PDF of development around TCF

[pharmacygopher]

Awhile back someone posted a pdf that showed the plans for the buildings around the stadium. I know that entire area is going to be developed as kind of the medical biosciences research area. I ask because coming to class today I realized that the lot directly across from Ski-U-Mah lot is gone and there good progress being made of the building there.

Thanks!

 

[GopherInWI]

http://www.cppm.umn.edu/biomed_discovery.html

Here's the best I can find on a quick search.

 

[highwayman]

Looks like the Maroon and Gold lots are going away someday, also. That gives a clue as to why the U has made parking there a premium today. Get the $ while you can, don't disappoint tailgaters in the future (any more than usual)...

 

[koppco1]

Based on the sketch it looks like they plan on zero surface parking around the stadium (one existing parking lot looks like green space in the sketch). BIG MISTAKE. They need to keep some level of tailgating around that stadium or the gameday experience will get worse and not better. If the area ends up anything like what they have sketched here, the U better be ready to close down alot of streets to put on some sort of huge gameday activities around the stadium.

 

[Formo]

Jeez. I know it's probably a great thing to have the U be getting these great medical buildings and such... But still I think it sucks we are continuing to lose parking lots.

 

[Unregistered User]

Send this link to Coach Kill. I have every confidence that he'll get in Kaler's ear about it, and keep a good portion of tailgating space.

 

[GoGoGophers]

Looks like the Maroon and Gold lots are going away someday, also. That gives a clue as to why the U has made parking there a premium today. Get the $ while you can, don't disappoint tailgaters in the future (any more than usual)...

The Minnesota lot will be gone too. Oh, and the Gateway lot! And every other parking/tailgating option around the stadium. The city and administration will get exactly what they want, namely 0 tailgating and 0 atmosphere at all home games! YAY!

As stated in a previous thread re: the USC game, it was amazing how their administration has actually tried to foster the atmosphere and alumni experience for their games and not try to choke it to death by only begrudingly allowing the absolute minimum. Walking around their campus was depressing when I remembered what I had to look forward to here on 9/10. And there are already plans in place to destroy what little there is now. I'm sure they'll open up the mall and the other acres of green space on campus, though, right?

It is becoming clear that our administration is well on the way to wasting our last opportunity to create what all of our conference brethren have, namely a football/athletics program that rallies alumni, students, and most importantly DONORS to the larger benefit of the entire university.

 

[year of the gopher]

Don't assume that sketch is accurate or in any way imminent. The biomedical discovery district has already been scaled back from this design somewhat, mainly because state budget cuts and the medical school's budget issues have created a scenario where the U wouldn't be able to hire enough scientists to fill all the space originally planned.

It's also only a conceptual drawing and they won't be able to get away with having no surface parking in the area. It's just not feasible.

 

[dpodoll68]

It's also only a conceptual drawing and they won't be able to get away with having no surface parking in the area. It's just not feasible.

This is just what I was going to say, but you beat me to it. That is clearly someone's fanciful notion of a perfect, beautiful green area all around the stadium. The U is already shorthanded when it comes to parking spots, and it just isn't possible to provide adequate parking options to the employees who are there 260 days a year if all of those spots are gone. The numbers just don't work. Rest assured that the Maroon, Gold, Victory, Ski-U-Mah, Minnesota, Discovery, Gateway, C33, and 37 lots will be there for the foreseeable future.

 

[RailBaronYarr]

I remember the pdf that was passed around here a while back clearly showed quite a few garages in the expansion area. They stated it would meet the current number of parking spots plus the additional requirement from the additional work force and students in that area. Meaning not a huge difference in number of parking spots but no more surface lots.

While these may be "fanciful" pictures they rarely go so far down with fully rendered 3D graphics like that if they don't think it's the route they'll go. As the site says, construction estimates are being done now and will be finished in September. My guess is they know the budget and have adjusted down what they'll build (if down at all) and get the bids from companies to build it in the spring.

I'm bummed about this because it WILL likely cut down a good amount of surface lots. While I love the location of the stadium in relation to campus and access to both Stadium Village and Dinkytown, the railroad tracks make it difficult to get a cohesive tailgating/bar/neighborhood area completely surrounding the stadium. Putting university buildings in place of parking lots will only make it worse since those research buildings have a low chance of having some bars on the main level.

 

[THE Chitown Gopher]

This is so typical of the U....Create/Promise something exciting and perhaps fun and then take it away.

Beyond the 40k for football, 15k for hoops/Hockey and 25k students, where do the 'academics' expect anyone to park? Plenty of other areas for expansion.

 

[CrocShots]

It's all in the Master Plan here: http://www.cppm.umn.edu/master_planning.html

Where exactly, I can't remember, but it's an interesting read on it's own.

 

[year of the gopher]

It's all in the Master Plan here: http://www.cppm.umn.edu/master_planning.html

Where exactly, I can't remember, but it's an interesting read on it's own.

It's here: http://www.cppm.umn.edu/assets/pdf/east_gateway_district_mp.pdf

And again, this is a master plan. Things aren't always built to plan and even when they are, it often takes decades.

To defend the University a bit:

1) It doesn't exist to provide parking to tailgaters within 100 feet of the stadium. It's there for teaching and research and those needs can, will, and should trump.

2) The absence of nearby surface parking hasn't eliminated game day atmosphere in other college towns. Madison, for example, has a dearth of parking right next to Camp Randall. http://www.transportation.wisc.edu/files/campusparkingmap.jpg

A big part of it for the U is getting the city of Minneapolis to loosen its iron grip on local businesses selling game day parking/tailgating spots. Then, of course, it's all about success. If Coach Kill can build the Gophers into a consistent winning program, people will create the desired atmosphere.

 

[pharmacygopher]

It's here: http://www.cppm.umn.edu/assets/pdf/east_gateway_district_mp.pdf

And again, this is a master plan. Things aren't always built to plan and even when they are, it often takes decades.

To defend the University a bit:

1) It doesn't exist to provide parking to tailgaters within 100 feet of the stadium. It's there for teaching and research and those needs can, will, and should trump.

2) The absence of nearby surface parking hasn't eliminated game day atmosphere in other college towns. Madison, for example, has a dearth of parking right next to Camp Randall. http://www.transportation.wisc.edu/files/campusparkingmap.jpg

A big part of it for the U is getting the city of Minneapolis to loosen its iron grip on local businesses selling game day parking/tailgating spots. Then, of course, it's all about success. If Coach Kill can build the Gophers into a consistent winning program, people will create the desired atmosphere.

I agree. As much as I love Gopher football and athletics - they are not to sole reason the University exists. I am even more proud of the fact that I'll have multiple degrees from an institution that is focused on education and research. I want the U to remain competitive in both athletics AND research/education. We talk about the University committing to making the revenue sports competitive. The same goes for research.

Odd question....What is North of the stadium?? I know railroad tracks and what not. Is it feasible at all to expand North??

 

[Ski U Master]

Arguing against placing an academic structure on a surface lot is absurd, parking will be moved to ramps built in the area. Real estate is at a premium on campus, and this is one of the last places to build large academic buildings and they should take precedence over tailgating 7 times a year.

 

[RailBaronYarr]

A large master plan can be seen here: http://www.cppm.umn.edu/assets/pdf/2009_BOR_mp.pdf Page 27 shows a pretty hefty area of "joint planning" that I imagine will take over much of the railroad/grain areas in the longer-term future. Not sure if this is proposed U-owned land or if the U will strongly influence what goes there but it looks like (from several slides that show Granary Rd (future)) there will be something up north of the "East Gateway District." Neighborhoods? Surface Lots? Replacement intramural fields once that road goes in? Who knows.

This was the document the OP was looking for http://www.cppm.umn.edu/assets/pdf/east_gateway_district_mp.pdf pages 5 and 6 show a pretty good overview. There seems to be some surface parking remaining to the west of the westmost parking structure (assuming they don't turn it in to a runoff pond to replace the existing one), but other than that it's all gone.. There also seems to be some buildings on the east slated for private development, which I would assume means apartments with restaurants/bars/shops on the ground floor (as has been the theme over in Dinkytown the last 2 years).

I remember saying it last time, and it still kinda rings true to me... The reality is that the university CAN and DOES bring in a ton of money from research (grants, donations, corporate sponsored research) so in that regard using this space makes sense for them. The parking lots on hand today are used primarily (260 days a year) for staff and students. So to the U, if they are replacing surface lots with revenue and prestige-generating buildings and keeping the same # of parking spots for all (including game day) what's the big deal if 7 Saturdays a year people have a slightly harder time getting drunk? I don't disagree with that sentiment when looked at as a dollars and cents, black and white approach, but having a productive team and gameday atmosphere can bring in tons of money in ways they can't accurately expect or predict (donations, boosters, apparel revenue, higher ticket prices due to demand, etc etc). Here are some other comments/concerns:

- Views of the stadium. The more you put up around it the harder it is to see and the more it becomes just "another building" on campus to many people. They're doing the right thing by tearing down that atrocious building on the SE corner of the stadium and replacing it with a grass/trees. But they need to make sure it stays this way
- Allowing a culture of "tailgating" - this should be a mix of U-owned lots, private lots (looking at you, city), grassy campus areas, frats/houses on campus, and bars/restaurants. We'll never be like Miller Park with miles of lots but making gameday a fun experience before and after is VERY important, and the more you push people away the more likely they are to just show up 5 minutes late, leave 10 minutes early (or not show up at all).

I will say, though, that they put together compelling presentations/plans in a very clear-to-understand way.

 

[CrocShots]

I think it can be a positive in that with eliminating the surface lots they can have people walk through campus and make it more of a campus experience.

Hopefully this leads to the U getting more involved in creating more businesses (BARS) around the area and creating a better game day atmosphere.

Like it's said above: Becky does a fine job with little parking.'

Less Parking may mean less commuters which leads to more people on campus which leads to more money for the University and surrounding businesses.

 

[GoGoGophers]

To defend the University a bit:

1) It doesn't exist to provide parking to tailgaters within 100 feet of the stadium. It's there for teaching and research and those needs can, will, and should trump.

2) The absence of nearby surface parking hasn't eliminated game day atmosphere in other college towns. Madison, for example, has a dearth of parking right next to Camp Randall.

To #1 - Athletics and education do not need to be on conflicting agendas, something this university forgot sometime in the late 1960s. Schools like Ohio State, Michigan, and Wisconsin fully grasp this. To the dismay of many professors and administrators, alumni and student involvement at major public universities is often tied to the success of major athletic programs and not whether they received another NSF grant to build a new MAST lab. The more alumni and students that are involved, the more likely they are to donate money. That is just a fact. Supporting athletic programs should not be viewed as having an adverse effect on the core functions of the university, especially with the continued reduction in state support.

To #2 - Agreed that it's not about surface parking, it's about a university supporting a big time athletic atmosphere. Do you really think our regents and administrators support Big Ten football like they do in Madison? Columbus? East Lansing? State College? No way. Getting rid of the parking is just a symptom of the overall problem. Lack of institutional support continues to hinder our university.

 

[Catechol]

Research buildings

I spent several years at the Medical School and agree with those who say the educational/research mission of the U should come before tailgating 7 days a year. I also recognize the parking can be beneficial year round as well (not everyone can take the LRT!).

What I still hope is for them to build enough facilities by the stadium to move people out of the smaller/older buildings (e.g. Dwan VCRC, the older Masonic building) that aren't efficient spaces for their current use. Those could then be torn down and rebuilt with bigger facilities designed for today's research. That way they could keep more research at the medical center, as it is difficult for clinician researchers to shuttle between the stadium and medical districts.

 

[RailBaronYarr]

To #1 - Athletics and education do not need to be on conflicting agendas, something this university forgot sometime in the late 1960s. Schools like Ohio State, Michigan, and Wisconsin fully grasp this. To the dismay of many professors and administrators, alumni and student involvement at major public universities is often tied to the success of major athletic programs and not whether they received another NSF grant to build a new MAST lab. The more alumni and students that are involved, the more likely they are to donate money. That is just a fact. Supporting athletic programs should not be viewed as having an adverse effect on the core functions of the university, especially with the continued reduction in state support.

To #2 - Agreed that it's not about surface parking, it's about a university supporting a big time athletic atmosphere. Do you really think our regents and administrators support Big Ten football like they do in Madison? Columbus? East Lansing? State College? No way. Getting rid of the parking is just a symptom of the overall problem. Lack of institutional support continues to hinder our university.

I think you hit my thoughts for the most part. I think the PRIMARY focus of the university should be to teach. Part of being able to teach at very high levels includes research (in science and technology related fields) which is why we have all these labs. I'd argue that the university could also be charged with "teaching" and fostering athletics, which is probably why sports are around. But yes, athletics and academics are not mutually exclusive and can benefit one another. The funding, campus layout, etc should never swing so one-sided that it forgets the other, but if you HAVE to pick one, it should probably be academics. That being said, the administration needs to realize that creating a big time atmosphere has paybacks down the road they can't even imagine. From a $ perspective as well as a public image perspective (do you think joe blow MN resident would think funding the U $XXM extra a year would be a big deal if we were winning Rose Bowls? nope.).

 

[Ski U Master]

Fans need to start realizing that our campus isn't equipped for a tailgating gameday, but a bar/party type of pregame.

 

[urbangopher]

Fans need to start realizing that our campus isn't equipped for a tailgating gameday, but a bar/party type of pregame.

True. Unlike cornfield U, the density of existing development and premium on remaining developable land makes surface parking lots inefficient and impractical. And as regent street in madison proves, you can foster an excellent gameday atmosphere in an urban environment without surface parking lots.

 

[RailBaronYarr]

True. Unlike cornfield U, the density of existing development and premium on remaining developable land makes surface parking lots inefficient and impractical. And as regent street in madison proves, you can foster an excellent gameday atmosphere in an urban environment without surface parking lots.

In addition to utilizing what lots you DO have. With an abundance of garages, no surface lot should be left as a non-tailgating lot. Be lax, let them party, and make them relatively affordable to fill 'em up!

 

[DLguy]

A couple of things. First, this is an outdated plan. The building where the one currently under construction is nothing like what the actual shape will be. Also, I believe the updated version only calls for about 8 or 9 TOTAL buildings in the biomedical district. The model that we see here has 18. The U is also buying up parcels closer to the heart of campus to build other buildings. Such as the Ambulatory Care unit. Another thing, they are only building 1 of these buildings every 2-4 years at the most. It will be a long time before all planned 8-9 are built. The U will also continue to buy those old grain elevators and all of that land and turn those to parking lots to replace ones built on.

 

[GoAUpher]

2) The absence of nearby surface parking hasn't eliminated game day atmosphere in other college towns. Madison, for example, has a dearth of parking right next to Camp Randall. http://www.transportation.wisc.edu/files/campusparkingmap.jpg

A big part of it for the U is getting the city of Minneapolis to loosen its iron grip on local businesses selling game day parking/tailgating spots. Then, of course, it's all about success. If Coach Kill can build the Gophers into a consistent winning program, people will create the desired atmosphere.

Exactly. Look at USC. They lack surface parking but it didn't seem to stop them from having a great pregame scene. There are plenty of ways the U could improve the gameday atmosphere beyond making cheap surface parking available. Thus far they've chosen not to pursue them.

 

[GoAUpher]

A large master plan can be seen here:
- Views of the stadium. The more you put up around it the harder it is to see and the more it becomes just "another building" on campus to many people. They're doing the right thing by tearing down that atrocious building on the SE corner of the stadium and replacing it with a grass/trees. But they need to make sure it stays this way
- Allowing a culture of "tailgating" - this should be a mix of U-owned lots, private lots (looking at you, city), grassy campus areas, frats/houses on campus, and bars/restaurants. We'll never be like Miller Park with miles of lots but making gameday a fun experience before and after is VERY important, and the more you push people away the more likely they are to just show up 5 minutes late, leave 10 minutes early (or not show up at all).

Per the East Gateway District Plan the building that currently blocks TCF from the SE will come down. There is a lot of time spent articulating how TCF should be showcased in the plan.

 

[GoAUpher]

Based on the sketch it looks like they plan on zero surface parking around the stadium (one existing parking lot looks like green space in the sketch). BIG MISTAKE. They need to keep some level of tailgating around that stadium or the gameday experience will get worse and not better. If the area ends up anything like what they have sketched here, the U better be ready to close down alot of streets to put on some sort of huge gameday activities around the stadium.

The U has plenty of space available for tailgating if it wants to use it. Northrup Mall for example. Even if the EGD plan comes to full fruition, there will be greenspace by those buildings that could be used as well. It's up to the U to offer those opportunities and to push the City to allow private lots to sell tailgating.

 

[GoAUpher]

I remember the pdf that was passed around here a while back clearly showed quite a few garages in the expansion area. They stated it would meet the current number of parking spots plus the additional requirement from the additional work force and students in that area. Meaning not a huge difference in number of parking spots but no more surface lots.

Correct. Here are the numbers from the plan:
Current surface spots: 3,058
New ramp spots: 3,300

 

[year of the gopher]

To #1 - Athletics and education do not need to be on conflicting agendas, something this university forgot sometime in the late 1960s. Schools like Ohio State, Michigan, and Wisconsin fully grasp this. To the dismay of many professors and administrators, alumni and student involvement at major public universities is often tied to the success of major athletic programs and not whether they received another NSF grant to build a new MAST lab. The more alumni and students that are involved, the more likely they are to donate money. That is just a fact. Supporting athletic programs should not be viewed as having an adverse effect on the core functions of the university, especially with the continued reduction in state support.

To #2 - Agreed that it's not about surface parking, it's about a university supporting a big time athletic atmosphere. Do you really think our regents and administrators support Big Ten football like they do in Madison? Columbus? East Lansing? State College? No way. Getting rid of the parking is just a symptom of the overall problem. Lack of institutional support continues to hinder our university.

I never meant to imply that they need to have conflicting agendas. But reserving precious space that could have mission-centered activities for tailgating 7 times per year is not likely going to pass muster with the Regents, the President, or anyone at the U for that matter. There are, as others have noted, a myriad of ways to foster a great on-campus game day experience.
The institutional support issue is one that I agree with to some extent, but I think the tailgating piece is only one small part of that. And I do think the administration has come around over the last 10 years on that front and under President Kaler will really ramp up support.

 

[RailBaronYarr]

Does anyone have any idea which of the railroads to the north of the stadium are currently in use, which are ones that could open back up, and which are completely abandoned lines? In addition, are those grain silos still in use? I thought someone said Budweiser used them to store grain then haul down to StLouis a long time ago. Just wondering what the U COULD do with this space...