RandBall discusses Coyle model "He would rather make a decision a year too early than a year too late" writes "How has Fleck survived in this model?"

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BleedGopher

BleedGopher

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Per RandBall:

With Brad Frost and Bob Motzko both relieved of their duties this week, however, I would argue we now have more evidence of a pattern for how Coyle decides to make changes:

He would rather make a decision a year too early than a year too late.
  • Another thought to finish this off: How has P.J. Fleck survived to enter a 10th season as Gophers football coach in this model? Well, he has a massive buyout, so any move would be very expensive. Coyle thinks highly of Fleck and the job he is doing, even if the coach has done more to raise the floor of the program than the ceiling. And there is a practical reality of “who could do a better job here?” even if fans have visions of an Indiana-esque turnaround.

Go Gophers!!
 

What? Beyond the PJ point is this not the exact opposite of Coyle. Define late? Johnson and Whalen were an obvious mess a year before either left. I like Bob, but he just had the worst season of any coach since 1972. How on earth is that in any way proactive?
 


Torres9 said:
What? Beyond the PJ point is this not the exact opposite of Coyle. Define late? Johnson and Whalen were an obvious mess a year before either left. I like Bob, but he just had the worst season of any coach since 1972. How on earth is that in any way proactive?
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Agree! Look at most of his moves. You can almost always say he makes the move too late. Baseball was 2-3 years late. Softball we are still waiting on and it has gone from a top program to one of the worst. You mentioned both basketball programs which were atleast 1 year late. Not sure how anybody can come up with this conclusion that Coyle moves early on firing coaches. The opposite is true.
 
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BleedGopher said:
Per RandBall:

With Brad Frost and Bob Motzko both relieved of their duties this week, however, I would argue we now have more evidence of a pattern for how Coyle decides to make changes:

He would rather make a decision a year too early than a year too late.
  • Another thought to finish this off: How has P.J. Fleck survived to enter a 10th season as Gophers football coach in this model? Well, he has a massive buyout, so any move would be very expensive. Coyle thinks highly of Fleck and the job he is doing, even if the coach has done more to raise the floor of the program than the ceiling. And there is a practical reality of “who could do a better job here?” even if fans have visions of an Indiana-esque turnaround.

Go Gophers!!
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On what planet has he not raised the ceiling of the program?
He has the only top 10 finish of the last 50 years.
He has HALF of the winning conference seasons since 1974


He hasn’t raised it as much as some have liked, but he certainly raised it.
 


BleedGopher said:
Per RandBall:

With Brad Frost and Bob Motzko both relieved of their duties this week, however, I would argue we now have more evidence of a pattern for how Coyle decides to make changes:

He would rather make a decision a year too early than a year too late.
  • Another thought to finish this off: How has P.J. Fleck survived to enter a 10th season as Gophers football coach in this model? Well, he has a massive buyout, so any move would be very expensive. Coyle thinks highly of Fleck and the job he is doing, even if the coach has done more to raise the floor of the program than the ceiling. And there is a practical reality of “who could do a better job here?” even if fans have visions of an Indiana-esque turnaround.

Go Gophers!!
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He's also clearly raised the ceiling here with 2019, hell even 2021 he won six conference games, he is the best coach we have had in the last 60 years
 

Some guy said:
On what planet has he not raised the ceiling of the program?
He has the only top 10 finish of the last 50 years.
He has HALF of the winning conference seasons since 1974


He hasn’t raised it as much as some have liked, but he certainly raised it.
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Of course dildo phil disagrees with you
 







gopherbadgerman said:
Bob needed to go more than Frost IMO
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I had to think about this one. A couple weeks ago I felt that the women's team was stagnate. They lost the Pohl sisters to Wisconsin for unknown reasons and couldn't help but think that something is going on there. Then I think about Bob's situation. They too have been stagnated. Both teams have had their good games, but the consistency wasn't there. Both needed basically to leave at the same time. But yes gopherbadgerman, it could go both ways.
 





#2Gopher said:
I had to think about this one. A couple weeks ago I felt that the women's team was stagnate. They lost the Pohl sisters to Wisconsin for unknown reasons and couldn't help but think that something is going on there. Then I think about Bob's situation. They too have been stagnated. Both teams have had their good games, but the consistency wasn't there. Both needed basically to leave at the same time. But yes gopherbadgerman, it could go both ways.
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Which parent do the Pohl sisters get their skating skills from, particularly their speed?

That answer will greatly influence my level of disappointment.
 

#2Gopher said:
I had to think about this one. A couple weeks ago I felt that the women's team was stagnate. They lost the Pohl sisters to Wisconsin for unknown reasons and couldn't help but think that something is going on there. Then I think about Bob's situation. They too have been stagnated. Both teams have had their good games, but the consistency wasn't there. Both needed basically to leave at the same time. But yes gopherbadgerman, it could go both ways.
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Fair enough. You are probably right both teams are stagnant, although the Men's team was pretty embarrassing while the women's team still had a pretty good year. Not great by any means but still pretty good.
 



gopherbadgerman said:
Fair enough. You are probably right both teams are stagnant, although the Men's team was pretty embarrassing while the women's team still had a pretty good year. Not great by any means but still pretty good.
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Frost had the Gardenhire problem. A modest level of sustained success paired with a feeling of stagnation that had fans feeling like we were never going to get over the hump (the big difference is Frost has been to the top of the mountain, and I think I weigh that more heavily than many on here). It is tough to argue that it felt we were stuck a notch below OSU and Wisconsin, and the more years we were there, the tougher it gets to have faith we'd get back to the top. For Frost, im in the camp that disagrees with the firing, but i dont think it was indefensible and im not outraged by it. Firing a coach in "good by not great" territory is always risky. Time will tell whether this was a good move or bad move, and there is a lot more room to go down than up.
 

MaxyJR1 said:
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In fairness to Coyle, invisibility is still a better look than his press conference debacle when he fired Whalen. Nice to have an AD who is embarrassingly absent, but also so ineloquent that his absence is better than the alternative.
 

bleedsmaroonandgold said:
Frost had the Gardenhire problem. A modest level of sustained success paired with a feeling of stagnation that had fans feeling like we were never going to get over the hump (the big difference is Frost has been to the top of the mountain, and I think I weigh that more heavily than many on here). It is tough to argue that it felt we were stuck a notch below OSU and Wisconsin, and the more years we were there, the tougher it gets to have faith we'd get back to the top. For Frost, im in the camp that disagrees with the firing, but i dont think it was indefensible and im not outraged by it. Firing a coach in "good by not great" territory is always risky. Time will tell whether this was a good move or bad move, and there is a lot more room to go down than up.
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I think Frost had more of a John Cooper problem.

If you remember Cooper, he had a sterling record at Ohio State. He had only 1 problem, he couldn't beat Michigan. He was 2-10-1 against the Wolverines. His 3-8 bowl record also was part of his downfall.
 


The Deliberate Stranger said:
Of course dildo phil disagrees with you
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No no no TDS, you misread the meaning of the laughing emoji. It was as close as they had to an emoji signifying excitement over whether to buy tickets to the Quick Lane, Pinstripe or Mayo bowl. I gotta tell you, I am all in on another season of challenging for 7th in the B1G and having Iowa beat our ass into submission. Just getting the popcorn ready for the offensive wonder of 1 yard and a cloud of dust that is PJ Fleck Football. Let me tell you the talent we have in Drake Lindsay will not go to waste this year. He won't be allowed to throw more than 10 yards down the field but he is going to get ample opportunity to turn and hand it off to whatever RB is willing to duck his head and get his ass handed to him by defenses that know damn well what's coming at them. Now we have to be fair, that may change from week to week given that they will no doubt run straight into linebackers knowing with 90% certainty what hole they will be hitting and the fact that modern day college football is subject to the concussion protocol, but Sir, you can count me among the converted.
 
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Torres9 said:
What? Beyond the PJ point is this not the exact opposite of Coyle. Define late? Johnson and Whalen were an obvious mess a year before either left. I like Bob, but he just had the worst season of any coach since 1972. How on earth is that in any way proactive?
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And Lucia? was that a year too early, as well?
 

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