An excellent article - "The End of Paterno"

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Great piece. Thank you. Very good points... Can't agree more.
 

Good article, and I understand his points about letting the truth come out and we don't know what Paterno knew yet, but at the same time upon concluding the article I thought of the news today that Paterno is in the process of hiring a defense attorney, something he wouldn't/shouldn't need to do if there was nothing to blame on Paterno.
 

Good article, but I think it fell a bit flat at the end. We all pay a price for our actions/inactions in some way, shape, or form. That's the nature of decisions good or bad. The fact that Paterno sits on a much higher perch only magnifies the human condition.
 

dpodoll68 said:
From the best sportswriter working:

http://joeposnanski.si.com/2011/11/10/the-end-of-paterno/?sct=hp_wr_a5&eref=sihp

He more or less shares my thoughts exactly, and expresses them better than I ever could.
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WRONG on agreeing with his thoughts exactly. We have to remember - and Joe Pa should as a Catholic- that this all occurred at the same time as the crisis in the Church with priests. Everyone who has picked up a paper in the last two decades should know that Sandusky's alleged behavior isn't to be tolerated, and as numerous bishops and dioceses have have found out the hard way- must be turned over to the police (not any rinky dinky campus cop or supervisor)- job one protect kids.

Anyone who has been even minimally alert knows what needs to be done. Does it make Joe Pa evil, no. Does is make him wrong and deserve to be canned- yes.
 


I also understand his points, and in time, people will let the truth come out.

This whole thing is just beyond bad. People will let their emotions get the best of them in situations like this. But who can blame them? Watching and reading everything early this week made me so mad. Ask my fiance, I was so pissed off Wednesday night I had to turn the channel.

But I've already calmed down and am to the point of "let's let it play out and see what happens". I think most everyone will do the same.
 

Triple D said:
Good article, and I understand his points about letting the truth come out and we don't know what Paterno knew yet, but at the same time upon concluding the article I thought of the news today that Paterno is in the process of hiring a defense attorney, something he wouldn't/shouldn't need to do if there was nothing to blame on Paterno.
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He will be sued in Civil Court for sure.
 

Not to take Sandusky's side, but he is obviously a very sick and troubled man. ANd Paterno was his boss and friend. Why didn't he do something to get this sick sob some help? What kind of friend puts his reputation ahead of friendship??

And McQuery is a REAL villain. This big lug ran away from a child being raped, anally of all things. And all he did was call Daddy and then wait till the next day to talk to JoePaI'm surprisederno. Why didn't McQueer do something about this boy??? Get him help after he did a citizxen arrest on Sandusky??? This is the worst crisis in NCAA history. We need major changes. ANd those rioting students and probably the same guys who got mad at Goldie for mocking the praying mantis Lion a few yrs back
 

Sorry, but how many 10 and 11 year old kids were raped after Paterno did find out? Even one would trump everything else, and it appears it was way more than that. Also, Penn State might have let him dangle for a couple of days, but this is also a guy who tried to dictate how he would be able to go out by announcing his retirement. And, as Triple D has pointed out, don't feel sorry at all for poor JoePa not being able to tell his story. He could now, but obviously lawyers have told him to keep his mouth shut. People are piling on because this is so horrific; if you have a statue created for you while you're alive, you better not fail to live up to that status as badly as this.
 



The folks at Penn State made their own beds and now it comes time for them to lie in them. Paterno was aware of allegation of child abuse against Sandusky for years and, apparently, ignored them. That cost him his job.

I read an interesting article that is peripherally related questioning why this whole mess did not come to light earlier: http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/11/us-media-pennstate-idUSTRE7AA4YJ20111111.
 

Thanks for posting harrys ghost.

I don't buy the budget-cut argument put forth by the newspapers. I think it's more a case, especially in Happy Valley, of the expectation that the Harrisburg newspaper be a public relations extension of Penn State. I think that's a big problem in the media at all levels today and if we lose the independent press . . .
 





drinks at Northpoint said:
I find it odd it didn't come out until AFTER Joe Pa won his record breaking game.
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It came out after he tied the record. He's not going to break it. It is curious, but I have a hard time imagining a conspiracy. If someone wanted to derail his breaking the record, why not release this before he even tied the record? And if someone was holding off to make sure he got the record, why not hold it off until he had broken it?
 

There is nothing that gives prosecutors perfect knowledge in complicated situations and one should have a defense attorney before one is deposed, not after the issue goes public. Look at the prosecutor in the Jon Benet Ramsey case where he tormented the parents and apparently was completely wrong about them (that is the last version I have heard). How many people have you heard of in the last few years who spent time in jail for crimes they did not commit, lots even if it is a small percentage. This is an emotional, disgusting crime where juries will want to punish the perpetrator, as I would, but it is everyone's personal responsiblity to make sure they are not convicted incorrectly. Delegating that to the prosecutor is a bigger leap of faith than I would make.
Another question is why Sandusky was not prosecuted a decade ago by a prosecutor who had a reputation as a non-political, tough prosecutor, when it appears he was guilty and it was known by multiple people. (I am not doubting his guilt at all, but the lack of prosecution seems really strange.) Given that the guy is missing we will apparently never know, but the whole situation is so screwed up in addition to being terrible, that if I was a coach on the team who never had anything to do with it, I think I would still talk to an attorney.
 

corcoran1 said:
There is nothing that gives prosecutors perfect knowledge in complicated situations and one should have a defense attorney before one is deposed, not after the issue goes public. Look at the prosecutor in the Jon Benet Ramsey case where he tormented the parents and apparently was completely wrong about them (that is the last version I have heard). How many people have you heard of in the last few years who spent time in jail for crimes they did not commit, lots even if it is a small percentage. This is an emotional, disgusting crime where juries will want to punish the perpetrator, as I would, but it is everyone's personal responsiblity to make sure they are not convicted incorrectly. Delegating that to the prosecutor is a bigger leap of faith than I would make.
Another question is why Sandusky was not prosecuted a decade ago by a prosecutor who had a reputation as a non-political, tough prosecutor, when it appears he was guilty and it was known by multiple people. (I am not doubting his guilt at all, but the lack of prosecution seems really strange.) Given that the guy is missing we will apparently never know, but the whole situation is so screwed up in addition to being terrible, that if I was a coach on the team who never had anything to do with it, I think I would still talk to an attorney.
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Editing Shakespeare a bit, "Let's kill all the lawyers, but only after I'm done talking with mine."
 


I'm sorry, but I don't really agree with this article. I like the author and all, but why must we suddenly not pile on Paterno? Why should anybody who he's helped rush to defend him? In time, yes, let's quietly say good things about Paterno and let those stories come out if we find out he was just senile instead of being part of a cover-up. But right now, the rage that's boiling over from this story is fully justified. And it's justified at Paterno because it certainly looks like he could've stopped it.

Listen, I think we all know - if we ever stop to sit back and reflect - that it's at least a little bit ridiculous that we all care this much about college football. It's just a game, but we spend hundreds or thousands of dollars per year to watch it and additional hours upon hours discussing it and thinking about it. Because of this, there has been an elite created that largely operates above the rules. We mostly don't care, because we don't see a whole lot of real harm involved - yes, certain kids are getting college degrees and other monetary and other perks that they shouldn't be getting, but that's relatively small beer in the grand scheme of things.

But, in this case, the ugly, ugly, ugly truth is revealed, that no - people were being hurt, severely hurt. And not just any people, but innocent young children, those who as a society we should most protect, were being violated in the worst possible way. And the elite - Joe Paterno ran Penn St, let's not kid ourselves - were allegedly aware of this and did very, very little to stop it. The covered it up and tried to push it off campus. This is why it's so hideous - because it reflects back on us. Yes, yes, it's all alleged at this point. But there is NO reason for anyone to rush to Joe's defense at this hour.
 

Golden Elephant said:
I'm sorry, but I don't really agree with this article. I like the author and all, but why must we suddenly not pile on Paterno? Why should anybody who he's helped rush to defend him? In time, yes, let's quietly say good things about Paterno and let those stories come out if we find out he was just senile instead of being part of a cover-up. But right now, the rage that's boiling over from this story is fully justified. And it's justified at Paterno because it certainly looks like he could've stopped it.

Listen, I think we all know - if we ever stop to sit back and reflect - that it's at least a little bit ridiculous that we all care this much about college football. It's just a game, but we spend hundreds or thousands of dollars per year to watch it and additional hours upon hours discussing it and thinking about it. Because of this, there has been an elite created that largely operates above the rules. We mostly don't care, because we don't see a whole lot of real harm involved - yes, certain kids are getting college degrees and other monetary and other perks that they shouldn't be getting, but that's relatively small beer in the grand scheme of things.

But, in this case, the ugly, ugly, ugly truth is revealed, that no - people were being hurt, severely hurt. And not just any people, but innocent young children, those who as a society we should most protect, were being violated in the worst possible way. And the elite - Joe Paterno ran Penn St, let's not kid ourselves - were allegedly aware of this and did very, very little to stop it. The covered it up and tried to push it off campus. This is why it's so hideous - because it reflects back on us. Yes, yes, it's all alleged at this point. But there is NO reason for anyone to rush to Joe's defense at this hour.
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I don't disagree with you, but I thought Posnanski has done a reasonable job coming forward with another defense instead of simply saying "It's an alliance of the Tea Party and the Femi-Nazis who are bent on bringing down Paterno!"

Your second paragraph is really golden. People get mad at Reusse or Souhan when they write something negative as if something that is crucial to the continuance of Western Civilization is at stake in the debate. Many of those same people are decrying the silence of the Pennsylvania media for not writing something negative about this much larger and more important by a magnitude of a million issue. At base level, it boils down to, as you say, the fact that we have come to permit college athletics to be run by a cadre of elites who, as we see here in a criminal sense and as we've seen in greater multitude in terms of institutional/booster rot in the pursuit of recruits, who don't really give a crap about us sheep who sit out here and consume whatever they are ladling out. And before I go further, as someone closing in on 3,000 posts, I'll admit I'm as guilty as anyone else in falling for it.
 

Although the situation is tragic, I do not think Paterno is at fault for everything. According to my understanding of the victim 2 report from the grand jury, I think with the ethics around chain of command and Whistle Blowing, Joe did it the right way and contacted the AD and president. After that meeting, the AD, president and joe should of concluded that Sandusky is not to be around the program any more.

Also, With the multiple reports and investegations Sandusky had before 2002, why was he allowed to be around kids anyways. I think it would be interesting to hear Paternos story of what happened.

What would you do if you heard that someone who is like brother to you was butt- raping a boy in the shower? I would be taken back by it and try to reason how it would have to be something else, but I would still report it because as people we should have no tolerance for these things. If an investegation proved innocent then no harm done, but if found guilty, it would put another pervert in Jail.
 

I don't doubt that Paterno is a great man who has done a lot of good for a lot of people. But knowing what little we know, it is obvious that there was absolutely no way he could continue to go on coaching as he has for the last 120 years. And the fact that he thought it possible to do so means one, or some combination of, the following three things:

1.) He is no longer all that mentally-stable.
2.) He doesn't comprehend the magnitude of what happened, and is therefore insensitive.
3.) He is a dolt who has been manipulated and is the fall-guy now that the crap has hit the fan.
 

"Did I mention that I was writing a book about Joe Paterno? It'll be out real soon. Lots to know about Joe Paterno; read all about him in my new biography about Joe Paterno, it will be released very soon, I am working on it right this minute! How convenient that my new book about Joe Paterno (soon to be released!) will be coming out right as this scandal broke. Who knew?! Joe is not such a bad person that you wouldn't want to know more about him, he's led a remarkable life. You should know more about him. Did I mention my new book about Paterno???"
 

Mick Turition said:
"Did I mention that I was writing a book about Joe Paterno? It'll be out real soon. Lots to know about Joe Paterno; read all about him in my new biography about Joe Paterno, it will be released very soon, I am working on it right this minute! How convenient that my new book about Joe Paterno (soon to be released!) will be coming out right as this scandal broke. Who knew?! Joe is not such a bad person that you wouldn't want to know more about him, he's led a remarkable life. You should know more about him. Did I mention my new book about Paterno???"
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Right on the money, Mick. Posnanski is one of the few columnists in the country who is looking for a way to excuse Paterno's behavior. It is not hard to come to the conclusion that Posnanski has so much invested in Paterno and his book that he is he is turning a blind eye to what is obvious to most of us. Paterno was aware there were concerns about Sandusky and his relationships with small boys in 2002 (and probably much earlier) and yet for years after he allowed Sandusky to bring the boys on the Penn State campus and to bowl games just as if he was still one the coaches. There can be absolutely no reasonable excuse for allowing this to happen.
 

facts

pedophile lures children with access to program

Coach knows that an individual in program fondles children

pedophile has continued access to program

This by itself is a failure.

Pretend you have an employee, and another employee says he saw him fondling a child. (I'm saying fondling for all those who believe Joe Pa "didn't understand the full measure of the offense). Can you look this guy in the eye anymore? Due process be damned, you have that in your head forever. Unfair? Maybe, but to error on the side of adult due process versus protecting children is risking a lot.

So, you have the accusation, and you also know that your employee runs a foundation that puts him in regular contact with possible victims? Oh, by the way, he still has the run of the football building.

I think you'd at least protect your place of employment by distancing yourself as far as possible. That's the least.

Joe Pa did none of this. I don't care if he previously rescued puppies wearing bows from a drainpipe on Christmas. He really did the very least he could do to stop this evil, and far less than any father on this board would have done.

If any of us got the vibe that our son's baseball coach liked taking showers with the kids, we'd be on the phone in about 2 seconds. And maybe that guy just liked efficiency, and didn't like wasting water. Maybe he'd lose his job being falsely accused of liking little boys. I don't care.

There are numerous lines not be crossed, and anyone who has contact with children has had the mandatory training to explain those lines. You cross them, you don't get to work with kids. Misunderstanding or no, you lose your job.

Paterno knew this guy was a creep, and allowed him back in the building as a non-employee. He has no obligation to do so. This tells you enough. This is why he lost his job. And he should have.

These are boys, for God's sake. I'm pretty libertarian in my views, as a whole, but if I had an employee tell me that a friend of mine was soaping a young boy in the shower, I'd have a hard time not punching the offender in the face. If I heard he anally raped a boy, I'd for sure punch him in the face. If it is a false accusation, I'd apologize, explain, and I'd bet a decent human being would understand the anger.

It's pretty simple.

We protect children at the expense of adults, because adults get due process, and children just get messed up while we wait.

This story makes me sick beyond belief as a father of a son, and everyone involved knows they did wrong. Fire them all. It isn't even close to justice.
 

Mick Turition said:
"Did I mention that I was writing a book about Joe Paterno? It'll be out real soon. Lots to know about Joe Paterno; read all about him in my new biography about Joe Paterno, it will be released very soon, I am working on it right this minute! How convenient that my new book about Joe Paterno (soon to be released!) will be coming out right as this scandal broke. Who knew?! Joe is not such a bad person that you wouldn't want to know more about him, he's led a remarkable life. You should know more about him. Did I mention my new book about Paterno???"
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LOL. Nailed.
 

This was about protecting the FB program plain and simple. If the powers that be had put the victims first this criminal case would have been settled years ago. The Kingdoms and Castles that were built around this program have come tumbling down!!
 

Joe Paterno is a hypocrite. He preached the moral high ground, the Penn State way, following the rules, not cheating. He donated money to school. He cloaked himself as a paragon of virtue. But when it came to Jerry Sandusky a former player, and a 30 year coaching career at Penn State it is not a matter of what he knew or when he knew it. It is the fact, he did nothing. And it defies crediblity that no one else on the staff was not aware nor appauled. Most who have been there 25 or 30 years. For those on this staff who remain, the season cannot end to soon for me. The trainers, medical staff, Janitors, security officers, everyone must go. They need to litterally clean house. Those with short memories can go back to the killing of the Baylor Basketball player and the coverup. That nearly drew the death peanalty from the NCAA. And now Mark Emmert has said he will monitor events, wait for the legal process to run its course, and then look to see if there were NCAA violations. This isn't over, its just getting started. And the civil suits will be in the news for at least 5 years. Joe Paterno will be judged not only for 400 wins, but also for his conspiracy of cowardice.
 

Mick Turition said:
"Did I mention that I was writing a book about Joe Paterno? It'll be out real soon. Lots to know about Joe Paterno; read all about him in my new biography about Joe Paterno, it will be released very soon, I am working on it right this minute! How convenient that my new book about Joe Paterno (soon to be released!) will be coming out right as this scandal broke. Who knew?! Joe is not such a bad person that you wouldn't want to know more about him, he's led a remarkable life. You should know more about him. Did I mention my new book about Paterno???"
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Post of the day!
 


Switzer says a few things no one has really talked about and it has the ring of truth. I don't see how a guy like Sandusky could have been so brazen to do what McQueary witnessed (with his eyes, ears, or both) and not be detected (or at least suspected) by others.
 

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