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Schnauzer

Schnauzer

Pretty Sure You are Wrong
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I am continually amazed at the perception within the state that the Gopher football program is currently "horrible". That word is thrown around a lot when describing the team. I see it here on Gopher Hole all the time. I'm sure we'd all like the team to be winning more than it has in the last 40+ years. I get that, and I can subscribe to that. 2007 was horrible by anyone's definition. But, both prior to and after that the team has hovered in a range of mediocre, disappointing, etc. but not "horrible." I'd say the program as a whole was "horrible" for a big part of the 90's and that is probably when the biggest part of the fair-weather fan base checked out.

I guess what bugs me is locally the team is referred to as if it goes 0-12 every year. I was reminded of this recently as I was up at the cabin, wearing a "Minnesota Football" sweatshirt. I stopped in the local bar for some lunch and two complete strangers started talking to me about the "horrible" football team. When did the expectations get soooo high that .500 seasons can be described as horrible? It reminds me of the difficult task this team has to win over the fan base. An 8-4 season would probably leave a large remaining group describing the team as horrible. It really is going to take a rose bowl to be described as anything but horrible. Clearly, that is overdue but it sure is a tall order for a "starting point" to be described as "okay".
 

I know

Charles Barkley called us a --terrible---team.
 

There are a lot of fans out there who wish their team was as good as the Gophers. Part of it is the media, part of it is fans who go hat-in-hand to our rivals for a validation which will never be forthcoming - nor should it, it's not our rivals job to give validation. People need to understand that, and quit treating rivals as if they are giving a disinterested opinion.

People who blather about how horrible the team is, when the team is really mediocre are either 1) smack talkers or 2) ignorant buffoons who haven't examined for themselves whether the Gophers are horrible, but merely parroting what someone else said.

A big chunk of the problem is Minnesota humility. How in the world is it a BAD THING to be a "homer"? If you're at all optimistic about the Gophers, you're dismissed as a "homer".
 

good points and I agree with you. but to the average sports and non-Gopher football Minnesota sports fan that we hope to engage, its true breakout season or bust. that means beating two of the following usc, ohio state and penn state and beating one of the following wisconsin, iowa. going 3-1 in non-conf without a usc win and beating illinois, northwestern and purdue might as well be 'horrible' as the non Gopher football fan could care less.

break out season or bust.
 

Whether its fair or not, the results versus Iowa and Wisconsin are magnified. Our 1-11 record versus our rivals in the past 6 seasons is horrible; therefor when people disproportionately focus on those teams, the resulting opinion is that the Gophers are horrible.

Our team has two opportunities to drastically change local opinion this season. How nuts would this board go with a win against either of our border rivals?

Go Gophers!
 


I don't think most Minnesotans think the Gophers are horrible, truthfully they are just indifferent to them. Unfortunately most Minnesotans have tuned the the Gophers out for a long time. The last time the Gophers were good was when they collapsed against Michigan and that is the last times that most Minnesotans cared. Brewster hasn't helped the cause regarding the Gophers as he has overly hyped the Gophers by making dumb statements, lost far more games than won, made lots of poor coaching decisons, changed his offense and coaches several times and is now recruiting similarily to what Mason was. Bottom line, the program has been more hype under him than positive reality and Minnesotans are still waiting for the "proof to be in the pudding" as they say. Further, in the fall, the avg Minnesotan can watch the Twins and Vikings contend or watch the Gophers pretend. We are big fans but most people would rather watch a winner and until the Gophers change the corner most Minnesotan's wont care or will put them down as below avg or worse.
 

I don't think that people are overly focusing on games versus rivals, they are just parroting what the local media. In most areas, the local media spins like a top for the local team. Here, the media spins in reverse.

Or maybe if someone gives you a hard time because you're wearing a Gophers shirt, tell them to bug*er off. We need a little more "we're not taking crap from you" attitude.
 

loki said:
I don't think most Minnesotans think the Gophers are horrible, truthfully they are just indifferent to them.
Click to expand...

Yikes - indifference is worse than thinking they are "horrible." Those saying horrible at least care.


Charles Barkley called us a --terrible---team.
Click to expand...


I'll bet he actually said "turrible."
 

I lived in Minneapolis for four years (ending in 2009), and I found it difficult to strike up a conversation regarding the Gophers. There just isn't much interest. The Vikings were the team everyone wanted to talk about.
 



I don't think that anyone here would be considered a fair weather fan. For the Gopher's football team to make it into the forefront of the collective minds of Minnesotans, the "undecided-middle" is what needs to be swayed.

Now, if we assume that those potential fans consider themselves to be fans of sports in general, you need to appreciate where they get their information; the local papers and talk radio. And we don't have to rehash the rehash of how the U is generally covered by reporters who are either ill informed, under informed or fail to work hard to get cromulent information to the masses.

And face it, it is much easier to write or talk about how "horrible" this team is than to work harder to uncover interesting story lines, or do the heavy lifting to inform what this team is trying to accomplish, or get them to understand how the nature of the team (speed, athleticism) is starting to transform.

Personally, I don't see any of the local media stepping up to inform the unwashed masses in the manner I would prefer to see. So, unfortunately, I think the way into the hearts and minds of Minnesotans is through winning, and winning big.
 

For the most part, during the last 10 years, the Gophers have been an average team. They had 3 years above average, 2003, 2004 and 2005, and one year terrible year in 2007. The other 6 were plainly average. I prefer to not use mediocre because it means not very good, whereas average means a middle of the road team, not great, but not bad.

Source for this conclusion is Sagarin:
Minnesota's rankings by year:
2009 64 Minnesota
2008 75 Minnesota
2007 123 Minnesota
2006 48 Minnesota
2005 27 Minnesota
2004 38 Minnesota
2003 24 Minnesota
2002 46 Minnesota
2001 69 Minnesota
2000 62 Minnesota
 

When people call into a certain unnamed radio station, and want to talk about the Gophers, the hosts just rip on the caller. It's this Minnesota humility that just has people get sand kicked in their faces and smile about it.
 

We're not competitive against Iowa and Wisconsin. That's a full notch worse than losing to them more often than not.
 



Mediocre and average do mean the same thing, although mediocre does have far more negative connotations.
 

Schnauzer said:
I am continually amazed at the perception within the state that the Gopher football program is currently "horrible". That word is thrown around a lot when describing the team. I see it here on Gopher Hole all the time. I'm sure we'd all like the team to be winning more than it has in the last 40+ years. I get that, and I can subscribe to that. 2007 was horrible by anyone's definition. But, both prior to and after that the team has hovered in a range of mediocre, disappointing, etc. but not "horrible." I'd say the program as a whole was "horrible" for a big part of the 90's and that is probably when the biggest part of the fair-weather fan base checked out.

I guess what bugs me is locally the team is referred to as if it goes 0-12 every year. I was reminded of this recently as I was up at the cabin, wearing a "Minnesota Football" sweatshirt. I stopped in the local bar for some lunch and two complete strangers started talking to me about the "horrible" football team. When did the expectations get soooo high that .500 seasons can be described as horrible? It reminds me of the difficult task this team has to win over the fan base. An 8-4 season would probably leave a large remaining group describing the team as horrible. It really is going to take a rose bowl to be described as anything but horrible. Clearly, that is overdue but it sure is a tall order for a "starting point" to be described as "okay".
Click to expand...

It's the Offensive impotence. Casual Gopher fans of the last 15 years or had gotten use to the Gophers being always able to score. Even in Brewster's lousy first year they put points on the board. The talk always was "if they just could put some DEFENSE out there we'd be heading to a New Year's Bowl.

Well, last year they got the Defense, unfortunately the Offense, particularly in November was beyond lousy.

Just look back. They got shut out at Penn State. A game that the Defense keep them in for quite awhile without getting any Offensive support. Then they got one touchdown against the Buckeyes.

Michigan State comes to town and the Offense roars back into place. The penalties where a source of much discussion by the detractors, but the casual fans, not those on this board mind you, became excited about the team. They thought the Defense now had a partner.

What happened? The Offense stunk it up in the first half against the Illini, put 16 up against the Jackrabbits, ZERO against the hated Hawkeyes (next time kick the damn Field Goal) and 13
against the Cyclones.

The team gave 39 points total in the last three games. The high was 14 points and they won one of them. A three point victory against the Jackrabbits. A victory that was treated like a loss.

You might here again and again and again about how "Defense wins games", but you still have to put some points on the board.

People have given-up for a number of reasons of a historical nature around here but I think it might be even more basic then that.

Those casual fans, much like the National experts think the Offense isn't going to get any better while the Defense, because of the 7-Starter loss, is going to get worse. Many of us might disagree but honestly, it's a reasonable assumption.
 

The smack talkers will always be there, they said the same things even during the better years under Mason. It's the Minnesota humility.

Gopher gear is pretty hard to find outside of the metro area, yet I still see people wearing Gopher caps all over the state. I think the apathy is not as great as it seems. The smack talkers seem HIGHLY motivated by the Gophers. People in the outstate are sitting on their couches watching the Gophers. They just think they are the only ones out there.
 

I'm a huge fan myself but really -- what have the Gophers actually done on the field to win over sports fans? For every big win, if we're being honest, we can think of 2-3 heartbreaking losses. It is tough to cheer for a team that regularly loses to its rivals.
 


Oh, good, let's be honest now, because everyone else was lying their asses off. :mad:

Lets not view everything through the smack talkers' eyes. The apathy towards Gopher sports is not as large is it might sometimes seem.
 


loki said:
Win more often and there will be more cheering and more fans.
Click to expand...

If someone is calling the Gophers "horrible" for having an average record, they aren't making an assessment based on the record. It's not all about the record. Part of it is that much of what people hear about the Gophers comes from a certain unnamed radio station that enjoys smack talking the local team, whatever the record.

Monkey see (or hear), monkey do.
 

Unregistered User said:
And we don't have to rehash the rehash of how the U is generally covered by reporters who are either ill informed, under informed or fail to work hard to get cromulent information to the masses.
Click to expand...

Was this a known Simpsons reference or were you seriously using the word "cromulent"? The way you used it lead me to believe that you were serious, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Either way, hilarious.
 

I for one am sick of the local media getting ripped for poor Gopher play. The local media rips the Twins,Vikings, Wild and Timerwolves when they lose or play poorly if you haven't noticed. Though in my humble opinion specific Gopher players should not be ripped the Gopher program and its leadership has deserved much of the ripping that they have received. The truth is that we probably have too many sports teams for too few fans in this market so i for one wouldn't mind seeing a couple teams go away but that realistically isn't going to happen so if the Gophers want to get noticed for good things than they better start winning and if this regime can't do it than lets find someone who can because I agree with Iceland 12 in that prior to Brewster at least we had an offense that would put fear into other teams and now we do not so i feel like we have gone backwards.
 

RodentRampage said:
If someone is calling the Gophers "horrible" for having an average record, they aren't making an assessment based on the record. It's not all about the record. Part of it is that much of what people hear about the Gophers comes from a certain unnamed radio station that enjoys smack talking the local team, whatever the record.

Monkey see (or hear), monkey do.
Click to expand...

I don't listen to that station very often so if they have an agenda that is negative towards the Gophers or have a bias towards pro sports than I will take your word on it but I read the paper every day and duirng the Twins slump the articles have not been kind. By the way, I don't think people think the Gophers are horrible for the most part I just think they don't care because there is not a lot to care about for most people.
 

loki said:
I for one am sick of the local media getting ripped for poor Gopher play.
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And who did that? No one is blaming the media for the quality of play. Yes, the media will rip on the pro teams. But they will rip on the Gophers, win or lose. The rip on the Gophers far, far more than they rip in the Timberwolves.

When Brewster had his first press conference when he was being hired, KFAN was doing sound effects over his press conference. When callers call in and want to talk about the Gophers, they get ripped. They aren't willing or able to do more that mail in ripping on the Gophers.
 

loki said:
I for one am sick of the local media getting ripped for poor Gopher play. The local media rips the Twins,Vikings, Wild and Timerwolves when they lose or play poorly if you haven't noticed. Though in my humble opinion specific Gopher players should not be ripped the Gopher program and its leadership has deserved much of the ripping that they have received. The truth is that we probably have too many sports teams for too few fans in this market so i for one wouldn't mind seeing a couple teams go away but that realistically isn't going to happen so if the Gophers want to get noticed for good things than they better start winning and if this regime can't do it than lets find someone who can because I agree with Iceland 12 in that prior to Brewster at least we had an offense that would put fear into other teams and now we do not so i feel like we have gone backwards.
Click to expand...

The difference is that if the media rips the Vikings or T-wolves when they suck, they still get a great spot in the draft next year to get better or can go get free agents. With the Gophers, they have to convince kids (I'm mostly talking in-state right now) to pick the U. It's hard enough when we are going to the Insight Bowl and they can leave to go to USC or Fla or whatever, but it's even harder when people belittle a season that ends in a bowl game. I'm not saying the Gopher's should be held to a different standard, just pointing out the uphill battle they face.
 

loki said:
Win more often and there will be more cheering and more fans.
Click to expand...

This is the typical chicken before the egg proposition. Teams just don't start winning magically. Obviously we cannot win the average fan over with talk about schemes and recruiting, etc. However, among the core fans, there needs to be some sense of optimism. Otherwise we're doomed. It takes a lot of hard work on both a team and individual level for the team to improve. Brewster recognizes this and that's why he talks so much in superlatives. I know it can get a little annoying for you and it is wise to take everything he says with a grain of salt, but that's the way it is. What's he supposed to do, say we're terrible? That's the worst thing he could do. How would you feel if you overheard your manager discussing your work performance negatively? Probably not very good. But let's say your manager took you aside and in private explained that you needed to improve and here's how he/she thinks you can do it. Well, if you weren't a total drip, you'd accept it and try to improve or read the writing on the wall and find another job. Brewster is responsible for 100+ kids and his staff. That's a lot of people to manage and is just wiser for him to remain positive regardless (or as I heard him say once irregardless) of what's going on. I know as a fan it would be refreshing to hear a coach "tell it like it is," but for a coach trying to build a program it's not wise.
 

I agree that the media has some influence and is negative but there are alot of Minnesotans sitting on the sideline (most of the people I grew up with as an example) who want to be fans but just can't pull the trigger because the Gophers continue to be avg at best and bad at worse and most people don't want to be part of investing their time and money when they see little hope especially when they have better choices like the Twins and Vikings to watch. So I agree that the media can slant things negatively but the Gopher program and leadership has done more of a number on itself than the media ever could.
 

In most cities, if the local team is going to a bowl game, they aren't going to be ripped for it. Brewster would have been lauded by the media if he hadn't been optimistic.
 

FreakyDeke said:
The difference is that if the media rips the Vikings or T-wolves when they suck, they still get a great spot in the draft next year to get better or can go get free agents. With the Gophers, they have to convince kids (I'm mostly talking in-state right now) to pick the U. It's hard enough when we are going to the Insight Bowl and they can leave to go to USC or Fla or whatever, but it's even harder when people belittle a season that ends in a bowl game. I'm not saying the Gopher's should be held to a different standard, just pointing out the uphill battle they face.
Click to expand...

Good Point! We are at a disadvantage starting out because we don't have the great recruiting base that places like Ohio State has and the few kids that are rated highly have lots of choices and often see the Gophers as less than the other choices they have and the media does not help with this perception. I am hopeful that the football stadium will change that but that is why finding diamonds in the rough and good solid coaching is so much more important here.
 

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