Did we lose any Gopherhole members during this turn around?

WorkingMyTailOff

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Remember the two competing groups we had here 4 weeks ago? There were those who were disappointed by the two losses to open the Big Ten and there were those that wanted the coach to resign or be fired. I hope that no matter where someone stood on that big topic, that everyone is now enjoying this run and having fun here discussing things like "how do we stop the Badgers rushing attack?". The Gophers need everyone on board supporting this team.
 

Frankly, I can't understand how some were ready to jettison Kill and Co. At that 0-2 Big Ten record point, it had been officially 2.5 years. Hardly enough time to know anything, really. And we had already seen the culture shift in the year before.

I'm a reactionary when it comes to some things (Souhan, Mason-revisionists, Badger sycophants, etc.), but the lack of patience by some was completely unreasonable.

That said, I hope they are back to fully get behind this team, and not be ready to walk away so easily if we lose to Wisconsin and MSU. Good things are happening. Stick around, enjoy the ride.
 

Lost Members

Remember the two competing groups we had here 4 weeks ago? There were those who were disappointed by the two losses to open the Big Ten and there were those that wanted the coach to resign or be fired. I hope that no matter where someone stood on that big topic, that everyone is now enjoying this run and having fun here discussing things like "how do we stop the Badgers rushing attack?". The Gophers need everyone on board supporting this team.

Yes, unfortunately we lost many members after the first 2 B10 games. We've been so successful over the years they just couldn't bear another bad season.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekQ_Ja02gTY
 

Frankly, I can't understand how some were ready to jettison Kill and Co. At that 0-2 Big Ten record point, it had been officially 2.5 years. Hardly enough time to know anything, really. And we had already seen the culture shift in the year before.

I'm a reactionary when it comes to some things (Souhan, Mason-revisionists, Badger sycophants, etc.), but the lack of patience by some was completely unreasonable.

That said, I hope they are back to fully get behind this team, and not be ready to walk away so easily if we lose to Wisconsin and MSU. Good things are happening. Stick around, enjoy the ride.

+1
 

Les Bolstan: "Yes, unfortunately we lost many members after the first 2 B10 games. We've been so successful over the years they just couldn't bear another bad season."

You have a unique way of displaying your sarcasm. Gotta admit that what you said made me laugh.
 


Frankly, I can't understand how some were ready to jettison Kill and Co. At that 0-2 Big Ten record point, it had been officially 2.5 years. Hardly enough time to know anything, really. And we had already seen the culture shift in the year before.

I'm a reactionary when it comes to some things (Souhan, Mason-revisionists, Badger sycophants, etc.), but the lack of patience by some was completely unreasonable.

That said, I hope they are back to fully get behind this team, and not be ready to walk away so easily if we lose to Wisconsin and MSU. Good things are happening. Stick around, enjoy the ride.

You have identified the two drivers as to why some people may have been ready to jettison Kill. The first was lack of patience and the second was unwillingness to see or understand all the good things that were happening to build this program on solid ground. Instead of focusing on this some people were focusing on wins and losses. This is neither helpful or productive during at the initial stages of rebuilding a program and its culture. If you don't believe that check out Barry Alvarez beginning record.

If a person attended any of the open sessions during spring practice the first three years you couldn't help but to notice the improvement and the buy in by the players. The improvement in academics, player retention rate, the acceptance of Kill's rule by Carter, Hageman an others was significant. It should have been clear that the program was going in the right direction. But according to GopherHoler Les Bolstad's the problem was that "Unfortunately we lost many members after the first 2 B10 games. We've been so successful over the years they just couldn't bear another bad season." To me again that shows again a complete lack of patience and awareness as to how the program was going to be rebuilt and the accomplishments that had already been achieved.

Instead of recognizing that some people were more interested in arguing about when should Kill be fired.
 

If we lose the next two games I GUARANTEE there will be posts saying this proves we can't compete with the top of the B1G, Kill must go, bring Mason back, rinse & repeat. Some people simply want to be oppositional, no matter what.
 

I don't recall "fire Kill" being a mantra from on field performance. There were those that wanted him gone because of his illness and inability to work the sidelines. I think Kill has shown that he can coach from the press box just as effectively and it has shut up his detractors.

I was in the group that was calling for Limegrover's head. If he wasn't going to open the offense up and actually run plays, game plan and intend to win, then what was the point. We played the first 6 games running about 40% of our offensive packages. If we had continued down that path...no way we are 8-2 now (not my words, Limegrover has stated several times that after MI they sad down and decided to open the play book and run the full offense and just see what happens.) What happened is players stepped up. Our QBs stepped up. Our WRs stepped up. And our OLine and Cobb stepped up. Thats what high character, talented players do when challenged..they step up.

I said it after the NW game, I think Kill in the press box with Limegrover has forced him to call the game differently and he certainly is planning much better than before.

And frankly, if we go back to running that vanilla two scoop sh_it cone we were running, I will again be calling for his head. I don't care how many threads or posts the biatches that run this forum delete...my opinion hasn't changed.
 

If we lose the next two games I GUARANTEE there will be posts saying this proves we can't compete with the top of the B1G, Kill must go, bring Mason back, rinse & repeat. Some people simply want to be oppositional, no matter what.

+1
 



MPLSBucky is no longer part of GH....our success drove him to the edge.
 

The Iowa game really turned a lot of us off - it was a total beatdown, though I posted at the time that Kill should have five full years. The dull offense was part of that disappointment - and now both Claeys and Limegrover say they "opened up the playbook" after Iowa, and Limey that it was a mistake not to have done so earlier. So the critics can find some justification there. Plus both coaches say the players are having a lot more fun now - and it shows. Can't imagine anyone would not rally to a really surprising 8-2 record.
 

And frankly, if we go back to running that vanilla two scoop sh_it cone we were running, I will again be calling for his head. I don't care how many threads or posts the biatches that run this forum delete...my opinion hasn't changed.

Boy, that'll make Limegrover and Kill keep the offense humming. Nobody would want to feel your wrath. Not sure how anyone who saw or knew about how Northern Illinois's offense march up and down the field when they beat the Gophers would doubt these guys can coach. They were disciplined, tough, and kept us off balance damn near the whole time. Didn't expect four wins in a row, but you could see even in the Michigan game they were on the right path. They were too stubborn in trying to establish a tough, run first offense, but maybe that allowed them to open things up. Works both ways; players buy in, execution of basics is better, allows you to do more.
 

I don't recall "fire Kill" being a mantra from on field performance. There were those that wanted him gone because of his illness and inability to work the sidelines. I think Kill has shown that he can coach from the press box just as effectively and it has shut up his detractors.

I was in the group that was calling for Limegrover's head. If he wasn't going to open the offense up and actually run plays, game plan and intend to win, then what was the point. We played the first 6 games running about 40% of our offensive packages. If we had continued down that path...no way we are 8-2 now (not my words, Limegrover has stated several times that after MI they sad down and decided to open the play book and run the full offense and just see what happens.) What happened is players stepped up. Our QBs stepped up. Our WRs stepped up. And our OLine and Cobb stepped up. Thats what high character, talented players do when challenged..they step up.

I said it after the NW game, I think Kill in the press box with Limegrover has forced him to call the game differently and he certainly is planning much better than before.

And frankly, if we go back to running that vanilla two scoop sh_it cone we were running, I will again be calling for his head. I don't care how many threads or posts the biatches that run this forum delete...my opinion hasn't changed.

Sorry, but this is borderline ridiculous. I just can't understand your mindset. Kill's system has worked at every stop and Limegrover has been there for the last three. You think he was calling bad or bland plays because Kill wasn't there to watch over him. LMAO. You think he was too lazy to open it up? Sheesh. You think everybody else wanted something different, but he resisted them all? C'mon, you have to be smarter than that...because you can type. Kill runs this team and he is more involved in the offensive strategy than the defense, trusting that mostly to Claeys. Yes, Limegrover admitted that they did some soul searching and opened things up. Because they're good coaches. So, shut up and let them do their jobs. You and your lynch mob friends are part of the problem we're trying to correct.
 



So, shut up and let them do their jobs. You and your lynch mob friends are part of the problem we're trying to correct.

Who is the "we" you speak of? Is this Coach Limegrover? Or AJ's Mom's best friend?

I get that you want to attribute the significant shift in play calling the last 4 games to "they are doing what they always do" but in fact, they weren't doing those things. They weren't running the offense that they ran at NIU. They weren't running the offense from the bowl game. They weren't doing then what they are doing now and if they would have continued to do what was failing it would make perfect sense for us, as fans, who pay for these guys to make 6 and 7 figure paychecks to voice our opinions...which I did and will continue to do.

Maybe Kill being in the press box has nothing to do with it...maybe it does. My speculation is a good as yours. That Kill is in the press box now and he wasn't before is what makes my speculation reasonable...especially because Kill is an offensive coach. But hey, if I am wrong and you have actual evidence to this fact...feel free to shut me up. But you just telling me to shut up isn't likely to have an impact. In fact, I am certain it wont.
 

Who is the "we" you speak of? Is this Coach Limegrover? Or AJ's Mom's best friend?

I get that you want to attribute the significant shift in play calling the last 4 games to "they are doing what they always do" but in fact, they weren't doing those things. They weren't running the offense that they ran at NIU. They weren't running the offense from the bowl game. They weren't doing then what they are doing now and if they would have continued to do what was failing it would make perfect sense for us, as fans, who pay for these guys to make 6 and 7 figure paychecks to voice our opinions...which I did and will continue to do.

Maybe Kill being in the press box has nothing to do with it...maybe it does. My speculation is a good as yours. That Kill is in the press box now and he wasn't before is what makes my speculation reasonable...especially because Kill is an offensive coach. But hey, if I am wrong and you have actual evidence to this fact...feel free to shut me up. But you just telling me to shut up isn't likely to have an impact. In fact, I am certain it wont.

You're right. My bad. I was curbing my emotions and let them get the best of me. You have a right to voice your opinion, especially since those guys are making their big paychecks and, um, I'm guessing you aren't, but think you're smarter than them. I suppose you think the Gopher fan base would rather have you in charge than those that currently are. I disagree.

As for your speculation, it's wrong because it doesn't make sense. This isn't a staff of lazy incompetents that need someone to crack the whip and get them off their butts to do their jobs. They do it out of passion for the game, for people, for each other. If in your line of work the other way is practiced, I'm guessing their way (Kill and his staff) would be a lot more successful than the one you and your employers are using. Just a suggestion. There are other business models that work. I just prefer Kill's. No offense intended.
 

I was 100% behind Kill, Claeys, Limegrover, and everyone else after the the two losses. The four straight wins just prove that I was right.
 

Well, I guess I haven't seen Art Vandelay or Sportsfan24 here in a while..... :)
 

You're right. My bad. I was curbing my emotions and let them get the best of me. You have a right to voice your opinion, especially since those guys are making their big paychecks and, um, I'm guessing you aren't, but think you're smarter than them. I suppose you think the Gopher fan base would rather have you in charge than those that currently are. I disagree.

As for your speculation, it's wrong because it doesn't make sense. This isn't a staff of lazy incompetents that need someone to crack the whip and get them off their butts to do their jobs. They do it out of passion for the game, for people, for each other. If in your line of work the other way is practiced, I'm guessing their way (Kill and his staff) would be a lot more successful than the one you and your employers are using. Just a suggestion. There are other business models that work. I just prefer Kill's. No offense intended.

I always love the false correlation that paycheck size equates to brain power. I can never get enough of that false conclusion.
 

Well, I guess I haven't seen Art Vandelay or Sportsfan24 here in a while..... :)

Or Parski1 and that was the point I was hoping to make. Isn't it a good thing to have diverse opinions and personalities here as long as everyone is behind the student athletes?
 

Reasonable question nokomismod. Seems there were a few people who thought Kill should step-down for health reasons. The numbers were small and given everybody's ignorance about epilepsy, worrying about Kill's health was understandable. Questioning the Offense after the Iowa & Michigan games? How could you not? The QB decision against Iowa, the 2nd Half against Michigan? Scoring more than 13 points twice (44 & 17)in 10 B1G games? How could you not question it? The Coaching Staff questioned it. There weren't many people calling for Kill's resignation, maybe about the same number of people that were saying there was nothing wrong with the play calling and the Staff knew exactly what they were doing from the start.

Limegrover would disagree. Can't say that did anything but boost my faith in that staff, but don't blame people who questioned their decisions as much as they did themselves.

He said on Monday that the changes actually started after the Gophers lost Sept. 28 at TCF Bank Stadium to the Iowa Hawkeyes.

They got beaten that game for homecoming and scored just one touchdown. Then, the following week, Kill was unable to join the team in Michigan as the Wolverines whipped the Gophers, 42-13.

It was clear that something needed to change. And it appears that has happened, in the form of being more creative and aggressive.

"Absolutely. It's spot-on," Limegrover told 1500ESPN morning show hosts Judd Zulgad and Jeff Dubay. "We got to Iowa and really hit a snag there, hit a road block and didn't play well."

"We really took a look and said, 'OK, what do we need to do differently?' Because the formula we wanted to have, we're not quite there yet. 'What can we change? What can we do to give the kids the best chance moving forward.' We started moving towards what we're trying to do now
, getting more kids involved, young kids like Donovahn Jones and Drew Wolitarsky, getting involved the young wide receivers and trying to give those kids something different other than just ground-and-pound.

"When we started doing that we started noticing the kids get a little more excited and practices were becoming more fun and more loose and we were having fun doing it. It's just kind of evolved that way.

It was a combination of starting to trust the young kids, everybody starting to feel comfortable and then also the idea that we can't just turn around and hand the ball off 45 times and win games. We've got to do some things a little bit differently," Limegrover said.

The coordinator also said he thinks players, such as quarterback Philip Nelson, have started to play more loosely, as they better understand the pressures of the game.

"I wish we would have done it earlier but sometimes you've got to admit your mistakes. We're having a heck of a lot more fun in practice. We're letting the kids - with all the motions and movements and shifts - we're letting them be creative with that stuff... All we tell them is, 'hey, get to where you need to be so we can execute the play. I think those kids are enjoying it."
 

I actually miss Art. Can't remember who said it, but someone on here once said something to the effect of "Art's a dink, but he owns it." He totally owned it, and made the board a more colorful place.
 

We'll see all of our favorites back here someday, when the chips are down and they smell blood again.

I have no problem reading a negative slanted opinion when it comes from an educated or fact based argument. The big, big problem i see is alot of those negative types are also too critical and stubborn to do any thinking. They assume alot, often being very wrong, and then they get stuck rehashing their opinion again and again until they regard it as fact. This is especially true for this coaching staff who have done this before, expected the tough times, and persevered because they quite frankly knew things most fans/media didn't.

I love the fact that Kill and Co basically told everyone exactly what they were going to do: build a solid program not taking shortcuts.
How it was going to happen: slowly, with alot of bumps in the road.
When it was going to happen: After the players start to believe in the coaches' systems' and beat a team the program has struggled against for a long time boosting their confidence.

Go back and read some of the threads post Michigan, it's pretty funny actually some of the things people said. The "I could use a boost thread is a good one"
 

Or Parski1 and that was the point I was hoping to make.

parski1 was banned, right?

And I'm guessing that we lost some members, or they choose not to post now, but I don't think we lost any fans from the board.
 

Reasonable question nokomismod. Seems there were a few people who thought Kill should step-down for health reasons. The numbers were small and given everybody's ignorance about epilepsy, worrying about Kill's health was understandable. Questioning the Offense after the Iowa & Michigan games? How could you not? The QB decision against Iowa, the 2nd Half against Michigan? Scoring more than 13 points twice (44 & 17)in 10 B1G games? How could you not question it? The Coaching Staff questioned it. There weren't many people calling for Kill's resignation, maybe about the same number of people that were saying there was nothing wrong with the play calling and the Staff knew exactly what they were doing from the start.

There were statements made by coaches after the Iowa game that stated it was more about technique than getting manhandled, although it appeared that way to the average fan. Without throwing kids under the bus, the staff was saying they could show the players on film how they could have won the game. The psychology of this whole turnaround is why some of us said to trust the staff -- they know what they're doing. The game is all about adjustments. This staff can do it. They can even do it "at this level." They find ways to get players to play to their potential.

I like the fact that the players and coaches are taking blame and deflecting credit.
 

We'll see all of our favorites back here someday, when the chips are down and they smell blood again.

I have no problem reading a negative slanted opinion when it comes from an educated or fact based argument. The big, big problem i see is alot of those negative types are also too critical and stubborn to do any thinking. They assume alot, often being very wrong, and then they get stuck rehashing their opinion again and again until they regard it as fact. This is especially true for this coaching staff who have done this before, expected the tough times, and persevered because they quite frankly knew things most fans/media didn't.

I love the fact that Kill and Co basically told everyone exactly what they were going to do: build a solid program not taking shortcuts.
How it was going to happen: slowly, with alot of bumps in the road.
When it was going to happen: After the players start to believe in the coaches' systems' and beat a team the program has struggled against for a long time boosting their confidence.

Go back and read some of the threads post Michigan, it's pretty funny actually some of the things people said. The "I could use a boost thread is a good one"

Well said, but some folks aren't even waiting for the chips to be down to warn us how they're going to instantly jump ship. lol
 

There were statements made by coaches after the Iowa game that stated it was more about technique than getting manhandled, although it appeared that way to the average fan. Without throwing kids under the bus, the staff was saying they could show the players on film how they could have won the game. The psychology of this whole turnaround is why some of us said to trust the staff -- they know what they're doing. The game is all about adjustments. This staff can do it. They can even do it "at this level." They find ways to get players to play to their potential.

I like the fact(s) that the players and coaches are taking blame and deflecting credit.

When they support your theories yeah, otherwise? I'll go with Limegrover on this not some "average fan" on the internet. :eek:
 

When they support your theories yeah, otherwise? I'll go with Limegrover on this not some "average fan" on the internet. :eek:

Are you getting after me again? I can take it but I don't understand your point.
 

A quarter of the regular posters are trolls. Of course they disappeared.
 

Are you getting after me again? I can take it but I don't understand your point.

Maybe I don't understand yours. The complaints about the Offense in hindsight may have been valid for the San Jose State game. The complaints for the Iowa game where very valid. They looked reasonable and sounded reasonable at the time. They were even a little valid for Michigan. Limegrover and even Claeys said so themselves.

Sending the RBs and yes QB's between the Guards again and again didn't work with the personnel they had and the talent and fronts the other team had. They weren't going to until they completed some passes or gained some yards "outside" to loosen things up in the middle. They saw that and to their great credit, they recognized their mistakes, admitted them and corrected them.

Reading your posts you seem to think that they were lying to protect their players and anyone who disagreed with that then or now is an..well at least you didn't say idiot or ignorant this time. :eek:

Don't know if you were going on and on back then to protect the Coaches or you really didn't see what was happening.

Do what you want, say what you want; it's the internet and t's still America right?! :cool:

Just let the rest of us take Limegrover at his word. He's come off as quite honest in the past and our "eyes and ears" agree with him on this one.
 

I have no problem reading a negative slanted opinion when it comes from an educated or fact based argument. The big, big problem i see is alot of those negative types are also too critical and stubborn to do any thinking. They assume alot, often being very wrong, and then they get stuck rehashing their opinion again and again until they regard it as fact. This is especially true for this coaching staff who have done this before, expected the tough times, and persevered because they quite frankly knew things most fans/media didn't.

I love the fact that Kill and Co basically told everyone exactly what they were going to do: build a solid program not taking shortcuts.
How it was going to happen: slowly, with alot of bumps in the road.

Loved and agree with both of these statements, Ole.
 




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