Can't shake the feeling...

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westcoastgopher11

westcoastgopher11

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I have always been an outspoken Kill fan, even during the hiring process when more high profile names were being thrown around.

As much of a loyalist as I am, I'm getting a sneaking feeling that Claeys will have a lot more success than Kill (and not just because he's starting further ahead).

Claeys will take us to a New Years Six bowl in his tenure.
 


westcoastgopher11 said:
I have always been an outspoken Kill fan, even during the hiring process when more high profile names were being thrown around.

As much of a loyalist as I am, I'm getting a sneaking feeling that Claeys will have a lot more success than Kill (and not just because he's starting further ahead).

Claeys will take us to a New Years Six bowl in his tenure.
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I hope so.
 

I have always been a fan of Coach Kill, but one thing I always thought was that under Coach Kill, we'd top off... probably at 8 wins. The reason I thought that was because he was too conservative and too loyal on coaching. Sure he had a lot of success before the gophers but being in the B10 is different. And not to say that I wanted Coach Kill to have health issues, but I really wanted Claeys to take over and hoped Claeys wasn't as loyal. I'm pretty happy with the coaching changes, and I agree that I think Claeys will take us a step or two beyond where Coach Kill took us.
 

Yes, I am also happy about the coaching changes. I think Claeys, in combination with new blood from the outside, raises our ceiling for success. Now here comes the part where I expect to get slammed. I would be much more comfortable if our program were in the hands of someone who is taking better care of himself. A coach named Dave McClain pumped life into a dreadful Wisconsin program in the early to mid 1980's. Bowl invitations were much harder to get then and the Badgers went to three straight. He died of a heart attack at age 48 and the Badgers returned to the netherworld to await the coming of Barry Alvarez. It just seems to me that a reasonable level of fitness is more than just the coach's business.
 


Nomellini said:
Now here comes the part where I expect to get slammed. I would be much more comfortable if our program were in the hands of someone who is taking better care of himself. A coach named Dave McClain pumped life into a dreadful Wisconsin program in the early to mid 1980's. Bowl invitations were much harder to get then and the Badgers went to three straight. He died of a heart attack at age 48 and the Badgers returned to the netherworld to await the coming of Barry Alvarez. It just seems to me that a reasonable level of fitness is more than just the coach's business.
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I agree with you. Although I'm not saying it so we won't lose a coach, I'm saying it because we don't want to lose a great person. He definitely should think of his health, because I'm sure he has plenty of resources here at the U to help him with his weight. I hope someone somewhere will be able to pursade him to start (if he hasn't already).
 

imho: its too early to tell
one thing is obvious, Claeys has made several mistakes so far in this recent stint as head coach. time management (end of Michigan game) and some in game decisions that didn't quite work out like going for 4 and 2 and allowing the OC to call a -1 yard pass play in hopes that we could get 3 YAC
but there are bright spots as well. Bold move canning Limegrover when it was apparent that Limegrover was not getting the job done in his position.

his hires for OC and OL have to be solid.

recruiting has been decent in his first class (if all sign in February)

it will be a fun season next year and hopefully back to a 8-9 + win total and some trophies in the case
 

Pump the brakes. Gutekunst's Gophers won the independence bowl against Clemson, who'd won a national championship only four years earlier. I like the hire but way to early to tell, and really no good reason to believe they'll be better.
 

...and I can't shake the feeling that Claeys is a coach and Kill is a program builder. I badly want Tracy to succeed, and I am impressed with the staff moves so far, but time will tell. One way or another, the Gutekunst comparisons must end. Two different people, and I was not on board with that move back then.
 



We need a program builder and a coach. I'm hoping Kill is able to help Claeys advance our team into the top half on a permanent basis.
 

There are a lot of overweight people that are alive.

They don't all have heartattacks and die.
 


Bad Gopher said:
...and I can't shake the feeling that Claeys is a coach and Kill is a program builder. I badly want Tracy to succeed, and I am impressed with the staff moves so far, but time will tell. One way or another, the Gutekunst comparisons must end. Two different people, and I was not on board with that move back then.
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However, Claeys has plenty of hands-on experience building a program with Kill, actually several programs over the years. I would not consider him a novice.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk
 



DoubleB said:
imho: its too early to tell
one thing is obvious, Claeys has made several mistakes so far in this recent stint as head coach. time management (end of Michigan game) and some in game decisions that didn't quite work out like going for 4 and 2 and allowing the OC to call a -1 yard pass play in hopes that we could get 3 YAC
but there are bright spots as well. Bold move canning Limegrover when it was apparent that Limegrover was not getting the job done in his position.

his hires for OC and OL have to be solid.

recruiting has been decent in his first class (if all sign in February)

it will be a fun season next year and hopefully back to a 8-9 + win total and some trophies in the case
Click to expand...

I hated that pass play on 4th and 2 but I love his aggressiveness. He is going to take risks. He is going lose some games because of it. I thought Mason was a great coach but when we got a lead he got way too conservative and tried unsuccessfully on several occasions to run the clock out. I loved Kill too but I was not alone booing in the stands in Orlando this past January 1st when he ran the clock out rather than let Mitch see what he could do.

TC will learn quickly and not make mistakes like he did with the clock against Michigan. I loved the aggressiveness of going for the TD with 2 seconds left and the ball on the 1 inch line, rather than the game tying field goal.
 

And now begins the Claeys vs. Kill vs. Mason debate. It should provide years of thoughtful discussion and debate on GH.
 

Kill is a good culture guy for a programs, and a good CEO. He is a little conservative on the X's and O's side of it, and his influence on Offense if very old school. When Kill came in, MN badly needed a guy who would create a positive, winning culture and better organization of the programs. Brew was a disaster in these basic areas.

Claeys will be a better X's and O's guy(less conservative) for the gophers and hopefully he will maintain the positive culture created under Kill.
 

Otis said:
We need a program builder and a coach. I'm hoping Kill is able to help Claeys advance our team into the top half on a permanent basis.
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Coach Claeys will have an 'extra head coach' in his back pocket...on a need basis.:cheer:
 

westcoastgopher11 said:
I have always been an outspoken Kill fan, even during the hiring process when more high profile names were being thrown around.

As much of a loyalist as I am, I'm getting a sneaking feeling that Claeys will have a lot more success than Kill (and not just because he's starting further ahead).

Claeys will take us to a New Years Six bowl in his tenure.
Click to expand...

This is interesting. A NY6 Bowl would be great, but I'll wait on my opinion until I see what "his people" can do. One thing about Kill (and it happens in coaching and business) is you get stuck in the same model that brought you previous success. This often times works for an extended time, but many leaders have a difficult time adapting to a new normal or culture. Having opposing teams seeing a long career, it's easier for them to know what to expect and more difficult for the veteran coach to adapt something new into their philosophy.

I will always be a huge Kill supporter for what he's done for our program, but sometimes, just maybe, a different set of eyes and ideas is necessary to take you to the next level.

Here's hoping for a NY6 game in the near future. Thanks for putting this "out there". It's an interesting discussion.
 

Nomellini said:
Yes, I am also happy about the coaching changes. I think Claeys, in combination with new blood from the outside, raises our ceiling for success. Now here comes the part where I expect to get slammed. I would be much more comfortable if our program were in the hands of someone who is taking better care of himself. A coach named Dave McClain pumped life into a dreadful Wisconsin program in the early to mid 1980's. Bowl invitations were much harder to get then and the Badgers went to three straight. He died of a heart attack at age 48 and the Badgers returned to the netherworld to await the coming of Barry Alvarez. It just seems to me that a reasonable level of fitness is more than just the coach's business.
Click to expand...

Same was said about Kill and his known health issues. We are the Gophers. We don't get top-tier coaches rushing here to earn $4m/year. We need to take chances on coaches and hope that they pan out. Claeys is a great coach, and all we can do now is hope he remains healthy enough to coach at a high level.
 

MNGoldenGophers1 said:
And now begins the Claeys vs. Kill vs. Mason debate. It should provide years of thoughtful discussion and debate on GH.
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FACT: Jerry Kill, Jeff Horton and Glen Mason all had a .400 Big Ten winning percentage.
 

Rescooter said:
This is interesting. A NY6 Bowl would be great, but I'll wait on my opinion until I see what "his people" can do. One thing about Kill (and it happens in coaching and business) is you get stuck in the same model that brought you previous success. This often times works for an extended time, but many leaders have a difficult time adapting to a new normal or culture. Having opposing teams seeing a long career, it's easier for them to know what to expect and more difficult for the veteran coach to adapt something new into their philosophy.

I will always be a huge Kill supporter for what he's done for our program, but sometimes, just maybe, a different set of eyes and ideas is necessary to take you to the next level.

Here's hoping for a NY6 game in the near future. Thanks for putting this "out there". It's an interesting discussion.
Click to expand...

This is one of the underappreciated aspects of Bud Grant: he strongly encouraged his staff to innovate and try new things, and that was the case throughout his tenure. He also sought to hire young, up-and-coming assistants. In every walk of life, every industry, there are always new things to be invented and discovered. Small minds think that anything worth doing has already been done; nothing new under the sun.
 

badgergopher said:
Pump the brakes. Gutekunst's Gophers won the independence bowl against Clemson, who'd won a national championship only four years earlier. I like the hire but way to early to tell, and really no good reason to believe they'll be better.
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Gopherhole is great because you can always count on someone coming in trying to damper expectations whenever someone shows the slightest bit of hope or enthusiasm.
 

I like the Clayes hire and am hopeful. I am not worried that he has made mistakes, I make mistakes at my job every day and I expect he will too. It could mean he is getting after it. In sports, I generally prefer aggressive mistakes to passive ones. I like his decisiveness both on the field and in making adjustments to the staff. We will see if and how he grows as a coach and as a leader.
 

badgergopher said:
Pump the brakes. Gutekunst's Gophers won the independence bowl against Clemson, who'd won a national championship only four years earlier. I like the hire but way to early to tell, and really no good reason to believe they'll be better.
Click to expand...

Fresh off an enormous win over middle michigan, it's that time again on GH to employ the strategy that has served Gopher football so well these past 40+ years (go to about 2:50 - 3:00 for the gist of things):

 

DoubleB said:
imho: its too early to tell
one thing is obvious, Claeys has made several mistakes so far in this recent stint as head coach. time management (end of Michigan game) and some in game decisions that didn't quite work out like going for 4 and 2 and allowing the OC to call a -1 yard pass play in hopes that we could get 3 YAC
but there are bright spots as well. Bold move canning Limegrover when it was apparent that Limegrover was not getting the job done in his position.

his hires for OC and OL have to be solid.

recruiting has been decent in his first class (if all sign in February)

it will be a fun season next year and hopefully back to a 8-9 + win total and some trophies in the case
Click to expand...

Every coach makes some mistakes. Bill Belicheck kicked off to start overtime. That by itself would be the biggest in-game coaching blunder in Gopher history, and he's considered one of the greatest coaches of all-time.
 

I think Claeys is a good hire and am excited to see the results. My main concern is does he have the charisma to win on the recruiting trail.
 

Winasota Gopher said:
There are a lot of overweight people that are aliv
They don't all have heartattacks and die.
Click to expand...

No, they don't but there is much more involved here. For example, coaches are fond of exhorting their players to make sacrifices and take on difficult challenges. When a coach is grossly overweight, the message rings hollow. On examination,the disconnect should be obvious. There are also inarguable probabilities that point to health episodes for the obese. In addition, Claeys is one of the highest-paid public employees in the state. He does not work for a corporation. What is wrong with a little accountability?
 

DoubleB said:
imho: its too early to tell
one thing is obvious, Claeys has made several mistakes so far in this recent stint as head coach. time management (end of Michigan game) and some in game decisions that didn't quite work out like going for 4 and 2 and allowing the OC to call a -1 yard pass play in hopes that we could get 3 YAC
but there are bright spots as well. Bold move canning Limegrover when it was apparent that Limegrover was not getting the job done in his position.

his hires for OC and OL have to be solid.

recruiting has been decent in his first class (if all sign in February)

it will be a fun season next year and hopefully back to a 8-9 + win total and some trophies in the case
Click to expand...

Agree too early to tell but do like that he is aggressive on both sides of the ball. Field execution will get better next year. Leitner has become solid passer and better field general last 4-5 games.

All coaches make mistakes...the conservative ones tend to go unnoticed. With their schedule there's no reason they can't win nine games next year.
 

Nomellini said:
No, they don't but there is much more involved here. For example, coaches are fond of exhorting their players to make sacrifices and take on difficult challenges. When a coach is grossly overweight, the message rings hollow. On examination,the disconnect should be obvious. There are also inarguable probabilities that point to health episodes for the obese. In addition, Claeys is one of the highest-paid public employees in the state. He does not work for a corporation. What is wrong with a little accountability?
Click to expand...

The enormous difference is that players' physical conditions are integral to their performance. A coach's physical condition contributes virtually nothing to his performance. A good coach can coach from a wheelchair. Terrible comparison.
 

dpodoll68 said:
The enormous difference is that players' physical conditions are integral to their performance. A coach's physical condition contributes virtually nothing to his performance. A good coach can coach from a wheelchair. Terrible comparison.
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Big-time head coaching is a draining, never-ending responsibility that requires immense reserves of energy. You don't think hauling around an extra 100 pounds has an impact on stamina over time? Unrealistic post.
 

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