Chip Scoggins: Sticking by Claeys isn’t a sign that Coyle is content with mediocrity.

Mason had the benefit of playing 4, not 3 cupcake noncons. Then he would go 3-5 or 2-6 in the conference and still make a bowl.

That's not true. They only played 11 regular season games 6 of the 10 years Mason was here.

People want to keep making a big deal about 8 wins, yet the Gophers have only played a consistent 12 game regular season schedule for 10 years. Easier to get there when you play more games.
 

That's not true. They only played 11 regular season games 6 of the 10 years Mason was here.

People want to keep making a big deal about 8 wins, yet the Gophers have only played a consistent 12 game regular season schedule for 10 years. Easier to get there when you play more games.

8 wins in 3 of the last 4 years and each year they accomplished it in 11 games or less.
 

Mason had the benefit of playing 4, not 3 cupcake noncons. Then he would go 3-5 or 2-6 in the conference and still make a bowl.

The '99 8-win team played 3 "cupcakes", to be fair.
 

The attendance problem was due to the price increase, not Clayes.

I would say it was a combonation of Teague's policy which I believe Coyle is getting rid of starting next year and quite frankly and weak slate of games on the schedule. Having Nebraska, Wisconsin and Sparty on the schedule next year should help. Hell huskers fans will buy season tickets just to have tickets to that game.
 

That's not true. They only played 11 regular season games 6 of the 10 years Mason was here.

People want to keep making a big deal about 8 wins, yet the Gophers have only played a consistent 12 game regular season schedule for 10 years. Easier to get there when you play more games.

We also play an extra conference game now. This year we had more conference road games than home games
 


I'm interested in seeing what happens to attendance. We dropped our tickets due to the price increase. I've discovered that I like having my Saturday's free to do other things. It's nice being able to decide to go to a game later on in the week and just buying tickets off the street. Plus, we don't miss not having to beg someone to take tickets off our hands when we couldn't go. I have no idea how many people are in the same situation as we are but I know it is going to be harder to get us back than if they had just kept us.

I am in the same boat-- cancelled tickets 2 years back. First year went to about 4 games This year no games and felt just fine watching at home. If they never raised the prices I would have kept them- -now I realize it is not that big of a deal. I was a ST holder back to the Mason days but now it would take a lot for me to be coaxed backed into having them. Marketing messed up big time by overestimating how much demand there was.
 

I love how some are arguing that keeping TC after 1 year with 8 wins is accepting mediocrity (IALTO) yet argue Mase did better than mediocre in his tenure. Can't have it both ways. Neither have accomplished anything spectacular - difference is Mase had 10 tries and TC 1.


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Personally, I don't care about anything other than W/L's and I don't expect/need the head coach to have an outgoing friendly disposition or be physically fit or any other attribute that doesn't directly impact the product on the field. I saw this year as an extension of the Kill era which was supposedly pointing to this year to finally be the time they win some big games. I feel six years is more than enough time to put together a more notable resume than this staff has and I don't have any confidence in them winning division titles which I feel is a reasonable expectation this far in to the process (not every year...and no being 5-3 going in to the last game doesn't count... it's certainly going to take 7-2 or better to win the division). I see a program that has two wins over top 25 opponents in six years, just two wins against Iowa and a doughut against Wisconsin. With consistent bottom of the conference recruiting, it's tough for me to see where/how this program improves to become relevant. I would guess a lot of the people who are no longer going to games or buying tickets feel the same way. Improve the product on the field and there will be more people at the games.

Yup, exactly how I feel.
 

8 wins is not some magic number.

I have no way of knowing what factors Coyle was looking at. And, it's hard to have a firm opinion without knowing the details of the extension. A short extension with a low buyout is not the same as a long extension with a high buyout.

BUT - there is more to the decision than just 8 wins. Ticket sales - advertising - sales of suites and luxury boxes - level of interest in the program - donations (or lack of donations) to the program - all these factors weigh in on the Coaching decision.

Look - I can live with Claeys returning - but I'm not thrilled. If the Gophers go backwards on the field next year - or if ticket sales continue to drop, we will be having this same discussion again next year. And Coyle will have another decision to make.
 



8 wins is not some magic number.


Look - I can live with Claeys returning - but I'm not thrilled. If the Gophers go backwards on the field next year - or if ticket sales continue to drop, we will be having this same discussion again next year. And Coyle will have another decision to make.

And I'm pretty sure Coyle is well aware of that. Like I said, we're in limbo. I was happy to see Tubby go because of the way the BB program was trending in regards to enthusiasm, attendance, and recruiting. I do have the same worries pertaining to Claeys, but 1 year doesn't make a trend.
 

I love how some are arguing that keeping TC after 1 year with 8 wins is accepting mediocrity (IALTO) yet argue Mase did better than mediocre in his tenure. Can't have it both ways. Neither have accomplished anything spectacular - difference is Mase had 10 tries and TC 1.


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Mase had those exciting offenses though. Sure they couldn't tackle falling leaves for the most part, but man they could pass the eye test offensively.
 

Personally, I don't care about anything other than W/L's and I don't expect/need the head coach to have an outgoing friendly disposition or be physically fit or any other attribute that doesn't directly impact the product on the field. I saw this year as an extension of the Kill era which was supposedly pointing to this year to finally be the time they win some big games. I feel six years is more than enough time to put together a more notable resume than this staff has and I don't have any confidence in them winning division titles which I feel is a reasonable expectation this far in to the process (not every year...and no being 5-3 going in to the last game doesn't count... it's certainly going to take 7-2 or better to win the division). I see a program that has two wins over top 25 opponents in six years, just two wins against Iowa and a doughut against Wisconsin. With consistent bottom of the conference recruiting, it's tough for me to see where/how this program improves to become relevant. I would guess a lot of the people who are no longer going to games or buying tickets feel the same way. Improve the product on the field and there will be more people at the games.

Glad someone's brain and fingers are working better than mine today. I couldn't have said it better on my best day. I'm a Gopher fan to my core, but the fact that I really didn't care one way or the other on Claeys makes me think I'm mellowing (age will do that). Deep down, I just don't think Claeys is up to the task at hand. Hope he proves me wrong.

One thing that continues to mystify me is the revisionism on Mason. Along with Denny Green, coaches who would have had the entire state eating out of their hands if they would exhibited one iota of personality while manning their esteemed position. As for his brand of football, I don't care if guys are running all over the place. Exciting as that might be, those teams still didn't do that well overall and blew more games with lousy defense than they won with a good offense.
 

I love how some are arguing that keeping TC after 1 year with 8 wins is accepting mediocrity (IALTO) yet argue Mase did better than mediocre in his tenure. Can't have it both ways. Neither have accomplished anything spectacular - difference is Mase had 10 tries and TC 1.


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Kill didn't even reach Mason's level in one year... why on earth did we keep that guy around!?!?!?
 



$3.43 Million. That was Tracy Claeys' buyout. Everyone was talking 500k and so focused on that, but in reality it was $3.43 Million.

It's something that nobody talked about or even mentioned until it was in the paper the other day. The assistants are guaranteed through 2017 for $2.93 Million. This should have been reported much sooner, terrible job by the media not pointing this out and factoring it in.

Coyle's decision makes more sense when you combine the 8 wins with the $3.43 Million buyout. Today an article said he told Claeys a month ago he would be back. Claeys hit Coyle's win total a month ago and that was it. It would have taken 6 wins or less for Coyle to have the capital (both literally and figuratively) to make a change. Easier to understand when it's 3.5 million vs 500k.

I don't really agree. If we had hired let's say PJ Fleck, it's possible to likely that at least some of the staff would have remained. Some of the staff might quit out of loyalty, but they'd forego their buyout. So the only guaranteed buyout is 500k for Claeys, everything else is a guess. And FYI, I'm on board with retaining Claeys.

As to the OP, I agree with a lot of the comments. Why the heck do I sacrifice so much time and money to be a season ticket holder when I could attend the same number of games for a lot less money, and get to pick and choose the games I'm really excited about. It truly is a donation. I'll keep my seats for next year since the schedule is solid, but if we regress, or if the product isn't exciting and gives little hope for the future, I'll consider giving them up. I also completely agree with the lousy atmosphere at games and the constant in your face advertising.

Things I don't mind:
The Case IH red zone (usually at an exciting point, kind of funny)
Introduction of other sports teams/players who've had success that we want to celebrate
Ad space on scoreboards
An occasional other introduction to someone on the sideline


Things I despise
Constant intros on the sideline (kid of the game, tee kid, farm family of the game, someone I've never heard of)
Constant talk from the PA, it really never ceases, it should be in the background and informational only, such as who made the tackle and who was the runner(and of course I hate our PA guy anyway)
Mcnamara donating 75 cents for each touchdown
Too much piped in music, not enough band, not a loud enough band, never play our great songs during games (minnesota march completely absent, among others) and can't we put speakers in the band endzone to augment the sound?
more focus should be on the students, band and cheerleaders, it's college football
 

Glad someone's brain and fingers are working better than mine today. I couldn't have said it better on my best day. I'm a Gopher fan to my core, but the fact that I really didn't care one way or the other on Claeys makes me think I'm mellowing (age will do that). Deep down, I just don't think Claeys is up to the task at hand. Hope he proves me wrong.

One thing that continues to mystify me is the revisionism on Mason. Along with Denny Green, coaches who would have had the entire state eating out of their hands if they would exhibited one iota of personality while manning their esteemed position. As for his brand of football, I don't care if guys are running all over the place. Exciting as that might be, those teams still didn't do that well overall and blew more games with lousy defense than they won with a good offense.

I think the bolded/underlined above is where the majority of people stand. The problem is, we don't have the proof.

After Brewster's third year, I was fairly convinced he was going to fall on his face. He was losing quite a few seniors, several of his highly touted recruits had washed out, and I was hearing stories about his antics from a then player that convinced me he was going fail (granted, I never thought it would be as spectacularly as it happened). However, how could anyone have fired him after the 6-7 season in year 3? Even if I was AD and was convinced, I wouldn't have pulled the trigger. Next year comes, team starts 1-5 or whatever, people would be coming for your head, even if that was what would have happened under Brew.

The biggest differences this year are that this is a continuation of a previous regime but a new AD. So arguments could have been made either way. But now that the decision has been made to retain, it feels like we're just waiting for him to prove us right and start winning less games. Then we go through it again.

I really hope we're wrong. I hope he wins 9 games next year, 10 the year after, 11 the year after that... I hope we have a statue of Tracy Claeys at every entrance to the stadium, every corner of campus, etc.
 

I think the bolded/underlined above is where the majority of people stand. The problem is, we don't have the proof.

After Brewster's third year, I was fairly convinced he was going to fall on his face. He was losing quite a few seniors, several of his highly touted recruits had washed out, and I was hearing stories about his antics from a then player that convinced me he was going fail (granted, I never thought it would be as spectacularly as it happened). However, how could anyone have fired him after the 6-7 season in year 3? Even if I was AD and was convinced, I wouldn't have pulled the trigger. Next year comes, team starts 1-5 or whatever, people would be coming for your head, even if that was what would have happened under Brew.

The biggest differences this year are that this is a continuation of a previous regime but a new AD. So arguments could have been made either way. But now that the decision has been made to retain, it feels like we're just waiting for him to prove us right and start winning less games. Then we go through it again.

I really hope we're wrong. I hope he wins 9 games next year, 10 the year after, 11 the year after that... I hope we have a statue of Tracy Claeys at every entrance to the stadium, every corner of campus, etc.

That's the biggest problem I have with this. It always feels like we are just waiting for failure, while the winning programs try to prevent failure. Then we just keep digging ourselves a bigger hole to climb out of.
 

That's the biggest problem I have with this. It always feels like we are just waiting for failure, while the winning programs try to prevent failure. Then we just keep digging ourselves a bigger hole to climb out of.

Arguably chasing winning with say a big time hire costing huge money that doesn't work out.... would be an actual hole we would have to dig out of.

Otherwise with the new facilities it seems like we're building.
 

8 wins is not some magic number.

I have no way of knowing what factors Coyle was looking at. And, it's hard to have a firm opinion without knowing the details of the extension. A short extension with a low buyout is not the same as a long extension with a high buyout.

BUT - there is more to the decision than just 8 wins. Ticket sales - advertising - sales of suites and luxury boxes - level of interest in the program - donations (or lack of donations) to the program - all these factors weigh in on the Coaching decision.

Look - I can live with Claeys returning - but I'm not thrilled. If the Gophers go backwards on the field next year - or if ticket sales continue to drop, we will be having this same discussion again next year. And Coyle will have another decision to make.

SON, how much do you think the guaranteed salaries for the asst coaches factored in? Almost 3 million.


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8 wins is not some magic number.

I have no way of knowing what factors Coyle was looking at. And, it's hard to have a firm opinion without knowing the details of the extension. A short extension with a low buyout is not the same as a long extension with a high buyout.

BUT - there is more to the decision than just 8 wins. Ticket sales - advertising - sales of suites and luxury boxes - level of interest in the program - donations (or lack of donations) to the program - all these factors weigh in on the Coaching decision.

Look - I can live with Claeys returning - but I'm not thrilled. If the Gophers go backwards on the field next year - or if ticket sales continue to drop, we will be having this same discussion again next year. And Coyle will have another decision to make.

In the long run, I hope our AD is smart enough to know that it all comes down to wins. I have no doubt that the Gophers could hire someone who would bring more excitement to the program, but that kind of excitement is not going to have any roots.

Kirk Ferentz and Paul Chryst are boring people, but they win.

I think it makes sense to argue that you don't think Claeys will win enough to drive excitement to the program. However, to me, it makes no sense to worry about a program salesperson. Those types look foolish when you are losing (Brewster) and you can sell the most vanilla personality if you're winning.

It's all about winning.
 

SON, how much do you think the guaranteed salaries for the asst coaches factored in? Almost 3 million.


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I know you asked SON, but it didn't factor in at all.

Coyle was not going to fire a first year coach who won 8 games a year after pulling his interim tag. It would have been a completely illogical decision (and made his initial decision look dreadful).

At the U of MN, a first year coach isn't going to be fired after going 8-4 and over .500 in conference. It simply was never going to happen.
 

Coyle was not going to fire a first year coach who won 8 games a year after pulling his interim tag. It would have been a completely illogical decision (and made his initial decision look dreadful).

This is the second time I've seen you mention this. What initial decision are you referring to? Goetz made Claeys the full-time head coach, not Coyle. Claeys was the full-time head coach 7 months before Coyle took the job.
 

I know you asked SON, but it didn't factor in at all.

Coyle was not going to fire a first year coach who won 8 games a year after pulling his interim tag. It would have been a completely illogical decision (and made his initial decision look dreadful).

At the U of MN, a first year coach isn't going to be fired after going 8-4 and over .500 in conference. It simply was never going to happen.

I'd argue that it wouldn't happen almost anywhere. Charlie Strong was 16-21 at Texas and it took them 3 years to fire him.
 

I think Coyle's biggest factor was money and facilities.

No need to buy out a staff who is solid when the facilities aren't completed.




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