B1G Talent

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Word said:
Didn't Claeys take this low-talent group of players on the road, with a backup quarterback last year and pretty easily defeat Maryland? Or am I forgetting something?
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Yes, you are. Claeys took a different group of players--last years group. This year is largely different for a host of reasons that we know all to well.

There's no question that a better coach given the exact same group makes a big difference--just look at Horton succeeding Brewster. Occassionally, you get a Bear Bryant (as one rival said, "He can take his and beat ours, or he can take ours and beat his.")
 

TruDomGopher said:
Yes, you are. Claeys took a different group of players--last years group. This year is largely different for a host of reasons that we know all to well.

There's no question that a better coach given the exact same group makes a big difference--just look at Horton succeeding Brewster. Occassionally, you get a Bear Bryant (as one rival said, "He can take his and beat ours, or he can take ours and beat his.")
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Claeys still took a low-rated group of players (which is the entire premise of this thread) on the road to Maryland and won.

Also - are you equating Jeff Horton with Bear Bryant? That would be a first.
 

Word said:
Claeys still took a low-rated group of players (which is the entire premise of this thread) on the road to Maryland and won.

Also - are you equating Jeff Horton with Bear Bryant? That would be a first.
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LOL. If I were equating Horton with Bryant you'd be completely justified in assuming I'm a moron. And assuming I'd spell it "moran".
 


Word said:
Didn't Claeys take this low-talent group of players on the road, with a backup quarterback last year and pretty easily defeat Maryland? Or am I forgetting something?
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The difference being last year the Gophers were +4 in turnovers and won in a rout this year the Gophers were -2 in turnovers.
 


Word said:
Claeys still took a low-rated group of players (which is the entire premise of this thread) on the road to Maryland and won.

Also - are you equating Jeff Horton with Bear Bryant? That would be a first.
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You're only correct in a world where nothing ever changes.
 

goldy93 said:
Nope. I simply showed the flawed logic in blaming one or the other, instead of both.
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It's flawed logic to state coaching wasn't a large part of the issue when we clearly put enough points on the board.


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CentralGopher said:
It's flawed logic to state coaching wasn't a large part of the issue when we clearly put enough points on the board.


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We didn't put enough points on the board. We lost.
We got out played, out coached and they played with more urgency than we did.
 

CentralGopher said:
It's flawed logic to state coaching wasn't a large part of the issue when we clearly put enough points on the board.


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And, it is willful ignorance to not admit what your eyeballs told you in that Maryland was faster, tougher and more athletic at nearly every position on the field.
 



A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
You're only correct in a world where nothing ever changes.
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Oh - I get all that. I am just arguing that making the excuse that we lost due to recruiting rankings is silly. We lost because we were outcoached and outplayed. That doesn't mean I think PJ and co. can't coach. Maybe they just had one bad day. I'm sure we could look back and find some games that Kill and Claeys were outcoached - and they probably would have admitted it. I'm also sure deep down PJ and co. know that they could have had a better game plan (or maybe they even said so - I haven't listened to all of the press from PJ).
 

I'm pretty sure the rest of the B1G would've loved it if Minnesota stuck with the Claeys regime. It remains to be seen whether Fleck can win and recruit with the B1G's big boys...but with Claeys there was no doubt, he couldn't.

A single game doesn't impact the direction of good programs.
 

Pedantic said:
I'm pretty sure the rest of the B1G would've loved it if Minnesota stuck with the Claeys regime. It remains to be seen whether Fleck can win and recruit with the B1G's big boys...but with Claeys there was no doubt, he couldn't.

A single game doesn't impact the direction of good programs.
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I don't think the rest of the B1G cares at all if we change coaches or not ....
 

Pedantic said:
I'm pretty sure the rest of the B1G would've loved it if Minnesota stuck with the Claeys regime. It remains to be seen whether Fleck can win and recruit with the B1G's big boys...but with Claeys there was no doubt, he couldn't.
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Ha, ok - based on what?
 



goldy93 said:
And, it is willful ignorance to not admit what your eyeballs told you in that Maryland was faster, tougher and more athletic at nearly every position on the field.
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Sorry, but recruiting isn't why we lost. No eyeballing needed. Maryland isn't a top teir team so there is no reason we should have allowed that many points to them. Obviously there are many reasons why we did but coaching is a big one.


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CentralGopher said:
Sorry, but recruiting isn't why we lost. No eyeballing needed. Maryland isn't a top teir team so there is no reason we should have allowed that many points to them. Obviously there are many reasons why we did but coaching is a big one.


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Other than your last sentence, nothing else made sense.
 

None of the guys we've lost to graduation or to discipline were highly rated by the croot sites. 'Jus sayin.

We are young getting younger on defense but I expect this staff to field a solid defense. We have to give a mulligan particularly this year. If they aren't recruiting quality JUCOs to plug in and fill gaps that's a choice. Prevent scheme is a choice. Offensive scheme a choice.
 



goldy93 said:
And, it is willful ignorance to not admit what your eyeballs told you in that Maryland was faster, tougher and more athletic at nearly every position on the field.
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Tougher usually reflects the coaching staff.
 



Word said:
Claeys still took a low-rated group of players (which is the entire premise of this thread) on the road to Maryland and won.

Also - are you equating Jeff Horton with Bear Bryant? That would be a first.
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Claeys squeaked out a 7 point win at home vs Oregon St.

Fleck led us to a 34 point road victory.

I can play this game too...
 


John Galt said:
Claeys squeaked out a 7 point win at home vs Oregon St.

Fleck led us to a 34 point road victory.

I can play this game too...
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But he did win JG[emoji6]


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GFBfan said:
We didn't put enough points on the board. We lost.
We got out played, out coached and they played with more urgency than we did.
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Were you equally as critical of the offensive coaching in last year's Maryland game?

Offensive points scored: 2016: 24 2017: 24
Total Yards: 2016: 311 2017: 309
Time of possession: 2016: 25:48 2017: 27:45
Maryland Turnovers: 2016: 4 2017: 0
Minnesota Turnovers: 2016: 0 2017: 2
Minnesota punts: 2016: 7 2017: 3

The Gophers offense vs Maryland was every bit as good if not better this year with fewer opportunities. What happens if Rhoda doesn't throw an interception on Maryland's 5 yard line? What happens if Rhoda just keeps the ball once or twice on the read option? What happens if Huff doesn't drop an easy interception? Winfield made that play last year and returned it for a TD.

The difference in this game was the defense. Last year we took advantage of a true Freshman QB in his first career start. This year Maryland's talented and experienced offensive line manhandled our undersized defensive line. That in combination with missing our two best tackling safeties is why they continually gashed us up the middle. This is our worst group of CBs since the pre-Murray era and allowed Moore to do pretty much what he wanted.

Even with all of that the game was still tied with 3:54 remaining. The players on defense didn't step up and make a play when they needed to.
 


John Galt said:
Claeys squeaked out a 7 point win at home vs Oregon St.

Fleck led us to a 34 point road victory.

I can play this game too...
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Wow, you really don't understand the argument do you? I'm not making excuses for Claeys. I'm saying that blaming the loss to Maryland on recruiting rankings is silly. I'm not sure what that has to do with a game Claeys won.
 



Peej inherited a nine win bowl winning team that beat Wazoo last year, the same Wazoo who just took USC down. Sorry, no excuses. His losses should have been MORE than offset by the recruits he "redirected" from his class at WMU and the time he had to recruit in January. No reason for that big of a drop from last year other than the coaching change.
 

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