All Things 2022 Minnesota Wild Off-Season thread

[From the Parkinglot]

Yup. And that's why the NFL rules the roost, far and beyond all the other sports. Very, very few disastrous contracts that don't benefit anyone but the player and can devastate teams and franchises for 4, 5, 8 years down the road...

Or to put it another way very few players are paid their worth in the most physical and mentally challenging game in the world. NFL owners make more money than god every year and are evil.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Or to put it another way very few players are paid their worth in the most physical and mentally challenging game in the world. NFL owners make more money than god every year and are evil.

Who determines their worth?

• MLB salaries have essentially been flat for the last 5 seasons.
• You can't compare NBA salaries because they have 15 players on a team (but if you added up the salaries of the 12 highest paid players on an NFL team, that total salary is almost identical to that of the average NBA team.

We are talking about a group of people who the market has determined is worth millions of dollars, who have collectively bargaining and who have seen drastic increases to their average salary every single year. Now the owners are evil for paying these players enormous salaries and adhering to the players collective bargaining agreement? To squint and point to the NFL as an example of the evil owner taking advantage of the worker is lunacy.

I'm all for people as much money as possible. I think it's crazy when people say NFL players are paid too much. But it's equally crazy to say they aren't paid enough. The market determines both and the market has been (rightfully) very good the NFL players.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Who determines their worth?

• MLB salaries have essentially been flat for the last 5 seasons.
• You can't compare NBA salaries because they have 15 players on a team (but if you added up the salaries of the 12 highest paid players on an NFL team, that total salary is almost identical to that of the average NBA team.

We are talking about a group of people who the market has determined is worth millions of dollars, who have collectively bargaining and who have seen drastic increases to their average salary every single year. Now the owners are evil for paying these players enormous salaries and adhering to the players collective bargaining agreement? To squint and point to the NFL as an example of the evil owner taking advantage of the worker is lunacy.

I'm all for people as much money as possible. I think it's crazy when people say NFL players are paid too much. But it's equally crazy to say they aren't paid enough. The market determines both and the market has been (rightfully) very good the NFL players.

Oh stop it. There's no free market. It's a socialist system. If there was a free market, there'd be no caps or luxury taxes, there'd be no draft, no revenue sharing among teams, etc.

 

[kg21]

Oh stop it. There's no free market. It's a socialist system. If there was a free market, there'd be no caps or luxury taxes, there'd be no draft, no revenue sharing among teams, etc.

How the hell is it a socialist system? All the other teams depend on the other teams or there is no league.

Does McDonalds want Burger King to go out of business? Yes

Do the Twins want the White Sox or any other team to go out of business? NO

Any MLB player is free to leave MLB and play in another league. Any Twins player is free to leave the Twins and play for the Saints.

 

[TruthSeeker]

How the hell is it a socialist system? All the other teams depend on the other teams or there is no league.

Does McDonalds want Burger King to go out of business? Yes

Do the Twins want the White Sox or any other team to go out of business? NO

Any MLB player is free to leave MLB and play in another league. Any Twins player is free to leave the Twins and play for the Saints.

Price controls, revenue sharing, redistribution of wealth, etc.

What could be more socialist than a draft?

Players aren't able to sign with a team of their choice. They're forced to play for a team they're assigned to. Their pay is artificially capped. The worst teams get to choose the best players to redistribute talent.

 

[From the Parkinglot]

Who determines their worth?

• MLB salaries have essentially been flat for the last 5 seasons.
• You can't compare NBA salaries because they have 15 players on a team (but if you added up the salaries of the 12 highest paid players on an NFL team, that total salary is almost identical to that of the average NBA team.

We are talking about a group of people who the market has determined is worth millions of dollars, who have collectively bargaining and who have seen drastic increases to their average salary every single year. Now the owners are evil for paying these players enormous salaries and adhering to the players collective bargaining agreement? To squint and point to the NFL as an example of the evil owner taking advantage of the worker is lunacy.

I'm all for people as much money as possible. I think it's crazy when people say NFL players are paid too much. But it's equally crazy to say they aren't paid enough. The market determines both and the market has been (rightfully) very good the NFL players.

My problem comes from how nfl teams are able to get out from under contracts all the time unlike other sports. Nfl players play the more brutal sport alive and have the worst possible union ever imagined.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

My problem comes from how nfl teams are able to get out from under contracts all the time unlike other sports. Nfl players play the more brutal sport alive and have the worst possible union ever imagined.

This is just plain a confusing take?

I have to ask you, who benefits from the Wild having to pay Parise and Suter $7.3M each for the next 3 years (other than Parise and Suter)? Do you think that's good for the Minnesota Wild franchise? Do you think that's awesome for Wild fans and season ticket holders?

The NFL is the ultimate meritocracy. If you can play, you get paid. If you can't produce, you don't get paid. Nobody is forcing any of those guys to compete for contracts.

 

[TruthSeeker]

This is just plain a confusing take?

I have to ask you, who benefits from the Wild having to pay Parise and Suter $7.3M each for the next 3 years (other than Parise and Suter)? Do you think that's good for the Minnesota Wild franchise? Do you think that's awesome for Wild fans and season ticket holders?

The NFL is the ultimate meritocracy. If you can play, you get paid. If you can't produce, you don't get paid. Nobody is forcing any of those guys to compete for contracts.

Great for an owner. Lousy for a player.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Great for an owner. Lousy for a player.

What about the fans?

You think it's good for the fans to pay a player to play (or in some cases to NOT play) for years and years after they can no longer produce?

 

[TruthSeeker]

What about the fans?

You think it's good for the fans to pay a player to play (or in some cases to NOT play) for years and years after they can no longer produce?

No. But I'd dump salary caps, so it wouldn't matter.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

My problem comes from how nfl teams are able to get out from under contracts all the time unlike other sports. Nfl players play the more brutal sport alive and have the worst possible union ever imagined.

The owners are only able to do that if that's how the contracts are negotiated. The players and their agents certainly understand how guaranteed money works. You can certainly negotiate for more guaranteed money (see Kirk Cousins). The players also constantly renegotiate when their contracts aren't up. I have no problem with the players getting every single penny they can because (like you said) it's a brutal sport and I'm generally 100% supportive of any worker, anywhere, making whatever contract they think is in their best interest.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Great for an owner. Lousy for a player.

It's great for THAT player but most of the data shows that it isn't too good for players (in general).

There is absolutely no statistical evidence to suggest that money wouldn't have been reinvested BACK into player salaries. In fact, the NFL is known for employing cap gurus who essentially find ways to pay as much money as possible to players. A guaranteed contract has no impact on the % of dollars going from owners to players.

What it does impact is the fans desire to watch the team. If you're a bad team and you're in cap hell, you might as well shut it down and re-watch in 5 years. Take the NBA, can you imagine the amount of money the NBA lost because the NY and DC markets have essentially had zero chance of being competitive over the last 7 years? That money DRASTICALLY impacts player salaries. The NBA just increased their cap from $112 million per season to $126 million per season (with $150 tax level). That means an additional $448 million dollars will be spent on player salaries every single year because of the increased popularity of the sport.

Maximizing the sports popularity generates a tremendous amount of revenue and, in turn, significantly more money for the players.

 

[From the Parkinglot]

This is just plain a confusing take?

I have to ask you, who benefits from the Wild having to pay Parise and Suter $7.3M each for the next 3 years (other than Parise and Suter)? Do you think that's good for the Minnesota Wild franchise? Do you think that's awesome for Wild fans and season ticket holders?

The NFL is the ultimate meritocracy. If you can play, you get paid. If you can't produce, you don't get paid. Nobody is forcing any of those guys to compete for contracts.

The wild are the morons that signed the contract why should they simply be able to get out from under when the players are old? The contacts were so bad in fact the nhl stoped in and limited contract lengths. Why should any team sign you to a contact and then when you’re not a great as you were be able to simply cut you and not owe you any money?

Yes when the wild signed Parise and Suter it was amazing for the franchise cause they sold out the X for like 7 years after they signed them. If not for that the X was gonna be half full at best.

 

[From the Parkinglot]

 

[TruthSeeker]

Dumba will be gone after this season to deal with the Parise and Suter cap problem.