Big Ten Statement Regarding Virginia Tech-Minnesota Men's Basketball Game‏

GopherLady

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Interesting, just received this email from the Big 10:

The Big Ten Conference announced today that it has disciplined a men's basketball official for misapplying a rule in the final seconds of the Virginia Tech-Minnesota game played on Wednesday evening.
The misapplication of Rule 4 Section 3, back court/front court, occurred with 9.9 seconds remaining in regulation.

We regret that the error occurred.
 

I'm torn. On the one hand, that was the ref who yelled at me and almost kicked me out of the game last year for criticizing his officiating. On the other hand, his poor call helped the Gophers.
 

I'm torn. On the one hand, that was the ref who yelled at me and almost kicked me out of the game last year for criticizing his officiating. On the other hand, his poor call helped the Gophers.

Details?
 

And they called a foul on us instead of the stupid logo. These things work themselves out.
 

I was wondering about this. The player did no have possesion of the ball when he tipped it into the back court.
 




Pretty sure I've told this story on the board once or twice before, but in the Michigan game last year I had some pretty close seats with my Dad, and I was chewing on this one official pretty hard. In my defense, he was horrible. They were jacking up threes, we were pounding it down to Mbakwe, and they had way more free throw attempts than we did. I was really steaming. At the end of the game, down like three, Rodney went to the basket, was hacked, lost the ball, outlet to Morris who waited for a gopher to catch up and got an and-1 on almost no contact. I started yelling that the ref had been missing calls all game, then I said it was a travel on Morris (because it was), then I yelled "Donaghy!" I finished up with what I thought was a pretty good quip, "I thought the state of Michigan was broke, how can they afford to pay you?" This was during a timeout on the floor with like 15 seconds left or something. He came over and leaned over the scorers table and started pointing at me and just screaming at me, "Hey, you, yes you, you shut your mouth or you're out of here. You keep talking, and you'll be gone." I responded, "how much time is left" (as if I didn't mind getting tossed so late). He said "okay smart guy, you think you're so funny? One more word, and you're out of here." Everybody around me hated the ref and was throwing abuse his way as well, and were trying to get me to keep talking back to him, (and my dad, who's also a lawyer, was yelling something about "freedom of speech" to him). I just smiled and put my hands up, and he glared at me, and walked away. I'm glad I didn't go all the way and get tossed, because I didn't want anything bad to happen to the team just because I was mad. It still is pretty awesome that it happened. Maybe my intimidation was still in his mind and that's why we got this call.
 

What is the rule? I thought the only way it's not a violation is if a Gopher touched it first. Since I don't think that happened, it is a violation whether he had 'possession' or not?
 

What is the rule? I thought the only way it's not a violation is if a Gopher touched it first. Since I don't think that happened, it is a violation whether he had 'possession' or not?

I thought so too, but I think they need to have possessed it, not just touched it last.
 



I just reviewed the play on bigten.com. The ball clearly went off the VT player's hands front court to back court. It was a pass that was not handled well as opposed to him dribbling it to the back court. I did not think that would make a difference.

In any event hell must be freezing over. We actually got a break on what might have been a missed call that resulted in a win. Hard to believe.
 


What is the rule? I thought the only way it's not a violation is if a Gopher touched it first. Since I don't think that happened, it is a violation whether he had 'possession' or not?
There is a rule that on an inbounds play there is no backcourt violation if the player has no control of the ball, but the way the rule is phrased makes me feel like if the player is making a play to possess the ball, and it goes into the backcourt, that should be a backcourt violation. But that is just me.
 

What is the rule? I thought the only way it's not a violation is if a Gopher touched it first. Since I don't think that happened, it is a violation whether he had 'possession' or not?

I believe that in order for it to be an "over and back" violation, you have to have possesion of the basketball in the front court and then cross the line into the back court. Since the player just tipped the ball into the back court , he never had possesion of the ball, so it was just like if he had run into the back court and was passed the ball there in the first place.
 



Ha !

When I read the title I thought we were going to be admonished for allowing the visiting player fall off the side of the court!

:)
 

Unless he intentionally tipped it.

Of course, if he just caught the thing passed right to him we wouldn't be having this conversation.

I imagine coaches preach not allowing situations that can be altered by officiating.
 

Virginia Tech on Selection Sunday?

Raise your hand if you'll apologize for the Gophers' win.

(my hand remains down)

I can only imagine what Seth Greenberg is going to think (or say) if the Hokies once again end up a win shy of earning an at-large bid.
 

Raise your hand if you'll apologize for the Gophers' win.

(my hand remains down)

I can only imagine what Seth Greenberg is going to think (or say) if the Hokies once again end up a win shy of earning an at-large bid.

We all know what he will say. What he should say is 'Gee, maybe I should have scheduled Richmond and VCU, instead of Longwood and VMI.'
 

Gee, I am so sorry I hit your jaw/nose with my elbow, but it was part of the game. Same as this call.
 

To Greenberg's credit, he clearly "scheduled up" this season. The NIT Season Tip-Off (netted them games vs. Syracuse & Oklahoma State), home vs. St. Bonaventure (expected to be pretty decent but so-so so far), @ Gophers, home vs. Kansas State, @ Oklahoma State, home vs. BYU. ... I'd venture a guess that if the Hokies fall short this year, it won't be because of their nonconference schedule. On paper that's a pretty solid slate.
 

Raise your hand if you'll apologize for the Gophers' win.

(my hand remains down)

I can only imagine what Seth Greenberg is going to think (or say) if the Hokies once again end up a win shy of earning an at-large bid.

With VT, it's safe to say "when."
 

Reminds me of the forward fumble in the Nebraska game - to which the rule screwed us.. it could have happened again here - but we were still ahead at the tme in hoops.
 

I believe that in order for it to be an "over and back" violation, you have to have possesion of the basketball in the front court and then cross the line into the back court. Since the player just tipped the ball into the back court , he never had possesion of the ball, so it was just like if he had run into the back court and was passed the ball there in the first place.

In high school, all three "points" (two feet plus the ball) must have made contact with the frontcourt in order for there to be an over-and-back. Also, an interrupted dribble does NOT wave off the O&B if it goes into the backcourt. The defender must get complete control of the ball (i.e. there must be a change of possession) or knock it out of bounds for the frontcourt restriction to be lifted.

This can be a very tricky rule to administer.
 

I also thought this original post was regarding the fall off the floor -
 

Everybody around me hated the ref and was throwing abuse his way as well, and were trying to get me to keep talking back to him, (and my dad, who's also a lawyer, was yelling something about "freedom of speech" to him).

Man, your lawyer dad seems to know nothing about the First Amendment. How exactly does Freedom of Speech protect you from being thrown out of a game for causing a scene? I'm not saying the ref wasn't on his knees blowing the game (I don't remember the particular game), but you can sure as hell get kicked out of the arena for heckling a ref.
 

Man, your lawyer dad seems to know nothing about the First Amendment. How exactly does Freedom of Speech protect you from being thrown out of a game for causing a scene? I'm not saying the ref wasn't on his knees blowing the game (I don't remember the particular game), but you can sure as hell get kicked out of the arena for heckling a ref.

He was joking. Sorry if I didn't make that clear enough. Both he and I are reasonably aware of the freedoms guaranteed by the First Amendment.
 

My Statement Regarding Virginia Tech-Minnesota Men's Basketball Game‏

"Weh"
 

The exact same thing happened in the MSU game. Bad call, Izzo went nuts. Call was correctly reversed.
I couldn't believe we then won the game on that call.


Then the MSU fans chanted, "Beat Wisconsin."
 

Getting under the ref's skin reminds me of a WCHA ref back in the 70's named Don Wilkie(sp?) . He was brutal. On particarly bad calls we would in unison shout out from the balcony, "A horse's tail is soft and silky, lift it up and you'll see Wilkie!!!!!!!
 

Bruce, you started a new thread for this?
 





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