Chip Scoggins: U's Pitino getting close to using up his chances

[BleedGopher]

per Chip:

The cumulative effect of a rash of disciplinary issues raises concerns about Pitino's program and deserves as much attention as his won-loss record, because a head coach should be evaluated on every facet of his operation.

The opinion here remains that, despite this miserable season, Pitino should get the opportunity to coach his highly regarded incoming recruiting class — provided more off-court problems don’t appear between now and season’s end.

These suspensions and dismissals leave an unflattering perception of Pitino’s program. It’s hard to ignore the red flags.

A certain level of turmoil and turnover is expected with any coaching change. But the number of issues Pitino has encountered doesn’t feel like normal business.

Losing has made Pitino’s Gophers men’s basketball program an easy target for ridicule. The growing list of discipline problems is no laughing matter.

http://www.startribune.com/u-s-pitino-getting-close-to-using-up-his-chances/370590081/

Go Gophers!!

 

[dtrain19]

Chip is right. Being 2-14 makes Pitino and the program an easy target. I get it. I also hope it changes.

 

[GophersInIowa]

The reactions have been interesting. Some have been criticizing him for bringing in recruits that may have character issues while others have praised him for the suspensions.

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

The reactions have been interesting. Some have been criticizing him for bringing in recruits that may have character issues while others have praised him for the suspensions.

I don't think those two beliefs are inconsistent, I agree with both groups. There have been enough issues that I am concerned there might be something systemically wrong Pitino's recruiting or player management. Seems like we have had way too many problems for it to just be coincidence. At the same time, once the problems have happened, I have been pretty pleased with the way he has dealt with them.

 

[Ewert86PC]

The reactions have been interesting. Some have been criticizing him for bringing in recruits that may have character issues while others have praised him for the suspensions.

Those are not really inconsistent views. What concerns me is how well he is vetting the behavior of recruits. This whole thing makes Pitino look like John McCain hardly vetting Sarah Palin.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[Otis]

I don't think those two beliefs are inconsistent, I agree with both groups. There have been enough issues that I am concerned there might be something systemically wrong Pitino's recruiting or player management. Seems like we have had way too many problems for it to just be coincidence. At the same time, once the problems have happened, I have been pretty pleased with the way he has dealt with them.

Give me a break! Name a coach at the U who hasn't had discipline problems or academic issues. Name one who hasn't reached for a kid with questionable character to improve the team.

I'll be waiting.

 

[Ope3]

Let's face it, one of the main reasons he was hired was because of the brand-name recognition of his last name, Pitino. In the past year it's taken quite a hit, on par with "Sheen".

 

[badgerdoc]

Give me a break! Name a coach at the U who hasn't had discipline problems or academic issues. Name one who hasn't reached for a kid with questionable character to improve the team.

I'll be waiting.

And there you have the problem with the "U".

College athletes are young adults like every other college student and they are going to make mistakes. Unfortunately, they are being asked to be ambassadors for the institution as part of their role, so they will be held to a higher standard. Coaches do need to recruit for character, particularly when they are rebuilding the program and need to put a wall up around their state to retain the best, local talent. Why would a parent want to send their kid to a school that repeatedly has questionable character issues?

Minnesota should get rid of Pitino now and find a coach who understands what it will take to build long term success. There is no reason that Minnesota should not be competitive in basketball every single year.

 

[mplarson7]

There is no reason that Minnesota should not be competitive in basketball every single year.

And changing coaches every 3 years will not solve that.

 

[bga1]

And there you have the problem with the "U".

College athletes are young adults like every other college student and they are going to make mistakes. Unfortunately, they are being asked to be ambassadors for the institution as part of their role, so they will be held to a higher standard. Coaches do need to recruit for character, particularly when they are rebuilding the program and need to put a wall up around their state to retain the best, local talent. Why would a parent want to send their kid to a school that repeatedly has questionable character issues?

Minnesota should get rid of Pitino now and find a coach who understands what it will take to build long term success. There is no reason that Minnesota should not be competitive in basketball every single year.

Your wisdom is appreciated. Go back to Wisconsin where half the campus is getting drunk nightly. I'm sure nothing unusual ever happens there. It's just that there are no reporters in Podunk....

 

[Iceland12]

Yeah and it's not a "toss-up" question. Madison has let their coaches Alvarez, B.B. an now possibly Bo Ryan run a little wild, but their players for the most part have been pretty well behaved.

Maybe the U should hire guys that have sex with co-eds but make sure their players don't.

It certainly has worked for the Badgers.

 

[badgerdoc]

Yeah and it's not a "toss-up" question. Madison has let their coaches Alvarez, B.B. an now possibly Bo Ryan run a little wild, but their players for the most part have been pretty well behaved.

Maybe the U should hire guys that have sex with co-eds but make sure their players don't.

It certainly has worked for the Badgers.

You would think Mega Tongue would have taken care of that.

 

[Iceland12]

You would think Mega Tongue would have taken care of that.

He WANTED to have an affair. Unlike, Barry, Brett and Bo his track record, and media control, didn't get it done.

 

[SelectionSunday]

Yeah and it's not a "toss-up" question. Madison has let their coaches Alvarez, B.B. an now possibly Bo Ryan run a little wild, but their players for the most part have been pretty well behaved.

Maybe the U should hire guys that have sex with co-eds but make sure their players don't.

It certainly has worked for the Badgers.

Didn't we have a husband-wife gymnastics head coaching tandem sex tape? Are they still around?

 

[Iceland12]

Didn't we have a husband-wife gymnastics head coaching tandem sex tape? Are they still around?

Great point! Yes we did and that gymnastics team was really good. Maybe the Madison Model "wicked coach-great team" method does work!

 

[Tim1406]

College athletes are young adults like every other college student and they are going to make mistakes. Unfortunately, they are being asked to be ambassadors for the institution as part of their role, so they will be held to a higher standard. Coaches do need to recruit for character, particularly when they are rebuilding the program and need to put a wall up around their state to retain the best, local talent. Why would a parent want to send their kid to a school that repeatedly has questionable character issues?

Alvin Ellis III got an minor in possession over the summer at MSU. you know how much of a deal was made about that? 1 or 2 articles and a suspension for a few games and that was that. Now how do we think that would have blown up at Minnesota? (Because it is not a question of if it would have been bigger but who nd how it would have been made bigger)

 

[builtbadgers]

That is the key. Do not reach on character. That can be the paradox. Always put character ahead of talent. The lure of winning is present for anyone. Especially highly paid, ultra competitive college coaches. I remember when Tony Bennett got the UVA job and said he would run a clean program or winning would not mean anything. In fact he linked winning with character, that was the selling point. There are plenty of very high character with very good talent to build a team. You have to set a high standard for character and winning, especially if your not getting mega talent. It takes high character to play defense, to play as a team, to sacrifice for the whole, to excel as a student. I can not judge these 3 players actions, it does not mean they are bad people but it does mean they were not thinking of the gift of their team, their staff. Whatever they desire in sexual experience is their business but it does come with consecquences. And it does show a level of disregard for the light it may shine on the team and the school and especially the person who brought them here. Coach Pitino must choose actions that support his words.

 

[Blackhammer]

You don't really know character from recruiting. You may think you do but as an example look at your neighbors. All of sudden you find out he is a wife beater or whatever and many times no one suspected a thing. Many other schools recruited these same kids. It takes high character to play defense is the stupidest thing I think I ever read on here builtbadgers. Wow was that out there. Give me a break. lol Defense players of the year like Rodman and Metta World Peace pillars of society.

 

[Iceland12]

That is the key. Do not reach on character. That can be the paradox. Always put character ahead of talent. The lure of winning is present for anyone. Especially highly paid, ultra competitive college coaches. I remember when Tony Bennett got the UVA job and said he would run a clean program or winning would not mean anything. In fact he linked winning with character, that was the selling point. There are plenty of very high character with very good talent to build a team. You have to set a high standard for character and winning, especially if your not getting mega talent. It takes high character to play defense, to play as a team, to sacrifice for the whole, to excel as a student. I can not judge these 3 players actions, it does not mean they are bad people but it does mean they were not thinking of the gift of their team, their staff. Whatever they desire in sexual experience is their business but it does come with consecquences. And it does show a level of disregard for the light it may shine on the team and the school and especially the person who brought them here. Coach Pitino must choose actions that support his words.

Unless you're coaching and winning in Madison. Barry, Brett and now maybe Bo, have proven that there are no consequences.

 

[builtbadgers]

Think what you want. I will never claim vetting is easy but cleaning out the program is always best.

 

[BarnBoy]

Here's a quick look to the model of our conference:

MSU
2015-2016: Eron Harris - Suspended indefinitely for DUI
2014-2015: Kenny Kaminski - Kicked off team for various offenses
2013-2014: Kenny Kaminski - Suspended for multiple incidents
2012-2013: Derrick Nix suspended for drug possession
2011-2012: Korie Lucious kicked off team for various offenses
2010-2011: Chris Allen kicked off team

 

[badgerdoc]

Unless you're coaching and winning in Madison. Barry, Brett and now maybe Bo, have proven that there are no consequences.

No consequences to what?

Barry and Bo were/are both reputed to be serial philanderers and Brett was a jackass drunk who was rich and single. None of which apparently interfered with their ability to do their jobs and none of which was illegal, broke any NCAA rules or was videotaped and posted for the world to see.

I don't expect the coaches or the players to be perfect human beings. Wisconsin has had its share of bad behavior from players over the years too. I was just making a comment with my original post that Pitino may not be the guy to turn this program around if he is recruiting players who are of questionable character. A shortcut like that will not pay off in the long run.

As a Badger fan, I would hope that Minnesota keeps him around, because I really don't think he is the man for the job unless you think the job is to keep Minnesota in the bottom half of the Big Ten.

 

[justthefacts]

You don't really know character from recruiting. You may think you do but as an example look at your neighbors. All of sudden you find out he is a wife beater or whatever and many times no one suspected a thing. Many other schools recruited these same kids. It takes high character to play defense is the stupidest thing I think I ever read on here builtbadgers. Wow was that out there. Give me a break. lol Defense players of the year like Rodman and Metta World Peace pillars of society.

I find this comment inconsistent with the generally-held belief that Jerry Kill won by recruiting high-character kids and building a solid team and lockerroom.

 

[builtbadgers]

exactly, penalties for actions. Further, how many has UW had in a 15 year run.

 

[olddoc]

"Were reputed to be serial philanderers".
Could you produce one documented evidence for BA and Bo. BB was single and if he had lots of girl friends so what?
It diminishes what ever arguments you want to make by resorting to ad hominem attacks without showing a shred of evidence.

 

[macgopher]

Here's a quick look to the model of our conference:

MSU
2015-2016: Eron Harris - Suspended indefinitely for DUI
2014-2015: Kenny Kaminski - Kicked off team for various offenses
2013-2014: Kenny Kaminski - Suspended for multiple incidents
2012-2013: Derrick Nix suspended for drug possession
2011-2012: Korie Lucious kicked off team for various offenses
2010-2011: Chris Allen kicked off team

This list is a bit illuminating. He who has a glass house shouldn't throw....... I find it fascinating that no one has much for facts at this point. And yet so many seem to know exactly what happened? Certainly this is messy to say the least, but if it is a case where someone wasn't in control of their phone and a social media account, maybe some of this is overblown?

 

[builtbadgers]

Again, i can not judge their preference for sharing sex with multiple people. However for the vast majority of people it shines a negative light on the University and the team.

 

[Otis]

Are we sure he isn't just taking a film class and mistakenly posted it on twitter instead of to his professor?

 

[builtbadgers]

YOUR RIGHT. The only thing i am certain of is the incident is bad for the program and bad for the school.

 

[badgerdoc]

"Were reputed to be serial philanderers".
Could you produce one documented evidence for BA and Bo. BB was single and if he had lots of girl friends so what?
It diminishes what ever arguments you want to make by resorting to ad hominem attacks without showing a shred of evidence.

Nope. There is no evidence and that is the point. It is all rumor and "I have a friend who knows a guy, who..." kind of evidence. Although I have personally witnessed BB's drunken foolishness. But he wasn't driving, he is an adult and it was in a private forum. I believed and do believe that BB is a time bomb waiting to go off, so I did not shed a tear when he headed south.