Building a program with mid-level recruits

[jovs]

Tubby has brought in a load of talent sinse he got here, the transfers are what has hurt the program. That changes the ability to compete against the top teams will start to occur.

 

[GopherKrazed]

To add on to my original statement, though, we don't really have any players on our current roster that exhibit the poise, craftiness, and shooting ability I mentioned . Blake is the closest thing and he wasn't even recruited by Tubby.

The only thing Blake had of the three was shooting.

 

[fryguy22]

The only thing Blake had of the three was shooting.

If you really think that you have two options

A. Watch a Gopher game for apparently the first time in the last four years

or

B. Go away

 

[WanderingGopher]

Wisconsin basketball has had plenty of star talent. Not sure what you mean by that.

Wisconsin's recruiting has never been great. They have maybe advanced a little bit from a few years ago, but you wouldn't take any of Wisconsin's classes over any of Tubby's classes at the time they were signed. Under Bo Ryan they have outperformed their recruiting (both on the individual and team level), I'll give them that.

 

[GopherinPhilly]

I have no problem at all with the premise of the question, in fact I think it is silly to argue the number of stars Tubby has recruited, because most have been fine. Tubby has recruited good players that can win and he has also recruited guys who should not be scholarship players on a BigTen basketball team, which is biting us in the butt big time this year. I think the theory that on a 13 team roster, a team can afford to have "practice only " players, Chip, Mav, is ludicrous.

The other point to make about building a team from 3 star players is that it is totally dependent on the coach evaluating talent correctly that will fit his system. Clem did that really well, Tubby must be able to do it based on his history at Tulsa and Georgia, but that part of his skill set is not as obvious yet, so I guess we'll see. The one thing that does hurt is when you recruit JUCO guys who can't play. They take up a roster spot that a developing three star player could fill. He does not have any choice this year, he needs three addtional guards who can play next year. Andre Hollins will be very good, but he needs at least one more new guard that can play immediately.

When has anyone ever called them "practice players." These kids were recruited out of desperation because of late departures of our back up PG and transfer of our top recruit from 2010 that was ineligible for last year and then decided to walk. Better Mav and Chip than the alternative...nobody and our bench is 1 deep.

 

[Gold Vision]

Wisconsin's recruiting has never been great. They have maybe advanced a little bit from a few years ago, but you wouldn't take any of Wisconsin's classes over any of Tubby's classes at the time they were signed. Under Bo Ryan they have outperformed their recruiting (both on the individual and team level), I'll give them that.

They have been recruiting worse the past few years, not better. They have been playing with above average talent for sure, nothing like 2 and 3 stars like the OP was commenting about. Like another poster said, it's a myth that Wisconsin recruits only under the radar 2 and 3 stars.

2005
Landry 4
Krabbenhoft 4

2006
Hughes 4
Bohannon 4

2007
Leuer 4
Nankivil 4

2008
Wilson 4
Bergerren 4
Taylor 3 (rivals 150)

2009
Taylor 3 (rivals 150)
Bruiser 3 (rivals 150)

2010
Anderson 4

2011
Uthoff 4

 

[Monty519]

Can we stop with the Wisconsin doesn't have the players stuff? They've recruited plenty well. The key is, all theirs have stuck around. As I've said before, once we do that, we'll see our program have some success. If we keep having recruits drop like flies, then we'll continue to struggle.

 

[From the Barn]

You build the program with three star guys. You get the 4 and 5 star guys once you have the top notch program.

 

[GoFerit]

Bo has recruited good talents. So has Tubby. I think the difference between the players they recruit, I think, lies in more or less the systems they run.

Bo requires heady and skillful players to run his system, and he recruits accordingly. Recruits with decent skill and basketball intelligence seem to better “develop” at college level even if some of them lack physical tools including athleticism.

Tubby’s priority seems more about physical tools. Blue chip players who have both physical tools and skills/basketball intelligence are rare, and Tubby, though a good recruiter, cannot get them on a consistent basis here. So, a lot of his good recruits are and will be athletic guys without good skills (and sometimes without good basketball intelligence), and it takes time to acquire skills and the understanding of the system. The result is the “perceived” lack of development in some players though they individually have higher ceilings in terms of potential (and they are not necessarily better than Bo’s recruits from the get-go).

In the long run, I think Bo’s system is more stable and consistent. But, Tubby’s is capable of producing a truly great team in the long run despite the bigger variance in performance.

I hoped that Tubby would need about 4-5 years to produce a true contender (a top three in the conference and top 10 overall). I guess it won’t happen. It may be a 6-7 year project now.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Can we stop with the Wisconsin doesn't have the players stuff? They've recruited plenty well. The key is, all theirs have stuck around. As I've said before, once we do that, we'll see our program have some success. If we keep having recruits drop like flies, then we'll continue to struggle.

That's the #1 difference between the two programs right now. We can discuss all we want about systems and strategies, but it doesn't matter if players are leaving unexpectedly. Some of it can be blamed on Tubby and staff, some on the players themselves, and some of it is just bad luck.