2019 Minnesota Vikings Off-Season Thread

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cncmin said:
Dumping 5th-rd pick Carlson was extremely stupid, just like many of the other extremely stupid moves the Vikings have made over the past few years. Unbelievable ineptness in roster management.
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Agreed. Just another case of Zimmer holding other to higher standards. That defense should be much better considering all the high picks.


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howeda7 said:
Using a 5th round pick on a kicker when you already had a perfectly good one was extremely stupid. Cutting him was not. He appeared to be nearly in tears by the time he kicked the 3rd FG in Green Bay. There's no way they could let him continue. His confidence was completely gone. Zimmer/Priefer do not know how to handle kickers. Forbath was apparently a pretty different dude and wasn't fazed by them.
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They gave up way too soon.


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howeda7 said:
Vinateri will for sure. So I'd put Carlson's current odds at between 1/500 and 1/1,000 based on history.
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You either believe in the pick or you don’t. You can get a pretty damn good offensive guard with a 5th round pick. Certainly one that could upgrade depth.


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howeda7 said:
Using a 5th round pick on a kicker when you already had a perfectly good one was extremely stupid. Cutting him was not. He appeared to be nearly in tears by the time he kicked the 3rd FG in Green Bay. There's no way they could let him continue. His confidence was completely gone. Zimmer/Priefer do not know how to handle kickers. Forbath was apparently a pretty different dude and wasn't fazed by them.
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Exactly. Preifer messes up Special Teams more than he helps.

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Ewert86PC said:
Exactly. Preifer messes up Special Teams more than he helps.

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They have good coverage units, but it doesn't make up for him going through kickers and punters like kleenex.
 

Sportsfan24 said:
They gave up way too soon.


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Too late actually. You could tell in preseason that he wasn't better than Forbath. If Carlson makes 1 of those 3 FG's in GB, the Vikings are in the play-offs.
 

howeda7 said:
Too late actually. You could tell in preseason that he wasn't better than Forbath. If Carlson makes 1 of those 3 FG's in GB, the Vikings are in the play-offs.
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True. Take the tie off the record and it notches them up where they were knocked down.

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howeda7 said:
Too late actually. You could tell in preseason that he wasn't better than Forbath. If Carlson makes 1 of those 3 FG's in GB, the Vikings are in the play-offs.
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Fair point but I’m thinking in turns of they spent a 5th round pick on him when they had more immediate needs because they thought he was worth it. Cutting him early in the season is pulling the trigger a little quick IMO.


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Sportsfan24 said:
Fair point but I’m thinking in turns of they spent a 5th round pick on him when they had more immediate needs because they thought he was worth it. Cutting him early in the season is pulling the trigger a little quick IMO.


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It's on Spielman. You never draft a kicker or punter. Never.
 







Gopherguy0723 said:
It's on Spielman. You never draft a kicker or punter. Never.
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With extra points moved back, kickers are more important than ever. Late round picks are extremely iffy anyways if they'll ever see the field in the NFL. I don't see the problem with using a late round pick to take a chance on a kicker from time to time.
 

And that is that.

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Sportsfan24 said:
Fair point but I’m thinking in turns of they spent a 5th round pick on him when they had more immediate needs because they thought he was worth it. Cutting him early in the season is pulling the trigger a little quick IMO.


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Sunk cost. It was a stupid choice in April. But they kept him over Forbath rather than admit it and move on.
 

Bad Gopher said:
And that is that.

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I was curious about who would be the OC, but indifferent on who they actually chose. Just want the OL rebuilt
 

JimmyJamesMD said:
I was curious about who would be the OC, but indifferent on who they actually chose. Just want the OL rebuilt
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No doubt. I just saw some really staggering numbers in an article. Before you close the book on the Cousins signing being a disaster and he "can't win the big games"....

According to Pro Football Focus,

- Cousins was the 2nd most pressured quarterback, largely due to;

- Vikings offensive line was ranked 29th in pass blocking efficiency

- In terms of overall team run and pass blocking rankings, which include non-OL blockers as well, the Vikings ranked 25th and 27th respectively

- Overall, PFF ranked the Vikings offensive line 29th in the NFL this season.

- Only Reilly Reiff graded over 70, which is considered average

- Elflein was graded the worst Center in the NFL, 38th out of 38

Yikes!!! When you look things in this perspective, it's frightening. O'Neill turned out to be pretty good and should improve, Reiff COULD be a building block for next year (and since they're already paying him a lot, he probably stays), I guess Aviante Collins had/has some serious potential before he got hurt early, and getting Nick Easton back SHOULD help, if for nothing else at least for depth.

They have some work to do, no doubt about it.
 

Ogee Oglethorpe said:
No doubt. I just saw some really staggering numbers in an article. Before you close the book on the Cousins signing being a disaster and he "can't win the big games"....

According to Pro Football Focus,

- Cousins was the 2nd most pressured quarterback, largely due to;

- Vikings offensive line was ranked 29th in pass blocking efficiency

- In terms of overall team run and pass blocking rankings, which include non-OL blockers as well, the Vikings ranked 25th and 27th respectively

- Overall, PFF ranked the Vikings offensive line 29th in the NFL this season.

- Only Reilly Reiff graded over 70, which is considered average

- Elflein was graded the worst Center in the NFL, 38th out of 38

Yikes!!! When you look things in this perspective, it's frightening. O'Neill turned out to be pretty good and should improve, Reiff COULD be a building block for next year (and since they're already paying him a lot, he probably stays), I guess Aviante Collins had/has some serious potential before he got hurt early, and getting Nick Easton back SHOULD help, if for nothing else at least for depth.

They have some work to do, no doubt about it.
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I want two OL in the first 3 rounds of draft, and a good FA. It will probably take cutting some players, but I dont care. Spielman and Zimmer created this mess selling out for QB that has a ton of flaws, including no mobility or pocket awareness.
 

GophersInIowa said:
With extra points moved back, kickers are more important than ever. Late round picks are extremely iffy anyways if they'll ever see the field in the NFL. I don't see the problem with using a late round pick to take a chance on a kicker from time to time.
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Offensive lineman that can make your roster, specifically guards can easily be had in the late rounds (5th). Less than 15 kickers have been drafted in the 5th rounder or higher in NFL since 2000. The Vikings/Spielman have done it TWICE.

“Drafting Carlson in the fifth round doesn’t sound like a huge investment by the Vikings, given that most fifth-round picks in general don’t amount to much.1 But a fifth-round pick for a kicker is more like a first-rounder for any other position. Since 2000, just 16 kickers have been taken in the fifth round or higher, led by Sebastian Janikowski, taken 17th overall in 2000. (Janikowski is another kicker on the misery list of shanking all three attempts in a game.) In the same time period, 53 quarterbacks and 75 wide receivers have been taken in the first round.”
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/memo-to-nfl-gms-stop-drafting-kickers/


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howeda7 said:
Sunk cost. It was a stupid choice in April. But they kept him over Forbath rather than admit it and move on.
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At worst they should have signed him to the practice squad after he cleared waivers. Most of those guys will never make the active roster.


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Packers grant Joe Philbin permission to interview with the Vikings for the OL coach job.
 

Ogee Oglethorpe said:
No doubt. I just saw some really staggering numbers in an article. Before you close the book on the Cousins signing being a disaster and he "can't win the big games"....

According to Pro Football Focus,

- Cousins was the 2nd most pressured quarterback, largely due to;

- Vikings offensive line was ranked 29th in pass blocking efficiency

- In terms of overall team run and pass blocking rankings, which include non-OL blockers as well, the Vikings ranked 25th and 27th respectively

- Overall, PFF ranked the Vikings offensive line 29th in the NFL this season.

- Only Reilly Reiff graded over 70, which is considered average

- Elflein was graded the worst Center in the NFL, 38th out of 38

Yikes!!! When you look things in this perspective, it's frightening. O'Neill turned out to be pretty good and should improve, Reiff COULD be a building block for next year (and since they're already paying him a lot, he probably stays), I guess Aviante Collins had/has some serious potential before he got hurt early, and getting Nick Easton back SHOULD help, if for nothing else at least for depth.

They have some work to do, no doubt about it.
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I didn’t want Cousins but sincere we have him and only two years left on his contract I think he will be fine as long as the realize what he is and isn’t. He is an accurate thrower with a big arm and can hit the entire route tree. Any money available (free agent or two), along with the first 2 or 3 picks should go towards the oline.


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Sportsfan24 said:
At worst they should have signed him to the practice squad after he cleared waivers. Most of those guys will never make the active roster.


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i thought that was the plan and was so confused when they didnt sign him to the PS
 

Sportsfan24 said:
I didn’t want Cousins but sincere we have him and only two years left on his contract I think he will be fine as long as the realize what he is and isn’t. He is an accurate thrower with a big arm and can hit the entire route tree. Any money available (free agent or two), along with the first 2 or 3 picks should go towards the oline.


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They need to manage him like he's a more talented version of Case Keenum. Because that's what he is. He is not Aaron Rodgers or even Matt Ryan.
 

howeda7 said:
They need to manage him like he's a more talented version of Case Keenum. Because that's what he is. He is not Aaron Rodgers or even Matt Ryan.
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Agreed and I would say although Case has limited arm talent (weak arm) that his running ability and elusiveness made him a better fit for the current Vikings team.


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If anyone thought Cousins was a top 9 or 10 qb they were not paying attention. He got paid, and why, because his own team didnt want to pay. With a good line he is a top 15 qb for sure. Zimmer never appreciated Case. Zimmer and the Vikings have largely ignored the offensive line to such a horrendous degree. Cousins needs a good line. Maybe letting DE Griffin go and possibly LB Barr can provide us with some money to invest there, along with the draft. We will see.
 

march madness said:
If anyone thought Cousins was a top 9 or 10 qb they were not paying attention.
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He was 10th in the league in QB rating, 2nd in the league in completion %, 10th in passing yards, and 9th in passing TDs, all while playing behind a horrible offensive line and an OC who wouldn't run the ball and give him any help to keep defenses balanced or set up the play action, probably his biggest strength. He is absolutely a top 10 QB in the league. There's no reasonable, fact-based argument to say that he isn't. He was the first player in LEAGUE HISTORY to have 4,000+ yards, 30+ TDs, 10 or fewer interceptions, and a 70%+ completion percentage.
 

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