Did PJ semi-sandbag this season because of early signing day??

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csom_1991 said:
Early in the season, PJ quit on the team (Year Zero nonsense), late in the season, the team quit on PJ. There was no method to this madness and we are in worse shape entering next season than we were entering this one. Losing is a cultural issue and this season will stick with the players for the next few years. I don't think there was a single game this season where the team really played above their ability - you could argue Nebraska but I think that was more Nebraska's doing than ours.
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This is really sound analysis.

You've made several points that can't be disputed.

1. PJ quit on the team. Because he said year zero. This lead the whole team into disarray. Examples of this are all of those losses we had.

2. There is no method to PJ's madness. It's like he doesn't have a 5 minute definition for everything he says, or examples that he ties to what he says. He just yells words and it's all just words with no meaning or anything. With the team already lost, his words were just words on words.

3. The team quit on the coach. They have learned to lose and it will stick with them. They have gotten so good at losing, they didn't even score the last couple weeks of the season. Not only are they losing, but the players who were backing up the starters who got injured were not only bad, they played below their level of ability because they had already stopped buying in to PJ.

All of this of course resulted in our best players transferring and a very weak recruiting class.
We are doomed.

Well said and well explained with valid examples and analogies to prove your point.
Have you ever thought of becoming a lawyer?
 

The Fleck die-hards are celebrating now with the apparent success of the recruiting class.

But - be careful what you wish for.

Last year, we kept hearing about lack of talent and lack of depth. the recruiting class will address some of those concerns. If Fleck has a similar class - or even close to it next year, the 'lack of talent' and 'lack of depth' arguments won't fly anymore.

the better Fleck does in recruiting, the more that shifts the onus onto the coaching staff to coach and develop the players.

If - and I say If - we accept the "Fleck is a great recruiter" argument, that means by extension that the only thing that will keep the team from winning is poor coaching. Because they will have such great recruits, they should win with adequate coaching.
 

If you really think PJ intentionally allowed this team to lose games to better focus on recruiting for next year then you better start checking your rear view mirrors for the black helicopters he sends to quash your outing of his nefarious plan.
 

Wins and losses have no affect on time spent recruiting.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
The Fleck die-hards are celebrating now with the apparent success of the recruiting class.

But - be careful what you wish for.

Last year, we kept hearing about lack of talent and lack of depth. the recruiting class will address some of those concerns. If Fleck has a similar class - or even close to it next year, the 'lack of talent' and 'lack of depth' arguments won't fly anymore.

the better Fleck does in recruiting, the more that shifts the onus onto the coaching staff to coach and develop the players.

If - and I say If - we accept the "Fleck is a great recruiter" argument, that means by extension that the only thing that will keep the team from winning is poor coaching. Because they will have such great recruits, they should win with adequate coaching.
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Yes, but why worry about that today? Enjoy the process. If - and I say If- on field success doesn't occur it's okay to change your opinion of the situation.
 


Bring back the Axe said:
I'm not saying he out-and-out tanked it, but with the new early signing day, not having to do bowl prep or hold
practices freed him up to really hit recruiting hard for next season, and gave him a leg up on similar mediocre but bowl-bound teams.

With the new recruiting schedule, it seems to me that if you're not an 8+ win team, you're better off being a 5 win team and devoting yourself completely to closing on recruits in December.
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I think you dropped this.

ef660172a5582df7f878b462e6a2fc8b.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Face The Facts said:
This is really sound analysis.

You've made several points that can't be disputed.

1. PJ quit on the team. Because he said year zero. This lead the whole team into disarray. Examples of this are all of those losses we had.

2. There is no method to PJ's madness. It's like he doesn't have a 5 minute definition for everything he says, or examples that he ties to what he says. He just yells words and it's all just words with no meaning or anything. With the team already lost, his words were just words on words.

3. The team quit on the coach. They have learned to lose and it will stick with them. They have gotten so good at losing, they didn't even score the last couple weeks of the season. Not only are they losing, but the players who were backing up the starters who got injured were not only bad, they played below their level of ability because they had already stopped buying in to PJ.

All of this of course resulted in our best players transferring and a very weak recruiting class.
We are doomed.

Well said and well explained with valid examples and analogies to prove your point.
Have you ever thought of becoming a lawyer?
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I'm detecting your sarcasm
 

BadassMotherFlecker said:
I think you dropped this.

ef660172a5582df7f878b462e6a2fc8b.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Haha, I was wondering where that went !

Well if that was the plan, it sure seemed to work out great. He signed a great class. I don't think there will ever be a doubt about PJ's recruiting prowess, but now he needs to show he can coach them up !
 





csom_1991 said:
Early in the season, PJ quit on the team (Year Zero nonsense), late in the season, the team quit on PJ. There was no method to this madness and we are in worse shape entering next season than we were entering this one. Losing is a cultural issue and this season will stick with the players for the next few years. I don't think there was a single game this season where the team really played above their ability - you could argue Nebraska but I think that was more Nebraska's doing than ours.
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Totally. Because at kickoff of the 2nd half of the Iowa game next year, I totally think the ALL players will be thinking about losing in the fourth quarter to Maryland at home in 2017. That is TOTALLY how football works. :rolleyes:

GOOD LORD.
 

Losing games is never a good thing. Not going to a bowl game is never a good thing. He gets paid to recruit and go o bowl games. He talked all season about not wanting to take red shirts off players. Well those players could use the extra organized practices. If his plan want to "tank" to recruit better then I think he is not getting enough done. We are already behind Wisconsin for 2019. I use Wisconsin because they have won the West twice in a row and have seemed to be able to recruit at the same time.
 

Fleck often said that he wanted to install a new "culture". (So tired of that word!) In so doing I think he was willing to take some risks. For example, he wanted to make an example of Croft after the Oregon State game to set a tone for player behavioral expectations. He stuck to the suspension even when it seemed clear that Croft's running ability would have helped the offense in the Maryland and Purdue losses (when Rhoda hardly ever kept the ball on option reads). He didn't lose games directly but I think he did put his principles ahead of wins and losses in that case.
 



Face The Facts said:
This is really sound analysis.
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"1. PJ quit on the team. Because he said year zero. This lead the whole team into disarray. Examples of this are all of those losses we had."

Yeah, he basically told the team it would be a bad year. And guess what, he was right. The seniors were sold out by this mentality.

"2. He just yells words and it's all just words with no meaning or anything." Oh you are right - "Row the boat" is profound. Sorry, I want more Nick Saban and a little less Tony Robbins/Tim Brewster. Tell, me, you still have your "I like my chili hot' shirt?

"3. The team quit on the coach. " What do you call you starting QB announcing that he is leaving and not even attending the banquet? You think he is the only one?

"They have gotten so good at losing, they didn't even score the last couple weeks of the season. Not only are they losing, but the players who were backing up the starters who got injured were not only bad, they played below their level of ability because they had already stopped buying in to PJ."

Pretty much. Tell me, which position showed any improvement in scheme, play, etc throughout the season? The only part of the game that ramped up their efforts were the PJ apologists.

"Have you ever thought of becoming a lawyer?"

You you ever considered consulting a proctologist to help with your vision issue? Does not have to be dark always.
 

the.chucker said:
or even if he didn't try his god damned hardest to win every f8cking game...BS thread...sorry
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You are changing the question - and the answer.


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Threads like this definitely (if read) make the actual football staff pass it around, roll their eyes and laugh until they cry.

This isn’t the NBA where tanking can change a franchise in a year or two. A good salesman can sell hope and playing time for a year or two at a P5 program but beyond that there’s only disadvantages to losing. Recruting and otherwise. Would they not have gotten the IMG guys if they accidentally beat a top 5 team on national TV and made a distracting bowl game?

:rolleyes:
 

Pretty funny premise. Facts don't back it up.

1) The only people that quit are the players that are no longer here.

2) The people that didn't quit and believe in the program are still here.

End of thread.
 

highwayman said:
Pretty funny premise. Facts don't back it up.

1) The only people that quit are the players that are no longer here.

2) The people that didn't quit and believe in the program are still here.

End of thread.
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Was the premise of this thread discussing who quit/didn't quit?


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I'm guessing each person can find evidence to support whichever argument they want to make should they look hard enough.





Regarding SON's statement.
Yes, if we have 2-3-4 good recruiting classes in a row and we finish 5-7 or worse every year, we'll have to wonder what's going wrong with the coaching.

It will be nice this year to have enough offensive lineman (and hopefully CB's) who can play.
 


You can't even buy tin-foil, anymore. It's all aluminum foil ...
 

This thread is 100% proof that crackheads have internet access.

Is there really anything more to say on the topic? No.
 

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