All-Things 2023 Minnesota Wild Off-Season Thread

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

The Gila River Arena that the Coyotes were playing in was an absolute shithole. I went to 2 different Coyote games there a few years ago and I thought I was walking into an AHL game. It was a terrible game-day experience.

The PHX metro area is big and the transplants/snowbirds are spread all over the place. It's not likely there will be a great place that will satisfy everyone in regards to a new arena.

 

[Gophers_4life]

Don't you mean 3rd crack?

Relo #1 - to Calgary
Relo #2 - to Winnipeg

Whoops! Yep!

TBH, I had no idea the Flames started in Atlanta!

 

[Gophers_4life]

The Mullet Arena (great name LOL) looks nice, but only 5k. Similar to arenas built in Iowa City and Fargo, probably other places, for smaller (semi-?)professional teams.

Great for ASU but not sustainable for NHL.

 

[Ope3]

Another viable option I think would be Milwaukee except the Chicago Blackhawks would make that rather difficult.

 

[GopherJake]

I wonder if a 2nd franchise in the Toronto area gets explored or nearby Hamilton. I think the population and appetite is there to support two.

Yeah, and with Toronto - an original sixer - having never made the Stanley Cup Finals since before expansion (1967), it would be ripe for a relocated team to steal some market. Would be interesting. Pretty doubtful, though. I'm sure the NHL wants some huge US TV market.

 

[GopherJake]

Another viable option I think would be Milwaukee except the Chicago Blackhawks would make that rather difficult.

Last I heard, Milwaukee is a terrible hockey market. I doubt Chicago would be too concerned.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Last I heard, Milwaukee is a terrible hockey market. I doubt Chicago would be too concerned.

Yeah I don't think Milwaukee would work. Not big enough and not enough hockey fans.

 

[Ope3]

Yeah I don't think Milwaukee would work. Not big enough and not enough hockey fans.

Probably true, but I think they could draw better than the 5,000 that they are limited to currently in Tempe. It would have to appeal to fans across the entire state (just as Badger puck did when they were thriving) and even the Michigan UP.

Really nice new facility.

Just first impression, I think it would be a better US option than Houston, Atlanta or Hartford. I can't really think of any other viable American options.

 

[Ope3]

Probably true, but I think they could draw better than the 5,000 that they are limited to currently in Tempe. It would have to appeal to fans across the entire state (just as Badger puck did when they were thriving) and even the Michigan UP.

Really nice new facility.

Just first impression, I think it would be a better US option than Houston, Atlanta or Hartford. I can't really think of any other viable American options.

I did think of another American possibility, Kansas City. It's been nearly 50 years since Scouts moved to Colorado (and later NJ). No NBA competition.

I am not sure if the Blues can claim any territorial rights either in practice or de facto.

 

[Gophers_4life]

I did think of another American possibility, Kansas City. It's been nearly 50 years since Scouts moved to Colorado (and later NJ). No NBA competition.

I am not sure if the Blues can claim any territorial rights either in practice or de facto.

KC has a nice arena, opened in 2007, that is easily the quality of a NBA or NHL arena. Just need a team

 

[Gophers_4life]

Yeah I don't think Milwaukee would work. Not big enough and not enough hockey fans.

Well it's clearly big enough. Bucks do very well, now that they have a perennial contender.

Your second point could well stand. But there is money in the suburbs. Don't know what hockey participation is like there, compared to Twin Cities suburbs.

 

[GopherJake]

Another possibility: Indianapolis is the #25 TV market and a hub of year-round sports. The NHL could possibly work there. But I still think they would want Houston or Atlanta. Those are #6 & 7 TV markets respectively, with over twice the market size as Indy.

Nielsen DMA Rankings 2023

ustvdb.com

 

[GophersInIowa]

Well it's clearly big enough. Bucks do very well, now that they have a perennial contender.

Your second point could well stand. But there is money in the suburbs. Don't know what hockey participation is like there, compared to Twin Cities suburbs.

Milwaukee would be the smallest market by far to have 3 professional teams if they added an NHL team (and that's not including the Packers which I think you can because they do tap into the area significantly for sponsorships, tickets, etc).

And they're in an area that already has diehard Blackhawks fans.

 

[Ope3]

Well it's clearly big enough. Bucks do very well, now that they have a perennial contender.

Your second point could well stand. But there is money in the suburbs. Don't know what hockey participation is like there, compared to Twin Cities suburbs.

While hockey participation has an influence, I am not sure how big.

San Jose, Anaheim, Nashville, Tampa, Las Vegas & Seattle have all have successful franchises, and I would guess their hockey participation levels (when they came into existence) were all much lower than Milwaukee/Greater Wisconsin currently.

Conversely, none of have NBA competition city they are in nor have to share an arena. I do realize San Jose and Anaheim have NBA franchises in their TV markets, but there is still some separation and identity in and of themselves.

In the end, I am not sure what should become of the Coyotes but it feels as though chances are much greater they bail than stick it out somewhere. Understatement.

 

[Gophers_4life]

While hockey participation has an influence, I am not sure how big.

San Jose, Anaheim, Nashville, Tampa, Las Vegas & Seattle have all have successful franchises, and I would guess their hockey participation levels (when they came into existence) were all much lower than Milwaukee/Greater Wisconsin currently.

Conversely, none of have NBA competition city they are in nor have to share an arena. I do realize San Jose and Anaheim have NBA franchises in their TV markets, but there is still some separation and identity in and of themselves.

In the end, I am not sure what should become of the Coyotes but it feels as though chances are much greater they bail than stick it out somewhere. Understatement.

Solid point about hockey participation not necessarily correlating with NHL fandom in a market.

Tampa has Orlando 85mi away, Nashville pretty isolated with Indy 288mi and Memphis 212mi away. Vegas and Seattle might get NBA back one day.

About 26mi from Anaheim to LA downtown, about 55mi from SJ to SF.

 

[Gophers_4life]

Milwaukee would be the smallest market by far to have 3 professional teams if they added an NHL team (and that's not including the Packers which I think you can because they do tap into the area significantly for sponsorships, tickets, etc).

And they're in an area that already has diehard Blackhawks fans.

Lot of population in eastern Wisconsin is spread out. Of course, that's tougher for people to make it to NHL/NBA type of weekday night games, than it is a weekend football game.

But when you're talking Combined Statistical Areas, you have roughly like:
Milwaukee CSA - 2M
Madison CSA - 1M
Green Bay CSA - 400k
Fox Cities CSA - 400k

 

[GophersInIowa]

Lot of population in eastern Wisconsin is spread out. Of course, that's tougher for people to make it to NHL/NBA type of weekday night games, than it is a weekend football game.

But when you're talking Combined Statistical Areas, you have roughly like:
Milwaukee CSA - 2M
Madison CSA - 1M
Green Bay CSA - 400k
Fox Cities CSA - 400k

And that's why I don't think it would work for an NHL team there. It's much more of a niche target audience and it's going to be harder to get sponsorships, suite sales, etc.

 

[Gophers_4life]

And that's why I don't think it would work for an NHL team there. It's much more of a niche target audience and it's going to be harder to get sponsorships, suite sales, etc.

Well again, Bucks do OK with all of that.

But as you've noted multiple times, the -- ahem, demographics of urban Milwaukee -- are more supportive of that sport.