MN Dailiy: Gophers buck national trend, fill football stadium

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Good article with someone finally recognizing there IS a challenge with all the other pro teams int he area (besides us here on the board). Don't necessarily believe the numbers since schools don't report (or even count?) attendance - they count ticket SALES. I've been to a lot of home Gopher games (read: nearly all in TCF) and we have NOT averaged 49,759 per game. So it makes me wonder what the real number is (at all the schools) and where we actually are among them.

Yet again, what's missing from this piece is some creativity, some suggestions, some action. Great, identify a possible challenge for us. But what does the U have going for it that other schools in metro areas don't? How CAN we energize people, the surrounding neighborhoods, etc to get a gameday atmosphere (without "just winning")? What have the schools like Washington, USC, UCLA done to have high attendance rates despite large metro areas with pro sports competition?

I get a little frustrated when people continually look at challenges or issues and say "yep, it's tough," without a clear plan of how to overcome it, or worse yet, saying "we CAN'T win.."
 

RailBaronYarr said:
Good article with someone finally recognizing there IS a challenge with all the other pro teams int he area (besides us here on the board). Don't necessarily believe the numbers since schools don't report (or even count?) attendance - they count ticket SALES. I've been to a lot of home Gopher games (read: nearly all in TCF) and we have NOT averaged 49,759 per game. So it makes me wonder what the real number is (at all the schools) and where we actually are among them.

Yet again, what's missing from this piece is some creativity, some suggestions, some action. Great, identify a possible challenge for us. But what does the U have going for it that other schools in metro areas don't? How CAN we energize people, the surrounding neighborhoods, etc to get a gameday atmosphere (without "just winning")? What have the schools like Washington, USC, UCLA done to have high attendance rates despite large metro areas with pro sports competition?

I get a little frustrated when people continually look at challenges or issues and say "yep, it's tough," without a clear plan of how to overcome it, or worse yet, saying "we CAN'T win.."
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Is counting attendance this way exclusive to the U or do most major schools count it this way?
 

It is much easier to count how many tickets you have sold than to count how many people actually come to the game, so I believe that virtually all schools are counting tickets sold.
 

RodentRampage said:
It is much easier to count how many tickets you have sold than to count how many people actually come to the game, so I believe that virtually all schools are counting tickets sold.
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So when Wisconsin fans say "our stadium was never empty, look at these attendance figures!!!!" it actually means nothing as to how full the stadium was?
 


RodentRampage said:
It is much easier to count how many tickets you have sold than to count how many people actually come to the game, so I believe that virtually all schools are counting tickets sold.
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Virtually all sports. NFL, NBA, MLB

If not you have to use those turnstile things and the fire marshal doesn't like them.
 

scher215 said:
So when Wisconsin fans say "our stadium was never empty, look at these attendance figures!!!!" it actually means nothing as to how full the stadium was?
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I don't know if that's true. Back in the day maybe the attendance figures were truly that. Maybe they weren't. Based on the numbers that Wisco fan keeps putting on random threads showing average attendance figures I would assume they used tickets sold not gate numbers (based on multiple accounts of almost completely empty stadiums for years from their own fanbases). He also states that UW's own website lists those numbers but I've scoured the site and never found anything. Who knows.

It is much easier to count how many tickets you have sold than to count how many people actually come to the game, so I believe that virtually all schools are counting tickets sold.
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I don't know about that. Yes, it's easy to know how many tickets were sold to a game using their sales database. Just as easy to know who attended since every single ticket is scanned electronically (and immediately goes in to the "I'm here" database to make sure no one uses the same ticket twice to get in to a game). I would say that maybe in-game announcement of attendance maybe easier to know based on sales, but post-season records just as easy to know the true number. The first season at TCF there were plenty of games (Purdue, SDSU) where there were thousands of seats open and the scoreboard still said 50,805. I had to laugh.

Is counting attendance this way exclusive to the U or do most major schools count it this way?
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I would bet all do it the same way, maybe a few outliers. It makes the stadium/school seem better to those not in attendance. That's why I said I don't really know where the U compares to all the other schools since I can't tell you how many tickets were actually sold to those games vs attended (which I have a good feel for at the U).
 

station19 said:
Virtually all sports. NFL, NBA, MLB

If not you have to use those turnstile things and the fire marshal doesn't like them.
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Why would they need turnstiles? They scan the tickets with those little machines, I am sure they can easily count how many tickets were scanned.
 

Nate said:
Why would they need turnstiles? They scan the tickets with those little machines, I am sure they can easily count how many tickets were scanned.
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Not sure if all sport venues use them but I was also referring to years past before electronic scanners.

Even with scanners the schools/teams would be inclined to show the tickets sold numbers.
 



Has there ever been a game where everyone shows up? Even the Super Bowl has no-shows.
 

I've never heard of anyone in sports not using tickets distributed for attendance. Why would they not use the larger number - there will always be more tickets issued than used to RodentRampage's point. They want to make it seem like there are more people there then there so it remains a hotter commodity.
 

Don't announce it or report it as "Attendance" then. I actually think it looks worse on the University to state 50,805 were in attendance when there were 10k empty seats. If they want to keep it a "hot commodity" ... to what end? drive up ticket prices by lying about attendance to create the illusion of demand and low supply? That's not only shady business, you alienate people who spend $65 a ticket and show up to see thousands of empty seats. Why should they be or become a loyal fan if the university (or team) will lie to them about supply/demand to artificially increase prices?

I guarantee they also internally report the actual attendance figures, as well as with any outside vendors or advertisers. Aramark, and any other food/bev vendor wants to know how many people are THERE, not who bought tickets. Target, Mills Fleet Farm, etc who advertise and sponsor at the game also want a fair/realistic number of attendance.

Every venue has the technology to know how many people came. They should report it. Heck, turn it in to a benefit by giving rewards/loyalty discounts/etc to the fans who DO show up every game. To the ones who dont come to 2+ home games, they drop the priority to keep their seat location. Something.
 

They aren't lying, that is the terminology used in sports. Why should the U report attendance differently than anyone else? How does this "alienate" anyone? They most certainly aren't lying about supply and demand, if all the tickets are sold, there was enough demand to sell all the tickets. If people don't show up, it doesn't increase the supply, the U can't sell the no-show's seats.
 



drive up ticket prices by lying about attendance to create the illusion of demand and low supply?
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Well if they are selling most or all of the 50,000+ tickets, then how are they lying about the low supply? If they sell 99% of the tickets before the season starts, there is a high demand and low supply at that point.

This would be a valid argument if only 40,000 tickets were actually sold for each game, but that's not the case.
 

The way to overcome empty stadiums is to just win baby. We already showed that if you build it they will not all come. The real answer #winning
 

GophersInIowa said:
Well if they are selling most or all of the 50,000+ tickets, then how are they lying about the low supply? If they sell 99% of the tickets before the season starts, there is a high demand and low supply at that point.

This would be a valid argument if only 40,000 tickets were actually sold for each game, but that's not the case.
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Fact: they are not selling the capacity of the entire stadium last year or this year, even including the seats sold mid-season to opposing fans.

Fact: they report attendance to the game despite the fact that not that many people attended the game. "Attendance" does not mean "number of tickets sold" - even if everyone else does it, it's not ok or not lying.

They use the numbers of tickets sold to justify the demand being there which keeps ticket prices (and donation levels and parking pass costs) the same as they were in year one. The demand is NOT there as many season ticket holders did not renew this year, some of those seats were picked up (not all), and many by either Badger, Iowa, Husker fans or more ticket brokers who could make their money back on any of those big home games. The fact that the seats are not filled, particularly between the 30s on home and away side (and even on our 3 biggest games), is clear evidence that the demand is not there.

As I said, it's my opinion that it's more embarrassing for the U to report 49,000 people in attendance when anyone who was at the game or saw any part of it on tv knows that's not close to true than it is to just report the truth (which they know).
 

RailBaronYarr said:
Good article with someone finally recognizing there IS a challenge with all the other pro teams int he area (besides us here on the board). Don't necessarily believe the numbers since schools don't report (or even count?) attendance - they count ticket SALES. I've been to a lot of home Gopher games (read: nearly all in TCF) and we have NOT averaged 49,759 per game. So it makes me wonder what the real number is (at all the schools) and where we actually are among them.

Yet again, what's missing from this piece is some creativity, some suggestions, some action. Great, identify a possible challenge for us. But what does the U have going for it that other schools in metro areas don't? How CAN we energize people, the surrounding neighborhoods, etc to get a gameday atmosphere (without "just winning")? What have the schools like Washington, USC, UCLA done to have high attendance rates despite large metro areas with pro sports competition?

I get a little frustrated when people continually look at challenges or issues and say "yep, it's tough," without a clear plan of how to overcome it, or worse yet, saying "we CAN'T win.."
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RailBaronYarr,

1. I think it was a very sophomoric article which was poorly researched and backed by shoddy statistics.

2. Rutgers is not in Newark, New Jersey. It is in Piscataway, New Jersey, at least 30 miles off the mark. http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&tab=wl

3. Why is the author throwing USC and UCLA into the mix? There is no NFL football in the Los Angeles basin. They should not even be in this discussion. The author starts with a premise regarding big four corporate sports and then goes off into la la land in the LA basin where there is no NFL football competition.

4. Was this article written by Herr Generalfeldmarschall Friedrich Wilhelm Ernst Paulus (Joel Maturi) or a member of Joel Maturi's staff? Garbage.
 

Didn't the article compare % of capacity. Is that really a fair evaluation.
What if TCF was built to seat 30k.
What if it was built to seat 80k.
Do you think that might change the % of capacity.

Are other school Stadiums oversized or undersized.
 

6 Nov 1999 said:
Rutgers is not in Newark, New Jersey. It is in Piscataway, New Jersey, at least 30 miles off the mark.
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You are wrong on both counts. There is indeed a Rutgers campus in Newark (one of three, the others being Rutgers-Camden and Rutgers-New Brunswick, the latter being the main campus). Further, the main campus is located primarily in New Brunswick, with a lesser portion being in Piscataway. The football stadium itself is in Piscataway, but the main campus mailing address, and the majority of the main campus itself, are in New Brunswick.
 

What is one to believe?

dpodoll68 said:
You are wrong on both counts. There is indeed a Rutgers campus in Newark (one of three, the others being Rutgers-Camden and Rutgers-New Brunswick, the latter being the main campus). Further, the main campus is located primarily in New Brunswick, with a lesser portion being in Piscataway. The football stadium itself is in Piscataway, but the main campus mailing address, and the majority of the main campus itself, are in New Brunswick.
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From the number of corrections that dpodoll makes on this blog I am beginning to lose my faith in the accuracy of the comments here. Is this site a subsidiary of FOX News?
 

RodentRampage said:
They aren't lying, that is the terminology used in sports. Why should the U report attendance differently than anyone else? How does this "alienate" anyone? They most certainly aren't lying about supply and demand, if all the tickets are sold, there was enough demand to sell all the tickets. If people don't show up, it doesn't increase the supply, the U can't sell the no-show's seats.
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EXACTLY. This is why I don't mind the current 'system' of attendance tracking. I don't care, honestly, how many people are in the stadium. I care about how many tickets the U sold, because that money is what matters. Win on the field and people will show up.
 

station19 said:
Didn't the article compare % of capacity. Is that really a fair evaluation.
What if TCF was built to seat 30k.
What if it was built to seat 80k.
Do you think that might change the % of capacity.

Are other school Stadiums oversized or undersized.
Click to expand...

I think it's fair enough. If other stadiums are over/under sized that's not our problem. The stats the author used for us was interesting because it counted one year in the Dome which means there was most likely a bigger % not sold that year than the 2 years in TCF (which I think the entire first year was sold out). The numbers even out over time.
 

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