All Sports B1G (or WCHA) Titles

ClassOf98Gopher

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What you just described is the definition of mediocrity. Carry on.
Maybe. But we are not shi**y, and there are at least a handful of other similarly situated universities in the Big Ten that I believe have shi**y or near-shi**y athletic programs and I am just so thankful that I am not a die-hard fan of those teams.
Still odd to me why a very top level hockey player from North America would rather go to a smaller, less well supported NCHC program, as opposed to a large, well supported Big Ten program.

North Dakota being the one exception, probably the largest arena/fanbase of any college hockey team in the country.


But even Duluth? Yeah, great tradition, very nice arena and fanbase ... but only what 3-4k max per game? In a small town, small school? Same for St Cloud.

I don't know. Doesn't make sense to me.


Or do NCHC teams just manage to win more with "lower" level recruits? More Canadians opposed to Americans? Or maybe European players? Taking wild stabs in the dark here.

Well I think I know why… the hockey players are the biggest men on campus at those schools you mention. They are kings of the roost… so to speak (mixing metaphors).

At the Big Ten schools, hockey players are competing with the football players and men’s basketball players for being catered to (and losing); but not at North Dakota or UMD as they are the faces who everyone whispers to friends about on campus: “Hey that’s Johnny Smith. He scored three goals last week.”

If I were a great high school Hockey player, my next four years of social life would probably be better at a non-Big Ten school. Just saying. Now I think the Big Ten schools offer some other, more long-term beneficial opportunities and exposure; but I am biased.
 


bleedsmaroonandgold

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Wow, didn't expect the amount of fatalism that came out in here. I definitely don't accept that we cannot have the expectation for Coyle and the Department that our teams compete for a win a reasonable share of the championships with the number of sports that we compete.
 

From the Parkinglot

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Very simple question, as we sit here today, which one of the following athletic departments, meaning all sports in their departments combined, would you trade with: Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Maryland, Rutgers, Michigan State, Northwestern, Nebraska, or Iowa?

For me, maybe Nebraska, but other that I am pretty sure I would rather have the overall Gopher sports roster of athletes than any of the above similarly situated universities.
Michigan state, iowa, and Illinois (maybe)

look back at the bad Michigan state football seasons and they are better than the gophers while playing a tougher division. Their basketball programs are way ahead of Minnesota.

Iowa has excelled at lots in the last few years. Mens basketball, but omens basketball, football, baseball, wrestling.
 

ClassOf98Gopher

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Michigan state, iowa, and Illinois (maybe)

look back at the bad Michigan state football seasons and they are better than the gophers while playing a tougher division. Their basketball programs are way ahead of Minnesota.

Iowa has excelled at lots in the last few years. Mens basketball, but omens basketball, football, baseball, wrestling.
All these opinions are quite subjective, but I gotta say, if I was a sports loving Illinois alumnus, I think I would rip out my own eyes. As it relates to the several sports that I love most, I don’t think Illinois isn’t very good. Maybe I am wrong but why could it be that I almost feel bad for them?
 


From the Parkinglot

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All these opinions are quite subjective, but I gotta say, if I was a sports loving Illinois alumnus, I think I would rip out my own eyes. As it relates to the several sports that I love most, I don’t think Illinois isn’t very good. Maybe I am wrong but why could it be that I almost feel bad for them?
Agreed but they had some success that I would kill the gophers to have. It’s just been a few years. That’s why I listed them as a maybe. They do have a great golf program though.
 

MplsGopher

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I definitely don't accept that we cannot have the expectation for Coyle and the Department that our teams compete for a win a reasonable share of the championships with the number of sports that we compete.
You can make up any expectation you want. It's just your opinon.

If we -- for whatever reasons -- just aren't usually capable of getting the types of players that you need in order to reasonably compete for the Big Ten, let alone the National, Championship ... then having that expectation isn't reasonable.


Based on that idea -- player talent -- the teams where it is reasonable to expect that the Gophers compete for a Big Ten and National Championship are thus pretty limited. I would say: volleyball, and men's/women's hockey.

Happy to learn about why that list can and should be expanded, especially in some of these sports I never follow in the slightest.
 
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bleedsmaroonandgold

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You can make up any expectation you want. It's just your opinon.

If we -- for whatever reasons -- just aren't usually capable of getting the types of players that you need in order to reasonably compete for the Big Ten, let alone the National, Championship ... then having that expectation isn't reasonable.


Based on that idea -- player talent -- the teams where it is reasonable to expect that the Gophers compete for a Big Ten and National Championship are thus pretty limited. I would say: volleyball, and men's/women's hockey.

Happy to learn about why that list can and should be expanded, especially in some of these sports I never follow in the slightest.
If you are setting some kind of arbitrary ceiling on what type of talent we can get, that is also an opinion. Given that most of our conference is in the midwest, no reason why we can't recruit like our conference peers. At the national level, I'd buy that there are some sports where it would be tough to match the south or California for recruiting, but we don't need to in order to win B1G titles, which is why I think conference championships is the right metric to measure Coyle against.

Hoping our two cross country teams land the first two titles of the school year on Friday.
 

MplsGopher

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If you are setting some kind of arbitrary ceiling on what type of talent we can get, that is also an opinion.
OK, go ahead and use non-arbitrary facts and history to point out which teams in the last 10-15 years have been able to get that kind of talent.

I'm ready.


Given that most of our conference is in the midwest, no reason why we can't recruit like our conference peers.
We'll just decide to recruit like Ohio State, right? We can just decide to do that.

Amazing that they've simply chosen not to do that, this whole time.
 



ClassOf98Gopher

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…conference championships is the right metric to measure Coyle against.

Hoping our two cross country teams land the first two titles of the school year on Friday.

I strongly agree with the above.

One other point is that matching Ohio State and Penn State across the board in athletics is always going to be tough because those two states are huge by population and neither of those universities has an in-state, Big Ten competitor university.

And matching Michigan is tough because honest they do have a strong national athletic and academic brand. Whether that brand is still justified or antiquated is another question, but they just do. Obviously, being more like Michigan from a branding perspective on the academic side and more like Wisconsin in athletic department performance that seems to punch above their weight are my two aspirations for our U of M on this general topic of growing expectations for the U.
 


MplsGopher

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Is XC one of those sports that "knits together" a "team title" out of individual performances?
 





bleedsmaroonandgold

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Got the first title of the school year! Here's to many more. Hasz burning at the finish to edge out the Michigan girl was huge, that ended up being too close for comfort.
 

bleedsmaroonandgold

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Is XC one of those sports that "knits together" a "team title" out of individual performances?
Yep, your score is based on your top 5 finishers. Megan Hasz had a great finish to win first overall.

One thing I'd be really curious to know is how often the team titled is impacted by the champions 6th and 7th runners not factoring into their team score, but lowering an opponents score. Wisconson's 6th and 7th women both had high finishes, so if they had edged us, that likely would have been a factor.
 

MplsGopher

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My personal opinion and nothing more: I don't like that there are "team titles" in individual sports.

Wouldn't have mattered in this case, as Hasz won overall.

But anyway, good for her and good for the Gophers! Great job ladies!
 



Gopher68

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Yep, your score is based on your top 5 finishers. Megan Hasz had a great finish to win first overall.

One thing I'd be really curious to know is how often the team titled is impacted by the champions 6th and 7th runners not factoring into their team score, but lowering an opponents score. Wisconson's 6th and 7th women both had high finishes, so if they had edged us, that likely would have been a factor.
Could have happened this year. WI had three runners in front of the last MN qualifier.
 

bleedsmaroonandgold

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Could have happened this year. WI had three runners in front of the last MN qualifier.
I saw that, it was a white knuckle ride to wait for that fifth Gopher to seal it for us as I kept seeing white Wisconsin shirts come in. That's what made me think of the question.
 

ClassOf98Gopher

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All I can say is there is yet another Big Ten championship for the illustrious Gopher athletic program (and yet another respectable third place finish on the men’s side).

As I have effectively said through my posts for multiple years now, we are so lucky to be Gopher fans as opposed to, say, Rutgers fans. I am satiated and happy. Life is good. ;)
 

bleedsmaroonandgold

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My personal opinion and nothing more: I don't like that there are "team titles" in individual sports.

Wouldn't have mattered in this case, as Hasz won overall.

But anyway, good for her and good for the Gophers! Great job ladies!
It is more complicated than just being a compilation of of unrelated individual results. Team running is a real thing in these events, and a lot of strategy goes into how the runners approach the race and try to control the pace of the bigger group in a manner that would be advantageous to your team.
 




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