Do the Gophers undervalue MN talent in recruiting?

[Triple D]

How can a team like NDSU beat us handily with the majority of the roster MN players? Is it coaching or should we be giving more MN players a spot on our roster, there is obviously a lot of talent in this State. Too bad most of them play for NDSU.

 

[Breakin' The Plane]

It's got nothing to do with "talent". NDSU gave a damn (see State Fairgrounds). MN didn't care. Jerry Kill is cute, but his time is running short. There is absolutely no excuse for a Big 10 school to lose to these schools. None. This is sickening. If that doesn't make me a "true" Gopher fan, so be it.

 

[Unregistered User]

How can a team like NDSU beat us handily with the majority of the roster MN players? Is it coaching or should we be giving more MN players a spot on our roster, there is obviously a lot of talent in this State. Too bad most of them play for NDSU.

And not a single one of the players on that team had even 1 single offer from a B10 team. There is a reason for that.

 

[jovs]

The people recruited into div 1 programs aren't neccessarily the best football players, they just have physical attributes that are deemed neccessary to succeed at that level (speed, size, etc). NDSU players were obviously better football players, no question about that.

 

[Breakin' The Plane]

A Big 10 school has lost 3 times to 1AA schools in 5 years. Has that happened at Duke? WSU? Minnesota is the absolute bottom of the barrell right now. Kill said some great things, but how much rope do you give a guy? System, players, blah, blah, blah...You can't lose these games.

 

[popeyoung5]

It's got nothing to do with "talent". NDSU gave a damn (see State Fairgrounds). MN didn't care. Jerry Kill is cute, but his time is running short. There is absolutely no excuse for a Big 10 school to lose to these schools. None. This is sickening. If that doesn't make me a "true" Gopher fan, so be it.

Kill needs 3 years to turn this mess around. The line play, power and technique is a joke on both sides of the ball.The seniors are punching a clock. It will change and Coach will get his guys playing his way.

 

[DiehardGopher]

Jerry Kill is cute, but his time is running short. There is absolutely no excuse for a Big 10 school to lose to these schools. None. This is sickening. If that doesn't make me a "true" Gopher fan, so be it.

So 4 games into Kill's first year and already you want him gone? Yep, you can get out now. We won't miss you.

 

[gopherguy71]

Kill needs 3 years to turn this mess around. The line play, power and technique is a joke on both sides of the ball.The seniors are punching a clock. It will change and Coach will get his guys playing his way.

Couldn't agree more that the Seniors are mailing it in at this point. Kill has all but said they suck when he talks about the lack of talent on this team. Might be time to cut bait with some of them, especially on defense.

 

[Breakin' The Plane]

Please defend yet another loss to a 1AA school. I'd love to hear the rationale. System, players,...blah, blah, blah. There's no exuse for another loss to a 1AA school. It's happened at Mich. It's happened at VaTech. How did they rebound?

 

[KTF]

I think you guys are being to hard on your coaches. DO you honestly think that NDSU has always played like this? Look at their record in 2009 and 2008... 2009 they were 3-8. 2008 they were 6-5 with serious disappointment in the program. In 2003, when Bohl came to NDSU he cleaned house and instilled a new offense/densive scheme. It took most of the year for the players to "buy into the system" He also scoured the community college for transfers to fill voids in the roster.

Kill opted to honor the commitments from the Brewster recruits instead of bringing in his own. Right now Kill needs to get through the season and lay the foundation for this years recruiting class. He also has 51 freshmen on the roster that all need game experience, this is going to take time.

NDSU does not have more talent but they have coaches that have a long tenure with the program and run the same system for years. Kill brought his system guys with him. Once that is instilled and they have the right players it will work, trust them...

Unfortunately, nothing againist U of MN but more BCS level, they only play 11-12 possibly 13 games. NDSU played 14 games (3 playoff) last year which gave them extra practice time and extra game time. This will make a difference in a program.

Keep your head up guys, it will get better!!

 

[Gopherphile]

How can a team like NDSU beat us handily with the majority of the roster MN players? Is it coaching or should we be giving more MN players a spot on our roster, there is obviously a lot of talent in this State. Too bad most of them play for NDSU.

the majority of their players are not from mn - that's just being lazy in checking in on the facts. by my count, 15 players in their two deeps were from mn, so let's say one third of their roster or so. of those, the three that might be able to help the gophers are marcus williams, billy turner and zach vraa. so we've missed three players that might help us quite a bit - that's not undervaluing the state of mn in my book. those are nice players, but ndsu has made a living doing this - mcnorton, jensen, the safety from wi, ojuri, the lb from sioux falls - all nice gets imo.

 

[Replacement Gopher]

I don't want to hear anyone complaining about signing kids with offers from Western Michigan any more. I'd gladly take Western Michigan's team right now.

 

[GreasyGopher]

A Big 10 school has lost 3 times to 1AA schools in 5 years. Has that happened at Duke? WSU? Minnesota is the absolute bottom of the barrell right now. Kill said some great things, but how much rope do you give a guy? System, players, blah, blah, blah...You can't lose these games.

Do you realize that Brewster is responsible for the majority of the mess you mention above? How much rope do you give a guy? Seriously? Kill isn't going to be able to fix the mess Brewster made of the program in his 4 years in 4 games.

 

[two red dogs]

It's got nothing to do with "talent". NDSU gave a damn (see State Fairgrounds). MN didn't care. Jerry Kill is cute, but his time is running short. There is absolutely no excuse for a Big 10 school to lose to these schools. None. This is sickening. If that doesn't make me a "true" Gopher fan, so be it.

How would you know what a true Gopher fan if you are not one yourself. Your coach has played what - 4 games? He is a good coach who needs time like any other unless they are following a stable program. Brewster did you no favors. Kill will get it right but it will take time. I would say let all fair weather Gopher fans go.

 

[BMEnGopher]

Simple answer: no.

 

[BisonGopher]

And not a single one of the players on that team had even 1 single offer from a B10 team. There is a reason for that.

I'd like to hope that the reason is NOT because part of being a head coach at a Big Ten school means that you have to impress people with your recruiting rankings from rivals and other fraudulent sites like rivals. IE, you're not allowed to recruit local kids because that would drag your rivals "star rating" down - which is simply not acceptable at Big Ten school. A Big Ten school has to have a top rivals rating, so you have to go to Florida, South Carolina, Texas, California, etc. and beg kids to come to a cold state that they know nothing about, have never visited before, have no family near and never planned to go to. Because that's where the "top ranked" football players live.


Like I said - I'd like to hope that isn't the reason.

 

[TCF=UnitedWeStand]

And not a single one of the players on that team had even 1 single offer from a B10 team. There is a reason for that.

+1. The reason isn't because they didn't have "stars". The reason is because other coaches, for whatever reason, didn't feel the kids were talented enough to impact a Big Ten football team. Do other D1 schools besides MN recruit MN kids? Last I checked, schools such as USC, Notre Dame, Wisconson, Nebraska, Iowa, and more recently, even Auburn, have been recruiting MN for a LONG time. Do you people think these schools didn't know about Billy Turner (playing at Mounds View), or the D-Back from Hopkins, or Veldman (who played in the state semis - when college coaches from everywhere are there because there are the most games in one place in one weekend - and the prep bowl, if I recall). These players were seen by coaches from a lot of other D1 schools besides MN and not offered.

Maybe they were deemed to maybe be talented enough, but the coaches were scared off by something else - bad attitude, poor grades, disciplinary issues, etc, etc. It's REAL easy for outsiders such as most of us to sit back and say "the Gophers are idiots for not offering that kid", but we don't know the half of it.

And on the flip side, there may be guys the Gophers recruited that were also fringe D1 guys that were highly recommended by their h.s. coaches for being talented and great kids. However, those same kids may have proven to not have the desire to work/compete when they began to face other really talented competition.

Every year there are hundreds of kids that are considered "fringe" d1 players, if not thousands. Out of those that do not get that d1 offer, there is bound to be some exceptions. And we don't know if, had any of these NDSU guys gone to the U, how they would have responded to coaching changes, big city campus, additional competition for playing time, etc, etc.

Bottom line - for whatever reason, most of the kids at NDSU are at NDSU because that's where they deserved to be at the end of their h.s. career. And for guys like Turner, Veldman, the DBack from Hopkins - congratulations to them for working hard, developing in a good (and consistent) system, and becoming very good college football players.

 

[maxwellsmart]

It's got nothing to do with "talent". NDSU gave a damn (see State Fairgrounds). MN didn't care. Jerry Kill is cute, but his time is running short. There is absolutely no excuse for a Big 10 school to lose to these schools. None. This is sickening. If that doesn't make me a "true" Gopher fan, so be it.

what it makes you is ignorant about the current college fb picture and the dynamics of this particular matchup.

 

[BisonGopher]

+1. The reason isn't because they didn't have "stars". The reason is because other coaches, for whatever reason, didn't feel the kids were talented enough to impact a Big Ten football team. Do other D1 schools besides MN recruit MN kids? Last I checked, schools such as USC, Notre Dame, Wisconson, Nebraska, Iowa, and more recently, even Auburn, have been recruiting MN for a LONG time. Do you people think these schools didn't know about Billy Turner (playing at Mounds View), or the D-Back from Hopkins, or Veldman (who played in the state semis - when college coaches from everywhere are there because there are the most games in one place in one weekend - and the prep bowl, if I recall). These players were seen by coaches from a lot of other D1 schools besides MN and not offered.

Maybe they were deemed to maybe be talented enough, but the coaches were scared off by something else - bad attitude, poor grades, disciplinary issues, etc, etc. It's REAL easy for outsiders such as most of us to sit back and say "the Gophers are idiots for not offering that kid", but we don't know the half of it.

And on the flip side, there may be guys the Gophers recruited that were also fringe D1 guys that were highly recommended by their h.s. coaches for being talented and great kids. However, those same kids may have proven to not have the desire to work/compete when they began to face other really talented competition.

Every year there are hundreds of kids that are considered "fringe" d1 players, if not thousands. Out of those that do not get that d1 offer, there is bound to be some exceptions. And we don't know if, had any of these NDSU guys gone to the U, how they would have responded to coaching changes, big city campus, additional competition for playing time, etc, etc.

Bottom line - for whatever reason, most of the kids at NDSU are at NDSU because that's where they deserved to be at the end of their h.s. career. And for guys like Turner, Veldman, the DBack from Hopkins - congratulations to them for working hard, developing in a good (and consistent) system, and becoming very good college football players.

Sorry, but you're exactly wrong.

If Billy Turner would've played HS in Ohio, he'd very likely be playing for a Big Ten team this instant and no lower than a MAC school. Maybe it would be Indiana, but a Big Ten nonetheless.


How do you think NDSU has made so much hay the last 30 years (see DII playoff runs from 1981-1990)?? Because no one recruits the upper midwest!!! They all have their heads up their rears about making sure their rivals star rankings are high enough.

You've got Minnesota and Wisconsin, who are too stuck up to recruit their own states and after that it was only Northern Iowa for a long time. Now the Dakota schools finally pulled their heads out of their rears and moved up to DI. Now upper midwest kids are finally getting their shot at DI instead of having to settle for the NCC (now NSIC).

 

[GophBen]

Quite a bit of the blame for this falls squarely on the shoulders of Minnesota high school coaches. Most of these guys (particularly outside the metro area) have no idea how to help a kid get noticed.

 

[TCF=UnitedWeStand]

Sorry, but you're exactly wrong.

If Billy Turner would've played HS in Ohio, he'd very likely be playing for a Big Ten team this instant and no lower than a MAC school. Maybe it would be Indiana, but a Big Ten nonetheless.


How do you think NDSU has made so much hay the last 30 years (see DII playoff runs from 1981-1990)?? Because no one recruits the upper midwest!!! They all have their heads up their rears about making sure their rivals star rankings are high enough.

You've got Minnesota and Wisconsin, who are too stuck up to recruit their own states and after that it was only Northern Iowa for a long time. Now the Dakota schools finally pulled their heads out of their rears and moved up to DI. Now upper midwest kids are finally getting their shot at DI instead of having to settle for the NCC (now NSIC).

And you can prove this how? So you're saying he was overlooked by all of these other Big Ten coaches? As a former relative of a Head College Football Coach, I promise you that YOU are wrong. They knew of Billy Turner, and for whatever reason, did not make an offer.

The fact of the matter is he played at Mounds View, a huge school in the largest Metro Area in the Upper Midwest (outside of Chicago), played in the State Tournament (I believe) and still received no other offers. Like I said, he's at NDSU and not somewhere else for a reason. And good for him - based upon what the paper and NDSU media said last week, he has developed into a good player (Saturday night was the first time I had ever seen Billy Turner play) that if he continues to develop and doesn't screw up, will I'm sure get an opportunity to play at the next level.

Or maybe you are right - Craig Bohl is smarter than Ferentz, Bielema, Weiss, Pete Caroll, Bo Pelini, etc, etc, all coaches who have taken MN kids in recent years. You think Wisconsin is too stuck up to recruit their own state? I think Wisconsin is doing just fine, actually, not just in their own state (they had their top RB and LB - two nationally recruited guys - locked up this past summer), but pretty much everywhere else. Or maybe Wisconsin and Iowa should ignore their previous strategies, and copy NDSU, or perhaps consult you, on how they should be recruiting.

I'm very familiar with NDSU's success in the 80's and 90's (there were several players from my h.s. that played there), but if you think any of those teams in the 80s would have beaten a Big Ten team in the eighties, you are an even bigger homer than your post indicates.