Post Game Thread: Gophers 1-0 After 23-10 Win Over Buffalo

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Guess I get what people are trying to say with DT getting his first runs of season, it's just one game, etc.

He also is tough as nails and WANTS to be on the field on every snap. When the clock hit 4min or so, the game was over. Buffalo knew it, we knew it, the fans knew it. There are blows you save a guy from himself. As some of you are alluding to, he is going to carry it a ton this year (provided he's healthy). Every single one of those hits adds up and we need him far more this year to be out there when we hit B10 play. Felt kind of like when he took 33 carries vs EMU in a 25-6 win, 22 vs UNC in a loss, 31 vs NW in a loss all in a row and then he was out for over a month. These guys aren't super heroes and he's our best player plus was showing an obvious bit of slowness 2-3 times on Thursday. Felt the same way watching Haynes King for GT last night. These guys are awesome running the ball and both will will you there, you just have to choose your spots where it "matters" most. DT can take the hits, but you have 2 good complementary backs. Use 'em where you can so he's every bit as fresh when you need him to grind out carries for a win vs OSU where you absolutely will want it to be him or to salt away a game vs Iowa or Neb. The OL blocks the same regardless of who's back there in game one of the season and you've got 2 guys who have shown they know how to play at the college level behind DT.
 





Haven't seen a ton of mention of it but Koi's lone catch was really impressive and shows his potential as a WR. Great sideline awareness and body control to secure the catch and make sure feet were in bounds.

As he gets more comfortable running routes he could be a real threat in the passing game even in limited usage on that side of the ball.
 

caliGopher said:
I'm fine with that. I could be wrong.

Maybe you have an explanation of why perhaps the most individually talented line of Fleck's tenure - last years line - was worse in 2024 than it was in 2023.
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Why does he have to explain it? You seem to be the one who has the problem. How about you provide specific examples that are quantifiable instead of your hyperbolic "the offensive line coach is awful and our line sucks" BS?
 



mngg11 said:
In terms of the red zone struggles and PJ stifling the offense, I recall three separate red zone possessions where Drake lobbed the ball into he endzone corner (one was the near pick). The throws weren't great, but Lemeke was pretty open on one of them. The red zone offense wasn't purely vanilla, our receivers just needed to get open.
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There are fans that just assume that if we end up kicking a field goal it means Fleck didn't even try for the TD, and forced the offensive coaches to call super vanilla plays so that we would have to settle for 3....

It is so weird.....we all (coaches included) would love every drive to end in a TD. The fact that we had to settle for field goals I am sure frustrated the hell out of Fleck and the offensive coaches but it didn't happen because we didn't try to get in the EZ we just didn't execute to get it done.

I honestly wonder what some fans are watching when they watch the games because they see something very different then I did when I watched it.
 

caliGopher said:
I'm not comparing his lines to Kill and Claeys lines.
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You literally said "Line development at the U hasn't been a thing under Fleck."

Yet overall Fleck's offensive lines have been the best since the Mason era so what are you complaining about? It's an entirely brand new O-line this year, it will take some time to gel. And a player who would have started at RT is starting for Ohio St today.
 

RememberMurray said:
EXACTLY!

I actually laugh out loud when I read comments about Fleck "running his lead back into the ground". You'd better buckle up, buttercups, because our best player is going to have the ball in his hands A LOT this season. I know; shocking, right? Go ahead and gasp, and clutch those pearls of yours!

People love to bitch, and they will find something to complain about, no matter how weak the complaint may be. This particular one borders on being ridiculous.
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Darius was hurt in 2023, played hurt most of 2024, and so far so good in 2025. Given the overall nonzero injury probability for any RB on every play particularly at full speed and effort and given his random hamstring history I tend to side with the people that say tap the brakes a bit with one of our most talented players. We’re going to need him against big ten teams. No need to go full tilt at the end of a contest that isn’t in question anymore, risk injury.

I’d also like to see what the bench looks like.
 

mngg11 said:
Why does he have to explain it? You seem to be the one who has the problem. How about you provide specific examples that are quantifiable instead of your hyperbolic "the offensive line coach is awful and our line sucks" BS?
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😊 Thank you.
 



caliGopher said:
I'm fine with that. I could be wrong.

Maybe you have an explanation of why perhaps the most individually talented line of Fleck's tenure - last years line - was worse in 2024 than it was in 2023.
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I’ll defer to @mngg11 reply and dutifully await your analysis.

Let’s actually see if the West Coast is the best Coast🤔
 


Gopher_In_NYC said:
I’ll defer to @mngg11 reply and dutifully await your analysis.

Let’s actually see if the West Coast is the best Coast🤔
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MNgg11 likes to call people who have a different opinion names, and doesn't like me because I have the audacity to be critical of Fleck, so I don't pay too much attention to what he has to say.

I have not said a lot of things that have been inferred from my post, some of which I have not said at all, and some of which is due to my phrasing.

When I said line development I was referring to the consistency of results game to game and season to season of the line, not individual players. I was not clear there, so that's on me.

Early in Fleck's tenure, the O-line was a mess (based on the roster when he arrived). He brought in some talented players, so I'm not saying that we haven't had players, but the lines have historically not had a good season, then the next year have a better season when there was continuity. E.G., not saying the 2019 line wasn't better than the 2017 line.

I have also not seen the olines show significant improvement from game 2 to game 12, with the possible exception of 2019.

Last season was the poster child for the lack of development year to year and from game one to game 12.

Using yds per attempt as a measure, 2023 showed a 3.4 yds per carry average in B1G conf games. 2024 was 3.56 yds per carry in B1G conf games. This is with a significantly better QB under center and a healthy DT for most of the games vs Jordan Nubin as the feature back due to the significant injuries in 2023.

Another factor is sacks. The line gave up 17 sacks in B1G games in both seasons, even though AK was more prone to holding the ball too long and taking sacks needlessly, whereas Max didn't suffer that same affliction and was adept at getting rid of the ball when in trouble.

One of the reasons I looked at B1G games is that the bulk of the B1G season is after a few games - although in 2023 Nebbie was our first game.

I do expect this years line will be better than game one, but the play was eerily similar to last years game one and based on the lack of significant improvement during the course of the season last year, the lack of history of the line together this year, and 8 years of similar results, I'm not optimistic that we'll see a marked improvement over the course of the season.

My question was an honest request to understand your perspective. I am interested to learn what makes you feel differently beyond the whole PJ Fleck can do no wrong, and anyone who DARES question anything about him is full of BS from the likes of MNgg11 and similar posters.

There's a lot I see, but you disagree with my take away, so maybe I'm missing something, so if your so inclined, I'd like to understand what you see to balance my opinion based on what I see.

And if your not inclined, so be it.

ps I left Cali to go to the U and never returned living in the Midwest and Texas ever since, so I won't claim to speak for the left coast.
 


upnorthkid said:
People are aware that Cam Davis has carried the ball over 250 times and fumbled once and AJ Turner has carried it about 150 and fumbled once?

Skill wise, Taylor is a better back and offers you more getting yardage, fine, but that theory doesn't hold water because PJ decided they both could come in on the first series of 3 plays and got 4 yards (Davis) and 5 yards (Turner) to get the first first down after a DT rush for 2 yards on 1st. Davis then came and took more carries later

so if they're good enough to be out there on the first sequence of 3 plays when there's the most time on the clock, why not when there's 3:30 to go after which time Taylor took 7 more carries to their 0?

Particularly with a DT who was limping earlier and has had issues with health in the past? 30 carries is a ton, particularly in a game that was hard hitting and physical. He would lead the NCAA in attempts if he did that over a season (Jeanty took 374 totes over 14 games to lead NCAA last year). In 2023, 297 carries led the NCAA. I don't think we quite realize that 30 carries is a massive workload
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30 is a ton if that’s what one will average for the year. For a single game though it’s nothing crazy. I do think Fleck does leave guys in too long at times. Up until the final drive the distribution of carries was pretty good. I’m guessing we could have just as easily have iced the game rotating in the other guys, but I think the risk of injury on the final drive was worth it to secure the win. If DT gets more than 10-15 carries against NW ST then we’re just doing things wrong, I can’t think of any justification to go over that.
 

btowngopher said:
30 is a ton if that’s what one will average for the year. For a single game though it’s nothing crazy. I do think Fleck does leave guys in too long at times. Up until the final drive the distribution of carries was pretty good. I’m guessing we could have just as easily have iced the game rotating in the other guys, but I think the risk of injury on the final drive was worth it to secure the win. If DT gets more than 10-15 carries against NW ST then we’re just doing things wrong, I can’t think of any justification to go over that.
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tbh i think, and this is the only real logical reason I can come up with now thinking back, that PJ was trying to use it to send a message to the line and team that they can do this. Tell the OL go dominate the LOS, DT will get you the yards, and let's show we have the power to go and just take a team's will, which has been an adage of Gopher football under PJ prior to last year. The rushing stats were not great for the bulk of the game, but may have just been to send that message of even when you've been meh, you can get it done when it matters. And i say meh because prior to that drive we had 102 yards on 29 carries.

Still think they need to keep Turner and Davis involved (wouldn't be surprised if we get back into DT and/or Koi for that matter) running some jet motion like we used to more frequently
 

caliGopher said:
MNgg11 likes to call people who have a different opinion names, and doesn't like me because I have the audacity to be critical of Fleck, so I don't pay too much attention to what he has to say.
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I appreciate your thoughtful reply abd as zi don’t know how old you are, I’ll share my perspective FWIW.

I’ll be 59 in less than two months. So I remember apocalyptic gopher football.

I don’t follow it like I did in my Utes, and while Fleck ain’t a god, he’s far better than anything since Holtz, and surpassed Lispin’ Lou because he stayed and has built something sustainable.

Fleck has improved all facets of the program in my opinion and grow as a coach, as there was a time when winning 6-7 games was jubilation, cause it likely meant a bowl game. A bowl habe us no the floor and not the ceiling.

I said when the NIL can out, that this would play to Fleck’s strengths, about authenticity, culture and character. Lots of players/parents want that, in a world where it’s far more complicated to be a teenager/ young adult in my time.



caliGopher said:
I have not said a lot of things that have been inferred from my post, some of which I have not said at all, and some of which is due to my phrasing.

When I said line development I was referring to the consistency of results game to game and season to season of the line, not individual players. I was not clear there, so that's on me.
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Thank you for further clarifying.
caliGopher said:
Early in Fleck's tenure, the O-line was a mess (based on the roster when he arrived).
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Yup
caliGopher said:
He brought in some talented players, so I'm not saying that we haven't had players, but the lines have historically not had a good season, then the next year have a better season when there was continuity. E.G., not saying the 2019 line wasn't better than the 2017 line.
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It depends on on what you consider a good season to be, doesn’t it?
caliGopher said:
I have also not seen the olines show significant improvement from game 2 to game 12, with the possible exception of 2019.
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How is that measured?
caliGopher said:
Last season was the poster child for the lack of development year to year and from game one to game 12.

Using yds per attempt as a measure, 2023 showed a 3.4 yds per carry average in B1G conf games. 2024 was 3.56 yds per carry in B1G conf games. This is with a significantly better QB under center and a healthy DT for most of the games vs Jordan Nubin as the feature back due to the significant injuries in 2023.
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Would a better metric be, to see hire we rank in the conference in yards/per attempt, since you’re using that data set (conference)? Then compare them year to year?

I’m no going to do thst and am not asking you to, I’m just spitballing here.

caliGopher said:
Another factor is sacks. The line gave up 17 sacks in B1G games in both seasons, even though AK was more prone to holding the ball too long and taking sacks needlessly, whereas Max didn't suffer that same affliction and was adept at getting rid of the ball when in trouble.
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Max also has far less mobility than AK.
caliGopher said:
One of the reasons I looked at B1G games is that the bulk of the B1G season is after a few games - although in 2023 Nebbie was our first game.

I do expect this years line will be better than game one, but the play was eerily similar to last years game one and based on the lack of significant improvement during the course of the season last year, the lack of history of the line together this year, and 8 years of similar results, I'm not optimistic that we'll see a marked improvement over the course of the season.
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Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.
caliGopher said:
My question was an honest request to understand your perspective. I am interested to learn what makes you feel differently beyond the whole PJ Fleck can do no wrong,
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As mentioned above, I’m not in that lane.

The year DT gothurt he was averaging-145/155 yards a game for the ~6 games he started - which was the most per game in D1 - IIRC. That was pretty impressive to me.
caliGopher said:
and anyone who DARES question anything about him is full of BS from the likes of MNgg11 and similar posters.

There's a lot I see, but you disagree with my take away, so maybe I'm missing something, so if your so inclined, I'd like to understand what you see to balance my opinion based on what I see.
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My days of “expertise” regarding CFB, are long gone, as I don’t watch follow it outside Gophers anymore.

It’s basically entertainment to me, at this juncture.
caliGopher said:
And if your not inclined, so be it.

ps I left Cali to go to the U and never returned living in the Midwest and Texas ever since, so I won't claim to speak for the left coast.
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Just the musings from a washed up/iut LBer.
 

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