi will be the last domino to fall. Only then can Kaler start to dig us out of this hole and find a real Big Ten worthy AD.
 

In Ch. 5's one-on-one, he said he's been rejected for jobs in the last five years because of his health... so, definitely not a non-issue... and last time I checked, pancreatic can run in a family. Simply wanted to point out.

MNSpaniel: if Maturi didn't promise that, why did he say today that he regrets making the Tubby comment?
I have no idea? How did Joe and I have the news first? How were we able to have Randy Shannon's name five weeks ago when others scoffed? How did I have the news that Sumlin wasn't contacted for two consecutive weeks, taking his name from a strong candidate to a weak one?
 

Go4 said:
weird, doogie has now taken multiple shots at kfan for the chryst tweet. how come doogie didn't take shot at joe schmitt for the story he made up about fedora being on campus which was 100% false.
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Definitely poked fun at him... the real funny thing: the same source who gave us that info. gave us the Kill info. Someone at the "U" wanted to throw reporters off, which was a job well done on Fedora.
 



MNSpaniel said:
Being an AD is about running an entire program. Look at how many programs across the nation fire coaches every year. Is every AD that made a bad hire incompetent. How many on this board are in charge of hiring and firing. Have you not hired someone who blew you away in an interview ...only to find out they blew smoke up your rear. Not every hire is a good one. If you don't have tunnel vision you can see he has done a good job overall.
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Joel really handled the whole Dan Moson era well. Doing great things with the women's Bball team. Men's hockey strong as ever. Golf team looking good. Have we hired a women's softball coach yet or did we let a player take over for the co-coaches?
Adan Rittenberg of ESPN on Joel:
If you're upset, don't blame Kill. If you weren't impressed with him at Monday's introductory news conference, you likely will be a few years down the line.

If you're still peeved, feel free to blame Minnesota athletic director Joel Maturi. I'm all for good quotes and candor from key athletic officials, but Maturi went too far at his Oct. 17 news conference to announce the firing of coach Tim Brewster and the start of the search.

Some Maturi sound bytes from Oct. 17:

* "We're out here to find a Tubby Smith. We're out here to find somebody that people can recognize, people have confidence in, and people are going to bring instant credibility and notoriety to the football program. That is my goal."

* "Can I pay the dollars that Urban Meyer are making? No. Nick Saban? No. We cannot go down that path. That's not a path that we can go down. But can we pay more than what we're paying, yes, we can. We can pay competitively, and we can pay our staff competitively."

* "You're not following Vince Lombardi here. This is a situation where, you know what, somebody can come in and win some games and people are going to feel good about him and they win a few more games and they're going to feel really good about him. And if we go to the Rose Bowl, we might even put a statue of them outside of TCF Bank Stadium."
 

Can't we try to move ahead and be positive? Like Kill said, if we can't, we'll be looking for another coach in three or four years. Bashing Maturi once more does absolutely nothing to help Coach Kill.

As for the health angle, I had stage 5 cancer with three tumors. The prognosis was so bad that when I was declared free of cancer the doctor, nurses and hospital staff gave me a standing ovation for still being alive. (One of the weirdest moments of my life.) It was hard enough getting through it all. It would be harder still if it followed me into the future and tainted how people view me.
 

Doogie said:
In Ch. 5's one-on-one, he said he's been rejected for jobs in the last five years because of his health... so, definitely not a non-issue... and last time I checked, pancreatic can run in a family. Simply wanted to point out.
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Fair point - I was more pointing out it wouldn't be an issue if I was the AD.
 

Doogie said:
In Ch. 5's one-on-one, he said he's been rejected for jobs in the last five years because of his health... so, definitely not a non-issue... and last time I checked, pancreatic can run in a family. Simply wanted to point out.

MNSpaniel: if Maturi didn't promise that, why did he say today that he regrets making the Tubby comment?
I have no idea? How did Joe and I have the news first? How were we able to have Randy Shannon's name five weeks ago when others scoffed? How did I have the news that Sumlin wasn't contacted for two consecutive weeks, taking his name from a strong candidate to a weak one?
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Shot in the dark- he wishes he hadn't made the comment because people like you misquote him to try and prove their point.
 


Sometimes I think Doogie just gets a little too tunnel visioned.

He took the line "anyone who has done their homework would know that he's won everywhere he's been", and Doogie focused on the "homework" part of that sentence. I don't like Maturi but the argument that against Kill seems to be "Maturi likes him and he's dumb, so I don't like him".

What's funny, is that Kill is almost the exact description of the kind of coach that Doogie said he liked when he said that he didn't think Brew was a good coach last offseason (low turnovers, force turnovers, run the ball, play good defense, limit penalties, etc.). Doogie made a certain criteria and Kill could put check next to all of those areas.

I keep hearing this talk about how well Kill did against .500 teams, but that is naive. That is the nature of coaching in the MAC. They play almost all of their non-conference games against better competition. It is really the nature of most of the coaches who don't coach in BCS conferences.

For instance:
Brady Hoke's record against teams over .500 (just from the last 4 years when his teams were decent, his full numbers are much worse):
4-16 (Navy, Air Force, Central Michigan, Western Michigan)

Wins against schools from BCS conferences: ZERO

or

Al Golden's record against .500 teams:

1-16

His lone win: UCONN

Again, i'm not ripping on these coaches but to have pumped about any of the mid majors we were going to get and to bash Kill for not beating a ton of .500 teams is a bit naive of the way mid major football usually works.
 

Duluthguy said:
Can't we try to move ahead and be positive? Like Kill said, if we can't, we'll be looking for another coach in three or four years. Bashing Maturi once more does absolutely nothing to help Coach Kill.

As for the health angle, I had stage 5 cancer with three tumors. The prognosis was so bad that when I was declared free of cancer the doctor, nurses and hospital staff gave me a standing ovation for still being alive. (One of the weirdest moments of my life.) It was hard enough getting through it all. It would be harder still if it followed me into the future and tainted how people view me.
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Joel Maturi being the AD hurts Jerry Kill much more than people bashing Maturi. It would be best if Joel either stepped down or was fired.
 



Opinion writer versus journalist?

The former or latter for Mr. Wolfson? It is hard to take someone in the media seriously who throws opinions around and has axes to grind. Some talent there, I think, but he needs to be a little more thoughtful in what he puts out there, or what he should not put out there, if he wants to be a sports journalist of any chops.

Everyone has opinions when it comes to sports and the flavor of the day and I respect his less than I respect many others on the board.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Sometimes I think Doogie just gets a little too tunnel visioned.

He took the line "anyone who has done their homework would know that he's won everywhere he's been", and Doogie focused on the "homework" part of that sentence. I don't like Maturi but the argument that against Kill seems to be "Maturi likes him and he's dumb, so I don't like him".

What's funny, is that Kill is almost the exact description of the kind of coach that Doogie said he liked when he said that he didn't think Brew was a good coach last offseason (low turnovers, force turnovers, run the ball, play good defense, limit penalties, etc.). Doogie made a certain criteria and Kill could put check next to all of those areas.

I keep hearing this talk about how well Kill did against .500 teams, but that is naive. That is the nature of coaching in the MAC. They play almost all of their non-conference games against better competition. It is really the nature of most of the coaches who don't coach in BCS conferences.

For instance:
Brady Hoke's record against teams over .500 (just from the last 4 years when his teams were decent, his full numbers are much worse):
4-16 (Navy, Air Force, Central Michigan, Western Michigan)

Wins against schools from BCS conferences: ZERO

or

Al Golden's record against .500 teams:

1-16

His lone win: UCONN"

Again, i'm not ripping on these coaches but to have pumped about any of the mid majors we were going to get and to bash Kill for not beating a ton of .500 teams is a bit naive of the way mid major football usually works.
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When did Doogie say we should hire Golden or Hoke? I don't remember Doogie ever putting out a preference...I did...HIRE MIKE LEACH...but I digress.

I think what Doogie was saying that for Maturi to sprout the old...'homework' line after he said the same thing 4 years ago about Brewster and after everyone involved has said we didn't contact Kill until Saturday...a mere 54 days into our coaching search...I suspect that the 'homework' Maturi did was after he decided to hire this guy and he needed to rationalize it to the rest of us.

Kill was the best we were going to get considering all the admin issues and Maturi's weaknesses...that said, I look forward to seeing our Gophers Kill the Badgers with the Axe!
 

Go4 said:
weird, doogie has now taken multiple shots at kfan for the chryst tweet. how come doogie didn't take shot at joe schmitt for the story he made up about fedora being on campus which was 100% false.
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As for KFAN, still have many friends over there... good-natured ribbing.
 

Originally Posted by Doogie: if Maturi didn't promise that, why did he say today that he regrets making the Tubby comment?

Posted by The 12th Man: Shot in the dark- he wishes he hadn't made the comment because people like you misquote him to try and prove their point.

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The 12th Man nailed it because that is what the local sports media does pretty much all of the time. Maturi never promised a "Tubby hire". He only said he was going to try for one. For more evidence I refer you to Brewster's Rose Bowl quote which might be the most widely misquoted statement ever. The local sports media usually knows when they are not telling the whole truth but they don't care because all they really want is a better story to tell. Barreiro spent a lot of time today blasting Maturi for not going after Leach even though he knows perfectly well that Bruininks eliminated Leach right from the start.
 

Block M said:
The former or latter for Mr. Wolfson? It is hard to take someone in the media seriously who throws opinions around and has axes to grind. Some talent there, I think, but he needs to be a little more thoughtful in what he puts out there, or what he should not put out there, if he wants to be a sports journalist of any chops.

Everyone has opinions when it comes to sports and the flavor of the day and I respect his less than I respect many others on the board.
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Block M: when I'm a guest on 1500, or fill-in host, sports talk radio is all about providing opinion... The Star Tribune asked me to a "Your Voices" blog... that's all opinion... when I report or anchor for Ch. 5, that's when I'm objective... but if I'm on Sports Wrap, I offer opinion... many different layers. I am not Phil Miller or Marcus Fuller... they are beat reporters, always objective.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Sometimes I think Doogie just gets a little too tunnel visioned.

He took the line "anyone who has done their homework would know that he's won everywhere he's been", and Doogie focused on the "homework" part of that sentence. I don't like Maturi but the argument that against Kill seems to be "Maturi likes him and he's dumb, so I don't like him".

What's funny, is that Kill is almost the exact description of the kind of coach that Doogie said he liked when he said that he didn't think Brew was a good coach last offseason (low turnovers, force turnovers, run the ball, play good defense, limit penalties, etc.). Doogie made a certain criteria and Kill could put check next to all of those areas.

I keep hearing this talk about how well Kill did against .500 teams, but that is naive. That is the nature of coaching in the MAC. They play almost all of their non-conference games against better competition. It is really the nature of most of the coaches who don't coach in BCS conferences.

For instance:
Brady Hoke's record against teams over .500 (just from the last 4 years when his teams were decent, his full numbers are much worse):
4-16 (Navy, Air Force, Central Michigan, Western Michigan)

Wins against schools from BCS conferences: ZERO

or

Al Golden's record against .500 teams:

1-16

His lone win: UCONN

Again, i'm not ripping on these coaches but to have pumped about any of the mid majors we were going to get and to bash Kill for not beating a ton of .500 teams is a bit naive of the way mid major football usually works.
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Bob: Look back at a Strib blog I did in Nov. '09, or Sept. this year... called for Leach... but knew full well that they wouldn't have the guts to do that... so, softened and became realistic with my expectations... I wanted Calhoun... who, admittedly, hasn't dazzled vs. TCU, BYU, and Utah.
 

GopherinPhilly said:
When did Doogie say we should hire Golden or Hoke? I don't remember Doogie ever putting out a preference...I did...HIRE MIKE LEACH...but I digress.

I think what Doogie was saying that for Maturi to sprout the old...'homework' line after he said the same thing 4 years ago about Brewster and after everyone involved has said we didn't contact Kill until Saturday...a mere 54 days into our coaching search...I suspect that the 'homework' Maturi did was after he decided to hire this guy and he needed to rationalize it to the rest of us.

Kill was the best we were going to get considering all the admin issues and Maturi's weaknesses...that said, I look forward to seeing our Gophers Kill the Badgers with the Axe!
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He didn't, but the implications are that we had to desperate to consider Kill while it was public knowledge that we were considering Hoke and Golden throughout the entire process with almost no mention of their record's against .500 teams.

Most of the threads on here that were talking about realistic candidates (not Leach, Bellotti, Dungy, etc.) were centered around mid-major coaches like Calhoun, Sumlin, Hoke, and Golden. If you read my post I thought I made it abundantly clear that my discussion of the Golden and Hoke's records against over .500 teams was in response to people who supported other mid-major coaches and blasted Kill's record.

The fact that he needed to rationalize the Kill hire to anyone speaks to original point. If we had hired Al Golden I don't think there would have been as much of a need to rationalize the hiring and Kill has done better than Al Golden.
 

Doogie said:
Bob: Look back at a Strib blog I need in Nov. '09, or Sept. this year... called for Leach... but knew full well that they wouldn't have the guts to do that... so, softened and became realistic with my expectations... I wanted Calhoun... who, admittedly, hasn't dazzled vs. TCU, BYU, and Utah.
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I know, I am with you on that Doogie. I would have preferred Leach over just about everyone. My main point was more that there seems to be a lot of people on here who really liked the idea of the other mid-major coaches and use Kill's record against teams over .500 to embolden that belief, when in fact the same can be said about their respective candidates.
 

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