Al Nolen sucks.

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But wait! Didn't Tubby recruit Porter??? Oh no! Wait til we only have Tubby's recruits!!!
 

I think the real problem is that the offense has no rhyme or reason. We keep running high ball screens and MSU keeps showing with the big men yet our bigs never roll or pop to force those bigs to stay home. This means theres really no sense in us running those screens because they accomplish nothing. Our guards just weave and there aren't any curls or cuts to the basket. Our guards and Nolen in particular refuse to throw the ball into the post and when they do our bigs don't even attempt to score which means MSU's guards could play tight on their men since there was no need to double, making it even harder for the bigs to kick it out. All these things add up to an anemic offense. Its frustrating that Tubby made no changes and no adjustments offensively to put points up. I'd rather just go to 3 guards and run ISO's than do the same crap that isn't working over and over again
 

Being a point guard at this level is extremely hard. You have to balance so many things on the offensive end and you have 4 other ego's you have to keep in check, keep focused and on message. Not to mention the issues of your own confidence.
 

Goldteam said:
nolen never, ever sets you up for a good look

the MSU point guard set them up all night

that is basketball 101 for a point guard

al nolen basically does suck........WHY DONT PEOPLE BELIEVE WHAT THEIR OWN EYES ARE SEEING?
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Who is he supposed to set up? Lucas doesn't need help on Nolen (because Lucas is better), and even if he did, nobody in the starting lineup could make MSU pay. Sampson/Iverson aren't strong enough, Johnson can't make jumpshots or have his way inside against 3 bigger/stronger players. As long as somebody stayed home on Westbrook, the Gophs were doomed.
 

Moonlight said:
But wait! Didn't Tubby recruit Porter??? Oh no! Wait til we only have Tubby's recruits!!!
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Mike Porter gives 100% effort but he's just not talented enough to play at this level. He's not a frontline starter. He'd be great as a sixth or seventh energy guy off the bench playing 5-10 mins a game at shooting guard.
 


94Gopher said:
So Drex, let me get this straight, Tubby sucks? Wow, did you come here from Kentucky? Seriously, we can all attribute your moronic comment to emotion and passion -- or are you just that dumb?
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94Gopher, did I stutter? Just when does coaching enter this conversation?

Not from Kentucky, but not drinking the Tubby koolaid either. In this game, if Nolen sucks, TUBBY SUCKS.

The offense Nolen runs, is Tubby's offense. If Tubby is a genius when the Gophers wins, Tubby's an idiot when they lose. Simple as that.
 

chi-town gopher said:
Who is he supposed to set up? Lucas doesn't need help on Nolen (because Lucas is better), and even if he did, nobody in the starting lineup could make MSU pay. Sampson/Iverson aren't strong enough, Johnson can't make jumpshots or have his way inside against 3 bigger/stronger players. As long as somebody stayed home on Westbrook, the Gophs were doomed.
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Exactly.
 


chi-town gopher said:
Who is he supposed to set up? Lucas doesn't need help on Nolen (because Lucas is better), and even if he did, nobody in the starting lineup could make MSU pay. Sampson/Iverson aren't strong enough, Johnson can't make jumpshots or have his way inside against 3 bigger/stronger players. As long as somebody stayed home on Westbrook, the Gophs were doomed.
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this has been going on all year......it doesnt matter who we play....it's not just MSU

but like someone said.........he is not even trying......it's hold the ball out 30 feet away and hope something happens when the clock gets to 10

al is not getting it done.......when you cant shoot it, or finish at the basket........you dam well better be setting others up from the point and he just cant do it

we are kind of screwed
 



Al struggles......

when we play this stand around offesne. We have to go to some kind of motion and get the young bigs moving and get some put backs like Colt got late. We are too easy to guard....especiially Al, because he not a jump shooter,
 


oleboy41 said:
I think the real problem is that the offense has no rhyme or reason. We keep running high ball screens and MSU keeps showing with the big men yet our bigs never roll or pop to force those bigs to stay home. This means theres really no sense in us running those screens because they accomplish nothing. Our guards just weave and there aren't any curls or cuts to the basket. Our guards and Nolen in particular refuse to throw the ball into the post and when they do our bigs don't even attempt to score which means MSU's guards could play tight on their men since there was no need to double, making it even harder for the bigs to kick it out. All these things add up to an anemic offense. Its frustrating that Tubby made no changes and no adjustments offensively to put points up. I'd rather just go to 3 guards and run ISO's than do the same crap that isn't working over and over again
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And this is the same offensive pattern the Gophers have been running, without much success, the entire Big Ten season--Tubby's offensive pattern. A good coach, like Bobby Knight, plays to the strengths of it's players. Tubby knows defense, but his offense sucks.
 

ShowinGoldyLove said:
That's one thing I've noticed. Al may drop the ball to the bigs, but he NEVER looks to the wings to Westbrook, JAS, Hoff, etc.

We can't stretch the D if they can just sag down and never have to guard our shooters because we NEVER penetrate and kick it out.
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That's clearly not true, SGL. When they break free from their defensive person, Nolen gets them the ball.

When they stand around conversing with their defensive person, Nolen doesn't throw ball it to them. When Nolen throws it to them and they are not "ready for the ball" or the pass is "too hard" or they are picking their nose, it's a TO.

The wings stand around too much on the offense, Tubby's offense.
 



I'm no Tubby apologist, but tonight the Gophers were up against a talented, athletic Michigan State team that was licking its wounds after a couple of rare home losses.

And a charged up Lucas, Walton, Summers, et al, absolutely trump Nolen, Westbrook, Hoffarber.

This is a nice Gopher team. They are not supremely talented. They are going to be vulnerable against top tier athletes, especially when those types of teams are frothing at the mouth.

The trajectory is upward. But keep the expectations realistic.
 

I have questioned Nolen and some of his decision making skills this season (especially in Big 10 play) but to say he sucks and should be off the team seems a little overblown. Who did perform (besides Joseph) tonight that warrants playing time on a D-1 roster? Nobody. Nolen included.
 

Part of a coach's job is to know his players and how to get the best team play out of them. Some people quickly learn from their errors, respond well to kicks in the butt, don't get overrun by adversity, etc. Some do not. My guess is that at this early point in his career Al Nolen is the type of guy who gets better and better, and lazier and lazier as things go well. When things start to really fall apart he goes into a stubborn space and just gets worse.

But, but, he has real talents the team really needs and so Tubby needs to continue to work with him and manage his particular personality. He is just a project with a big upside at this point in his long career with the Gophers. Let the coach earn his pay and expect the bad with the good. Let's face it, the young man has never faced players who can out quick him so frequently as he is getting so often this season.

Just my two cents.
 

Drex96 said:
Better shooting, maybe.

Less TO's check the stats idiot, Nolen has one of the top assists to TO ratios in THE COUNTRY.

Minnesota doesn't deserve Nolen. Hope he transfers.
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So just how exactly does Al Nolen taste? Cause you have his junk so far down your throat I'm worried you might be choking to death....
 

Far & away the most realistic comment posted here today

"This is a nice Gopher team. They are not supremely talented. They are going to be vulnerable against top tier athletes, especially when those types of teams are frothing at the mouth. The trajectory is upward. But keep the expectations realistic."

Well done, Facts34. I did not expect a beat-down of that nature last night, but night's like that happen. The two MSU games as well as the Purdue game have shown the Gophers have work to do to join the elite in the Big 10. An embarrassing loss doesn't mean you shut down the season. The Gophers still have lot of good things right in front of them in these last 8 games. I'm looking forward to see how they handle last night's thumping.
 

Facts34 said:
I'm no Tubby apologist, but tonight the Gophers were up against a talented, athletic Michigan State team that was licking its wounds after a couple of rare home losses.

And a charged up Lucas, Walton, Summers, et al, absolutely trump Nolen, Westbrook, Hoffarber.

This is a nice Gopher team. They are not supremely talented. They are going to be vulnerable against top tier athletes, especially when those types of teams are frothing at the mouth.

The trajectory is upward. But keep the expectations realistic.
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And that would be....?
 

I am reminded of Eric Harris as a sophomore point guard for Clem in 96. He took a lot of crap from fans of whom many thought he was incapable of being a decent Big Ten point guard. As a junior he and Bobby Jackson formed the best guard combo in the country. Today many believe his injury was what prevented the Gophers from winning a NC in 98. Nolen appears to be as good a guard in his sophomore season as Harris was as a soph. Al is going to get better and his critics will evaporate just as the critics of Harris did.
 

Wow. Al Nolen is the target of a lot of frustration here on this board. Yikes. He's had good games and he's had rough ones. Let's hope he takes his lumps and grows.

I don't envy his situation on the court. For the first ten minutes the only outside shooting presence is Westbrook. Like someone else mentioned, if Westbrook gets shut down, Nolen is forced to try and create a play by himself. And when going up against the superior quickness of Lucas, he was SOL.

A guy can only make great feeds if the other guys are working hard to get open. That is harder to do against GREAT teams like MSU. Like Moonlight said, EVERYBODY struggled last night. It's easy to pick on the guy with the ball.

I'm not ready to jump ship on Nolen. If his shot improves by next year, all of you haters will be singing a different tune.
 


TruthTeller said:
And that would be....?
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Some impressive performances inspired by defense (Illinois, @Wisconsin, Louisville [neutral])
Some losses where the opponent clearly overmatches (Michigan St twice, Purdue)
Some losses where the opponent is of similar talent, but simply executes better (N'western).
Finish in the top half of the Big Ten.
Make the NCAA Tournament.
Be a first-round favorite.
Have a realistic chance to advance to the Sweet Sixteen.
 

The 'And-1' bb league called and said that Nolen needs to learn how to get his teammates involved.
 

PG is certainly easier when you've got someone open to pass to, maybe even someone who can make a shot.

Sampson: 0-4. They'll leave him open until he proves he can make a mid-range shot.
Carter: 1-4. He can get open, just can't make em.
Bostick: 0-4. I'm just not seeing any reason for him to get minutes.
Johnson: 1-5. MSU is a really bad match-up for the Gophers' best player.

As I said in another thread ... I expect Royce White, Rodney Williams and Trevor Mbakwe to get most of the PT at forward next year opposite DJ.
 

Roy Christensen said:
I am reminded of Eric Harris as a sophomore point guard for Clem in 96. He took a lot of crap from fans of whom many thought he was incapable of being a decent Big Ten point guard. As a junior he and Bobby Jackson formed the best guard combo in the country. Today many believe his injury was what prevented the Gophers from winning a NC in 98. Nolen appears to be as good a guard in his sophomore season as Harris was as a soph. Al is going to get better and his critics will evaporate just as the critics of Harris did.
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Excellent example. Aaron Robinson was another. We can not know how much, if any, Nolen will improve. However, over fifty years you do see it all and learn to not put a knife in your throat over sophomores.
 

I have secretly been wanting Devoe to get more playing time recently. It's my secret, though. THe past few weeks have been tough to watch #0. I am particularly tired of him dribbling & dribbling & dribbling & dribbling. Also, no more frantic drives down teh left side of the lane only to get snuffy uppied by three guys. Note to teammates, floor spacing. Drive & dish?

GO GOPHERS!
 

huh, there is some serious rage on this thread directed at a Sophomore. let's all chill. yes, Nolen has been struggling in B10, but why is our fan base throwing him under the bus? this team has other problems, not just Al's PG capabilities. no, he is not the answer to MSU right now, but we are still doing really well this season. did y'all think we were going to waltz into the Breslin and stomp all over Sparty?

yes, we should have played better. no, that is not how I like to lose. but a L is a L and its over. MSU is better than us this year, wow shocking. they have more talent on the floor, I know equally shocking.

I can't stand when we all start ripping on college players...on our own team. Our Freshman and Sophomores are 18 and 19 years old, give them a break. if you are done watching the team because you are so disgusted w/ a 19 year old's performance, than stop watching and give your tickets to an actual fan. Duke got hammered by 20+, I doubt their fans are jumping off the wagon.
 

oleboy41 said:
I think the real problem is that the offense has no rhyme or reason. We keep running high ball screens and MSU keeps showing with the big men yet our bigs never roll or pop
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What are you talking about? Ralph and Damian slip that screen almost every single time and every single time they flash open for a second, but Al refuses to give them the ball. He simply cannot recognize it. I mentioned this three weeks ago. Izzo clearly noticed and had his bigs hedge every time and it forced the offense into stagnation as Al just kept dribbling and dribbling, which led to frustration. Unless Al begins to recognize the hedge and flash, this offense will never get any better.

oleboy41 said:
Our guards just weave and there aren't any curls or cuts to the basket.
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Blake and Lawrence run a ton of curls, but Al never recognizes it. Blake flashes open at last six times a game on a curl, but Al just stares at him.

oleboy41 said:
Nolen in particular refuse to throw the ball into the post
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Exactly. The only assists Al gets is when the shot clock winds down to :08 seconds and he drives and dishes. Unfortunately, it only works a little over 3 times per game in the Big Ten season. Al has to broaden his game. He must become more than a drive and dish guy, otherwise, this offense will never get better. The good news is that he's only a sophomore, so there's time to get better. But, right now, he is too easy to defend for Big Ten point guards.

And, about his assist-to-turnover ratio...in Big Ten play it is isn't very good. He is 7th in the Big Ten in that category, which means there are six teams in the league with a guy better than him in that category, which places Al in the lower half of the Big Ten.

Again, the good news is that he is young and can get better. And, in no way does he "suck." That's just a silly comment to make about one of our players. Are there areas he has to work on? Of course. But, he doesn't suck.
 

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