2025 high school football thread

[MNfootballfan]

I think that last year the following teams would’ve been top 20 in 6a:
Owatonna
JM
Chanhassen
St Thomas academy
Armstrong
Cooper
Elk River
Andover
Moorhead
Alexandria

Every year the top 10-15 in 5a are better than the bottom 8-12 in 6a
In my opinion


There is a question if they could hold up against the whole 6a schedule. But the bottom 8-12 can’t either. So there is no question they’re better than the bottom 8.

If Elk River played against white bear lake (who was a 6 seed and 21 in the QRF) I would probably pick elk river at least -15

This means absolutely nothing but something you can take note of.

2021 playing 5A they went 9-2 and beat Owatonna 58-31 and 38-33. They also beat JM 53-6
2022 playing 5A they went 9-2 again and beat Owatonna 34-27 and 36-7 and beat JM 52-0
2023 playing 6A they went 4-6
2024 playing 6A they went 3-7

2 of their 7 wins were against Burnsville, who has a football program that is struggling pretty bad right now.

Again, I know this is cherry picking stats but Mayo seemed to do well against Owatonna and JM the last two years they played them and were maybe at best the lower end of average in 6A

 

[swede2]

If public school lunches are now paid for by MN taxpayers, how can schools obtain the information who would qualify for free or reduced lunch?

At our school at the beginning of the school year the AD was imploring parents to "apply" even though it wasn't actually necessary for free or reduced lunch for enrollment for athletic purposes.

 

[Some guy]

This means absolutely nothing but something you can take note of.

2021 playing 5A they went 9-2 and beat Owatonna 58-31 and 38-33. They also beat JM 53-6
2022 playing 5A they went 9-2 again and beat Owatonna 34-27 and 36-7 and beat JM 52-0
2023 playing 6A they went 4-6
2024 playing 6A they went 3-7

2 of their 7 wins were against Burnsville, who has a football program that is struggling pretty bad right now.

Again, I know this is cherry picking stats but Mayo seemed to do well against Owatonna and JM the last two years they played them and were maybe at best the lower end of average in 6A

Mayo has been to the second round of the playoffs two years in a row though. Their record being poor has to do with their schedule losses being vs QRF:
3
5
9
13
14
15
17

This is 2024 where they were nearly as good.
In 2023 their losses were to QRF:
1
2
3
7
9
16
That was a pretty good team they had. Would’ve been a state title contender in 5a would’ve probably been 7-1 regular season if they played in the east metro and got a good crossover draw or two

In two years they haven’t lost to a team with a QRF below 17
They are 0-8 vs teams that finish QRF top 10
They are 7-7 against the rest of 6a

It kind of goes with what I said that you can pretty consistently bank on the top 10-15 of 5a being safely considered about 20-25 in 6a


They have beaten
Burnsville x2
Rosemount
Centennial
Farmington
East ridge
St Michael Albertville

 

[MaxyJR1]

Going to 48 in the top class would add
Moorhead
Rogers
Andover
Apple Valley

Keeps
Burnsville
Mayo
Coon Rapids
Buffalo

Also would add
Spring Lake Park
Brainerd
Park Center
Armstrong
Bloomington Jefferson
Irondale
Elk River
Roch Century
St Paul Central
Cambridge
Two Rivers
Duluth East

Going to 56 adds
Chaska
Bemidji
Chanhassen
Roch JM
Waconia
Washburn
Tartan
Owatonna

Going to 64 adds
New Prague
North St. Paul
Alexandria
Bloomington Kennedy
St Louis Park
Hastings
Monticello
Sartell

 

[MNfootballfan]

At our school at the beginning of the school year the AD was imploring parents to "apply" even though it wasn't actually necessary for free or reduced lunch for enrollment for athletic purposes.

Other factors can be waived for qualifying for Educational Benefits like Class Dues and Field Trips. Also, schools can receive more funding if certain percentages qualify.

Like most things though, the government took a system that wasn't broken and broke it, but that is a discussion for another day and on the off-topic board.

 

[gopher-revolution]

If public school lunches are now paid for by MN taxpayers, how can schools obtain the information who would qualify for free or reduced lunch?

We asked that question and were told that if a family receives any government assistance they automatically qualify for free and reduced. Not sure what programs. That being said, there are families that qualify but do not take assistance so we encourage them to apply for free and reduced. If they qualify they can turn it down, but their qualification still counts toward the numbers.

 

[disco]

I actually think this would be better for the sport. It spreads out the winning and losing and allows for some potential upsets. Could add to the group and make Class 6A 48 teams.

Or essentially, you do a promotion and relegation system.

 

[MaxyJR1]

Or essentially, you do a promotion and relegation system.

Too hard to do in my opinion. Rosters change every year with seniors going out the door. Say a team wins the title or makes state and loses all their starters. They shouldn't have to move up. I'm really fine with how the MSHSL league does things based on enrollment and I believe "State" should really encompass every region of the state. I think going to 48 gets the communities that are on the rise and growing to move up sooner to 6A.

Maybe there is a way to take the current section system and then set state tournaments based on performance.

Group 6A and 5A together for scheduling and then break out two classes for playoffs
Group 4A and 3A
Group 2A and 1A

Say Section 2, 4A and 3A are together: Dassel-Cokato, Rockford, Glencoe, Litchfield, Watertown-Mayer, Howard Lake, Marshall, Hutchinson, St. Peter, New Ulm, and Willmar would play within their section for the season. Based on the season, 5 or 6 would play 4A playoffs and 5 or 6 would play 3A playoffs.

6A: 48 teams with 5A 48 teams
4A: 48 teasm with 3A 48 teams
2A and 1A together with remaining teams

 

[xyz1]

Having 48 in each of the top two classes, so there would be six-team sections and the first playoff round could include byes, and allowing joint 5A and 6A scheduling, would go a very long way in generating a higher number of competitive games and fewer blowouts.

 

[Some guy]

Having 48 in each of the top two classes, so there would be six-team sections and the first playoff round could include byes, and allowing joint 5A and 6A scheduling, would go a very long way in generating a higher number of competitive games and fewer blowouts.

It’s a no brainer except those 16 5a schools would hate it

If you kept them separated in the playoffs but joined them for 48 in the regular season it should be good for everyone


People forget that Eden prairie playing Hopkins isn’t just bad for the Hopkins kids…it’s also bad for the EP kids

 

[GopherGrit]

Too hard to do in my opinion. Rosters change every year with seniors going out the door. Say a team wins the title or makes state and loses all their starters. They shouldn't have to move up. I'm really fine with how the MSHSL league does things based on enrollment and I believe "State" should really encompass every region of the state. I think going to 48 gets the communities that are on the rise and growing to move up sooner to 6A.

Maybe there is a way to take the current section system and then set state tournaments based on performance.

Group 6A and 5A together for scheduling and then break out two classes for playoffs
Group 4A and 3A
Group 2A and 1A

Say Section 2, 4A and 3A are together: Dassel-Cokato, Rockford, Glencoe, Litchfield, Watertown-Mayer, Howard Lake, Marshall, Hutchinson, St. Peter, New Ulm, and Willmar would play within their section for the season. Based on the season, 5 or 6 would play 4A playoffs and 5 or 6 would play 3A playoffs.

6A: 48 teams with 5A 48 teams
4A: 48 teasm with 3A 48 teams
2A and 1A together with remaining teams

Bolded: isn't this already being done in 2 year cycles.

It isn't difficult at all that if you win state title one year that you should be pushed up ... for all of one more year. If you bomb, then go down in the next 2 year cycle.

 

[MaxyJR1]

Bolded: isn't this already being done in 2 year cycles.

It isn't difficult at all that if you win state title one year that you should be pushed up ... for all of one more year. If you bomb, then go down in the next 2 year cycle.

True. With that
Minneota to 2A.
Jackson County Central to 3A
Stewartville to 4A (likely moving due to enrollment)
Becker to 5A
Elk River to 6A

 

[disco]

Hopkins is so regularly brought up when we discuss these things. I just realized they play an independent schedule in hockey - not a Lake Conference schedule. I realize this is off topic, but should they be in that conference at all?

 

[xyz1]

Throw out hockey and football (which is something of a recent development - they were 6-2, albeit against a weaker 6A schedule, as recently as 2019) and Hopkins is generally competitive with those schools. Basketball is obviously the one where they have the most success but they're respectable in sports like baseball, track, and swimming.

 

[50PoundHead]

We asked that question and were told that if a family receives any government assistance they automatically qualify for free and reduced. Not sure what programs. That being said, there are families that qualify but do not take assistance so we encourage them to apply for free and reduced. If they qualify they can turn it down, but their qualification still counts toward the numbers.

If the child is on Medical Assistance, they are automatically counted in the education funding formula that is based on the child's poverty status and the school's (both by building and district) concentrations of children in this category. It was thought that going to direct certification would be a plus for most school districts, but a number of districts have lost revenue in the process. One of the problems with the system requiring forms is that parents were unaware (or in some cases unwilling) of the process. That led to undercounting. What is happening now is a different aspect of undercounting.

The other angle--at least for now depending on what happen with the US Department of Education--is that the forms indicating qualification for free/reduced-price lunch are needed to determine how much a district is eligible to receive under Title 1.

 

[MaxyJR1]

Heard that Coon Rapids was going to stay up in 6A and Apple Valley appealed to stay down.

Makes sense to have all five Anoka Hennepin schools in same class and play each other.

 

[Some guy]

Heard that Coon Rapids was going to stay up in 6A and Apple Valley appealed to stay down.

Makes sense to have all five Anoka Hennepin schools in same class and play each other.

Also heard that
Probably with the timeline though is that the opt up form is due before the appeal form was due
Valley never had to appeal