Beth Goetz

[Iceland12]

Tracy Claeys has vocal in his support for Beth Goetz. Heck, for Claeys VERY vocal. Goetz was also a favorite of Jerry Kill's. Count me in with the crowd that wanted an A.D. with more of a background in schools with football programs. Coyle had experience here, successful experience at Boise State and at Syracuse? That was too short for anything but an incomplete.

When Kimberly Hewitt, the director of the aforementioned EOAA office, July email ended up with a Star Tribune article last October claiming that some football players had been accused of sexual assault, sexual harassment and retaliation in the 2014-15 academic year, Goetz's silence on the matter was interpreted as non-support. Kill was very upset that Kaler had, internally at least, sided with the email.

Rumors are/were Goetz was on Kill's side here. She didn't side with the email's conclusion on the football team. Maybe it was because of her relationship with Kill. Maybe she didn't like the feeling of a vendetta against the team. Maybe she supported the cause, but not the approach. Could be because none of those accusations ended up with expulsion or even suspension. Who knows.

Over the last few weeks, I've come to a surprising conclusion.

Lord, I miss Beth Goetz.

 

[UpnorthGo4]

There is another way to look at Beth Goetz and her time as the interim AD. Since she wanted to be named the permanent AD there was no way she was going to do anything to rock the boat and piss off Jerry Kill and his supporters in the administration and on the Board of Regents. The last thing the U needs is an AD who takes orders from the football coach. As a long time football season ticket holder, I am happy she didn't get the job.

 

[PMWinSTP]

There is another way to look at Beth Goetz and her time as the interim AD. Since she wanted to replace Maturi permanently there was no way she was going to do anything to rock the boat and piss off Jerry Kill and his supporters in the administration and on the Board of Regents. The last thing the U needs is an AD who takes orders from the football coach. As a long time football season ticket holder, I am happy she didn't get the job.

I not shocked that you jumped in with this kind of response...

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

There is another way to look at Beth Goetz and her time as the interim AD. Since she wanted to be named the permanent ADy there was no way she was going to do anything to rock the boat and piss off Jerry Kill and his supporters in the administration and on the Board of Regents. The last thing the U needs is an AD who takes orders from the football coach. As a long time football season ticket holder, I am happy she didn't get the job.

I don't think you understand politics.

 

[GopherBulldog]

Tracy Claeys has vocal in his support for Beth Goetz. Heck, for Claeys VERY vocal. Goetz was also a favorite of Jerry Kill's. Count me in with the crowd that wanted an A.D. with more of a background in schools with football programs. Coyle had experience here, successful experience at Boise State and at Syracuse? That was too short for anything but an incomplete.

When Kimberly Hewitt, the director of the aforementioned EOAA office, July email ended up with a Star Tribune article last October claiming that some football players had been accused of sexual assault, sexual harassment and retaliation in the 2014-15 academic year, Goetz's silence on the matter was interpreted as non-support. Kill was very upset that Kaler had, internally at least, sided with the email.

Rumors are/were Goetz was on Kill's side here. She didn't side with the email's conclusion on the football team. Maybe it was because of her relationship with Kill. Maybe she didn't like the feeling of a vendetta against the team. Maybe she supported the cause, but not the approach. Could be because none of those accusations ended up with expulsion or even suspension. Who knows.

Over the last few weeks, I've come to a surprising conclusion.

Lord, I miss Beth Goetz.

Now that's an interesting take on things. I was also over-the-moon about the hiring of Coyle. Seemed like we were getting an experienced, sincere guy that really cared about the University and could LEAD the athletics department. I see no evidence of this based on how he's handled the current situation. I was very concerned that Beth was going to get the nod. Can we get a do-over?

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Tracy Claeys has vocal in his support for Beth Goetz. Heck, for Claeys VERY vocal. Goetz was also a favorite of Jerry Kill's. Count me in with the crowd that wanted an A.D. with more of a background in schools with football programs. Coyle had experience here, successful experience at Boise State and at Syracuse? That was too short for anything but an incomplete.

When Kimberly Hewitt, the director of the aforementioned EOAA office, July email ended up with a Star Tribune article last October claiming that some football players had been accused of sexual assault, sexual harassment and retaliation in the 2014-15 academic year, Goetz's silence on the matter was interpreted as non-support. Kill was very upset that Kaler had, internally at least, sided with the email.

Rumors are/were Goetz was on Kill's side here. She didn't side with the email's conclusion on the football team. Maybe it was because of her relationship with Kill. Maybe she didn't like the feeling of a vendetta against the team. Maybe she supported the cause, but not the approach. Could be because none of those accusations ended up with expulsion or even suspension. Who knows.

Over the last few weeks, I've come to a surprising conclusion.

Lord, I miss Beth Goetz.

The issue with these Title IX offices on college campuses is very real. The U of MN is not going to be the place where any of this gets resolved because any sort of discussion about the topic is seen as being blind homerism to a football team. It's absurd, but it's sort of part of what the Title IX offices know. They position themselves to make a discussion about them and their role into an anti-woman/pro-rape stance.

This is not me tooting my own horn, I was not prophetic about this situation, but this entire situation went exactly like I said it would after I found out the title IX office was involved. Anyone who has done any work with these entities knows their M.O. It is fascism disguised as social justice. I understand why some people on this board are thinking that I am just railing against a University investigation. I get it. Before I ever had any contact with these offices, I could not imagine their lunacy and the amount of power they hold. Now, I am not saying that they never catch "bad guys", I am saying that are politically motivated and they cast such an enormously wide net, that it's nearly impossible to determine if the people they catch are guilty or not. It's unfair and if you are really concerned with punishing sexual assault. . . ineffective.

 

[GringaGopher]

Now that's an interesting take on things. I was also over-the-moon about the hiring of Coyle. Seemed like we were getting an experienced, sincere guy that really cared about the University and could LEAD the athletics department. I see no evidence of this based on how he's handled the current situation. I was very concerned that Beth was going to get the nod. Can we get a do-over?

I have been a long time season ticket holder for FB and men/ women's BB. I had the opportunity to meet and talk with Beth Goetz on a number of occasions. My sense was she was in - experienced but understood how to advocate for the coaches and athletes. That does not automatically translate into a great AD but I read many posts on GH that she was not qualified because she did not understand big level FB. So glad we held out for the current spineless Coyle.

 

[Iceland12]

The issue ...

Bob? I'd still rather have Beth over there handling things than Mark.

Though, Happy New Year to you and your family!

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Bob? I'd still rather have Beth over there handling things than Mark.

Though, Happy New Year to you and your family!

Yeah, to be honest. I don't know enough about Mark or Beth. The situation is so difficult.

To you too!

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

I have been a long time season ticket holder for FB and men/ women's BB. I had the opportunity to meet and talk with Beth Goetz on a number of occasions. My sense was she was in - experienced but understood how to advocate for the coaches and athletes. That does not automatically translate into a great AD but I read many posts on GH that she was not qualified because she did not understand big level FB. So glad we held out for the current spineless Coyle.

I asked this question in another thread but didn't get an answer so I'll ask it again. For those of you who have directed your hatred towards Coyle, why? I understand that it seems like his communication to Claeys was poor, but because of privacy laws, his boss likely told him he couldn't say anything. Coyle couldn't really do anything in this situation. The suspensions came from above him.

So I understand the issues with Kaler, but I do not understand why people think Coyle is spineless or should be fired. His hands were tied.

 

[GopherBulldog]

I asked this question in another thread but didn't get an answer so I'll ask it again. For those of you who have directed your hatred towards Coyle, why? I understand that it seems like his communication to Claeys was poor, but because of privacy laws, his boss likely told him he couldn't say anything. Coyle couldn't really do anything in this situation. The suspensions came from above him.

So I understand the issues with Kaler, but I do not understand why people think Coyle is spineless or should be fired. His hands were tied.

Read the thread.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

Read the thread.

I did, it's not the same situation. These players are currently expelled and suspended from school, pending a hearing. That decision is not made by the AD. I don't know what the exact rules are, but I'm pretty sure if you are expelled and suspended from school, you can't play.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

I asked this question in another thread but didn't get an answer so I'll ask it again. For those of you who have directed your hatred towards Coyle, why? I understand that it seems like his communication to Claeys was poor, but because of privacy laws, his boss likely told him he couldn't say anything. Coyle couldn't really do anything in this situation. The suspensions came from above him.

So I understand the issues with Kaler, but I do not understand why people think Coyle is spineless or should be fired. His hands were tied.

Yeah, I don't know what Coyle could really have done.

The situation is largely over his head.

 

[Iceland12]

I did, it's not the same situation. These players are currently expelled and suspended from school, pending a hearing. That decision is not made by the AD. I don't know what the exact rules are, but I'm pretty sure if you are expelled and suspended from school, you can't play.

Can only speak for myself. Just feel that Goetz would have been more visible throughout this mess. Actually maybe even answered questions in public. Don't know if Coyle has been upfront with Claeys or not, but feel that Goetz certainly would have been. They had already established a mutually respectful working relationship.

Now if everybody was just following orders from Kaler, it might not have made a difference anyway. Though it seems hard to believe that she would have went along with the insinuation that Claeys agreed with the decision to suspend without hearings.

But "just following orders" aside, still would rather have Goetz.

 

[Spoofin]

I don't think you understand politics.

Are we starting a list of things that UpNorth doesn't understand?


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[Vandy]

Are we starting a list of things that UpNorth doesn't understand?

How much bandwidth is available to Gopherhole?

 

[60's Guy]

Oh, just missing the hearing is all

I did, it's not the same situation. These players are currently expelled and suspended from school, pending a hearing. That decision is not made by the AD. I don't know what the exact rules are, but I'm pretty sure if you are expelled and suspended from school, you can't play.

They are suspended because Kaler said so half way through the process. They have not had the opportunity to defend themselves. Their fate has not been decided, it has been recommended half way to conclusion. They are eligible in every way except Kaler suspended them before the conclusion of the process.
The legal authorities have now said twice there is not evidence of a crime. The players contention is it was consensual. The legal conclusion seems to agree. Taking the 5th at restraining order discussions seems to support this.
All this makes it easy to see why the one side brandished as guilty would be upset.
Let the process conclude, then announce punishment or innocence. Don't punish people who were not participants. So many reasons it's poorly handled.

 

[gopherhoopsguy]

They are suspended because Kaler said so half way through the process. They have not had the opportunity to defend themselves. Their fate has not been decided, it has been recommended half way to conclusion. They are eligible in every way except Kaler suspended them before the conclusion of the process.
The legal authorities have now said twice there is not evidence of a crime. The players contention is it was consensual. The legal conclusion seems to agree. Taking the 5th at restraining order discussions seems to support this.
All this makes it easy to see why the one side brandished as guilty would be upset.
Let the process conclude, then announce punishment or innocence. Don't punish people who were not participants. So many reasons it's poorly handled.

Exactly! Kaler and Coyle need to be fired!

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

They are suspended because Kaler said so half way through the process. They have not had the opportunity to defend themselves. Their fate has not been decided, it has been recommended half way to conclusion. They are eligible in every way except Kaler suspended them before the conclusion of the process.
The legal authorities have now said twice there is not evidence of a crime. The players contention is it was consensual. The legal conclusion seems to agree. Taking the 5th at restraining order discussions seems to support this.
All this makes it easy to see why the one side brandished as guilty would be upset.
Let the process conclude, then announce punishment or innocence. Don't punish people who were not participants. So many reasons it's poorly handled.

It's not halfway through the process. The players are currently expelled/suspended by the school, because they broke the student code of conduct. Not because they broke any laws. They are not currently eligible. They can be reinstated if they win the hearing. This was a school decision with Kaler's backing.

If you have hatred towards the process, it should be directed at Kaler and the school rules and not Coyle, that's my point. Coyle is powerless in this situation.

 

[Iceland12]

It's not halfway through the process. The players are currently expelled/suspended by the school, because they broke the student code of conduct. Not because they broke any laws. They are not currently eligible. They can be reinstated if they win the hearing. This was a school decision with Kaler's backing.

If you have hatred towards the process, it should be directed at Kaler and the school rules and not Coyle, that's my point. Coyle is powerless in this situation.

And invisible as well.

 

[GopherBulldog]

It's not halfway through the process. The players are currently expelled/suspended by the school, because they broke the student code of conduct. Not because they broke any laws. They are not currently eligible. They can be reinstated if they win the hearing. This was a school decision with Kaler's backing.

If you have hatred towards the process, it should be directed at Kaler and the school rules and not Coyle, that's my point. Coyle is powerless in this situation.

Correction. Coyle has decided to make himself powerless. He could have taken a stand on either side long ago. Chose not to. It spiraled out of control on his watch. I hope he can find a way to elegantly resolve it. But I'm afraid the opportunity to take decisive control of the situation has likely passed.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

And invisible as well.

But like you said in the OP, Goetz was silent on a lesser issue. It's possible behind the scenes that Coyle does think the players should be allowed to play. Maybe that's why they were allowed to play when the police investigation concluded.

Coyle as a brand new AD is not going to publicly speak out against his boss. He has no power to reinstate the players himself. He really has no choice other than to be the silent middle man.

 

[Spoofin]

Coyle was the cause of the boycott. Maybe he could have stopped that. When Kaler almost had them reinstate the boycott a second time Coyle was by his side and the Regents (not Coyle) had to save that. Coyle lied about TC's involvement and lost respect from his coaches. Should we go on?


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[Dano564]

Reading this thread was a waste of time.

I'm not sure what the intent was but to may cling to the hope that having Beth here would have somehow kept players playing who shouldn't be due to what Kaler and the EOEOAA decided.

 

[Iceland12]

Reading this thread was a waste of time.

I'm not sure what the intent was but to may cling to the hope that having Beth here would have somehow kept players playing who shouldn't be due to what Kaler and the EOEOAA decided.

Face the Facts! Coming from you that's a downright endorsement!

And so well written too..

 

[GopherBulldog]

Reading this thread was a waste of time.

I'm not sure what the intent was but to may cling to the hope that having Beth here would have somehow kept players playing who shouldn't be due to what Kaler and the EOEOAA decided.

Can we just call them the E-I-E-I-O from now on? Harder to type, but it's got a certain ring to it.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

Coyle was the cause of the boycott. Maybe he could have stopped that. When Kaler almost had them reinstate the boycott a second time Coyle was by his side and the Regents (not Coyle) had to save that. Coyle lied about TC's involvement and lost respect from his coaches. Should we go on?

You don't know what the exact conversation was between Kaler/Coyle/Claeys. Kaler lied about TC's involvement, not Coyle. Claeys should have just went along with it because he had no choice whether the players were suspended or not, and neither did Coyle.

 

[Spoofin]

Kaler said it initially in his letter. Coyle later said he and Claeys decided together. Both were lies.


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[60's Guy]

It's not halfway through the process. The players are currently expelled/suspended by the school, because they broke the student code of conduct. Not because they broke any laws. They are not currently eligible. They can be reinstated if they win the hearing. This was a school decision with Kaler's backing.

If you have hatred towards the process, it should be directed at Kaler and the school rules and not Coyle, that's my point. Coyle is powerless in this situation.

EOCC Recommended they be punished...not ordered. Kaler poured gasoline on it and suspended them prior to their hearings. Not the school's decision, Kaler's decision. We don't know they broke any conduct rules at this point...their side has not been heard.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

EOCC Recommended they be punished...not ordered. Kaler poured gasoline on it and suspended them prior to their hearings. Not the school's decision, Kaler's decision. We don't know they broke any conduct rules at this point...their side has not been heard.

Here's the statement on the cover letter sent from Sharon Dzik - Director of the Office for Student Conduct and Academic Integrity, that was leaked with the EOAA report.

Subd. 19. Violation of University Rules. Violation of University rules means engaging in conduct that violates
University, collegiate, or deparimental regulations that have been posted or publicized, including provisions
contained in University contracts with students. Specifically you were found to have violated the following:

Administrative Policv· Sexual Harassment
Administrative Policy: Sexyal Assault Stalkin~ and Relationship Violence

Subd. 21. Persistent Violations. Persistent Violations means engaging in repeated conduct or action in violation of
this Code.

As a result of these violations, you are being offered the following sanctions to resolve this matter informally:
EXPULSION: Effective immediately your University of Minnesota studentship will be ended with resultant loss of
all student rights and privileges. A disciplinary hold will be placed on your record. The hold will prever1t you from
registering at the University and from obtaining your records through routine channels.

Both you and the reporting student are being notified of this outcome at the same time. Each party has the option to
request a formal hearing by the Student Sexual Misconduct Subcommittee (SSMS) if the outcome is unacceptable. If
I have not heard from either party within five business days (by December 20, 2016) of sending this letter, then the
decision will stand.