Buffs - Coach Prime

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Some guy said:
There is no labor cost. There is no labor.

There is NIL cost. It would be incorrect to call players labor. If they did it may even cost them a court case.
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Not calling the athletes "labor" is legal semantics and nothing more. It's undeniable that there is now a meaningful cost to attracting a player to a school and keeping them there (beyond the scholarship) that did not exist 5 years ago, and it's creating an even larger chasm between the haves and have-nots. Sure, call athletes independent contractors as they're legally defined, but that doesn't dismiss the fact that the cost of retaining their services is real and growing. Even if that cost is borne by an outside entity like a NIL collective, does it really matter how it's defined if a school continually loses talent to the highest bidder? I'm sure coaches don't give a shit what the government and lawyers call the athletes they're losing to other programs, many just know they're at a decided disadvantage in a battle they're never going to win because they don't have the resources to compete.
 

If the players are considered independent contractors for their NIL payments (a joke, really considering the tenets of the financial arrangements and requirements would get any other “employer” in very hot water - but then again who’s enforcing this anymore) that saves the schools a significant number in tax dollars. Look away.
 

They’re spending over 13mil on coaches for that result. Deion’s salary was (prior to sitake reported raise) 2.5 mil higher than anyone else in conference.

No they absolutely didn’t need to pay that to get someone who’s a combined 16-21 and finished last or near it in 2 of his 3 seasons in conference
 

WindyCityGopher said:
Not calling the athletes "labor" is legal semantics and nothing more. It's undeniable that there is now a meaningful cost to attracting a player to a school and keeping them there (beyond the scholarship) that did not exist 5 years ago, and it's creating an even larger chasm between the haves and have-nots. Sure, call athletes independent contractors as they're legally defined, but that doesn't dismiss the fact that the cost of retaining their services is real and growing. Even if that cost is borne by an outside entity like a NIL collective, does it really matter how it's defined if a school continually loses talent to the highest bidder? I'm sure coaches don't give a shit what the government and lawyers call the athletes they're losing to other programs, many just know they're at a decided disadvantage in a battle they're never going to win because they don't have the resources to compete.
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It’s literally not semantics.
By them not being employees they avoid a number of costs that are associated with them being labor
 






GoldRush said:
16-21 overall, 9-18 conference.
Are the Deion guys still saying this was a great hire?
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Considering he inherited a 1-11 team, and finished first in his conference in his 2nd year, I'd say he's doing alright. The shine has definitely come off though, and that first place season was probably the peak of what Colorado can be.
 



skauma said:
Considering he inherited a 1-11 team, and finished first in his conference in his 2nd year, I'd say he's doing alright. The shine has definitely come off though, and that first place season was probably the peak of what Colorado can be.
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3-9 last season
 

I was always wondering how Deion would do without his son and Travis Hunter. Could they remain competitive and make a bowl game? It appeared that he was bringing in good talent so to follow up with a 3-9 season has to be disappointing for the fans.
 


skauma said:
Considering he inherited a 1-11 team, and finished first in his conference in his 2nd year, I'd say he's doing alright. The shine has definitely come off though, and that first place season was probably the peak of what Colorado can be.
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I don't think it's what the peak of Colorado can be, I think it's what the peak of what Deion can be. He's unqualified from a coaching ability and team and staff management perspective.
 



mngg11 said:
I don't think it's what the peak of Colorado can be, I think it's what the peak of what Deion can be. He's unqualified from a coaching ability and team and staff management perspective.
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Exactly, I’ve heard him say he doesn’t believe in redshirting. Not sure if they literally don’t use redshirts, but crazy if true. Also I’ve seen him take the ball first in overtime which is just coaching malpractice. Zero chance he would have gotten a job of this caliber based solely on his coaching resume. I don’t think he’s elevated the program outside of a lucky season where he had a talented son at the most important position, and it wasn’t anything special that Colorado hasn’t seen before.
 

btowngopher said:
Exactly, I’ve heard him say he doesn’t believe in redshirting. Not sure if they literally don’t use redshirts, but crazy if true. Also I’ve seen him take the ball first in overtime which is just coaching malpractice. Zero chance he would have gotten a job of this caliber based solely on his coaching resume. I don’t think he’s elevated the program outside of a lucky season where he had a talented son at the most important position, and it wasn’t anything special that Colorado hasn’t seen before.
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I mostly agree. However if the game ended with the opponent's defense having been on the field for a long time, and they are totally gassed, I say make them get back out there and continue to gash them.
 

upnorthkid said:
No they absolutely didn’t need to pay that to get someone who’s a combined 16-21 and finished last or near it in 2 of his 3 seasons in conference
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Really? How many of those wins would another coach have gotten without Shadeur and Travis Hunter?

I'd doubt they have 8 wins over the past 3 years with Sanders coming to town.
 

GopherTheJugular said:
Really? How many of those wins would another coach have gotten without Shadeur and Travis Hunter?

I'd doubt they have 8 wins over the past 3 years with Sanders coming to town.
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he was signed for 5 years, 29.5 at his initial contract (almost 6mil AAV). He was extended prior to last season (which was arguably the dumbest possible time to extend him when you knew he was losing his golden geese, aka the kids you mention) for 5 years 54mil (almost 11mil AAV and double his prior) to be the highest paid, comfortably, in conference. They would've already had those wins and had him under contract. It's just terrible business from their now out the door AD (new AD started in December).

So no, they didn't need to give him that new contract, especially at that price. His buyout is like 30mil at this point.

Interestingly enough, it's still a P4 job and Deion has won 16 games for an average of 5.3 games a season (11 against P4 teams, 4 against teams who finished with a winning record) and a 16-21 overall (.432). They've hired terribly, but Dorrell was .347, MacIntyre was .405 (with one random winning season he went 10-4). Nothing has shown they've become something more and certainly not a guy I'd say should be paid in the top 15 nationally.

It's kind of like hiring after Brewster. Just because that was a god awful hire doesn't make Kill a great one.
 


GopherTheJugular said:
My mistake, I thought the discussion was about getting him to Colorado, not the extension. I agree with your post.
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yeah the original him coming I had no problem with either. didn't think it was likely to work out long term, but can see why they took a swing at it
 

They took a chance on each other. Don't see a big problem there. Going forward?

Either way, Colorado is most likely in a slightly better place for the next coach.

Regarding Coach Sanders, he paved the way for IU. Coach Cignetti managed his roster the same way with little to no pushback. Takes more than "Johnnies and Joes", but getting bunch of Johnnies and Joes in a short amount of time can help turn a program around in a hurry.
 

skauma said:
Considering he inherited a 1-11 team, and finished first in his conference in his 2nd year, I'd say he's doing alright. The shine has definitely come off though, and that first place season was probably the peak of what Colorado can be.
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IMO, he’s done about the bare minimum you’d expect out of him at Colorado. When you consider his name/fame alone brought in a lot of talent (including his son), the results have to be pretty disappointing.
 



Weren't IU's Johnnies and Joe's ranked more comparable to ours than the teams they were beating in the CFP?
STPGopher said:
They took a chance on each other. Don't see a big problem there. Going forward?

Either way, Colorado is most likely in a slightly better place for the next coach.

Regarding Coach Sanders, he paved the way for IU. Coach Cignetti managed his roster the same way with little to no pushback. Takes more than "Johnnies and Joes", but getting bunch of Johnnies and Joes in a short amount of time can help turn a program around in a hurry.
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bleedsmaroonandgold said:
Weren't IU's Johnnies and Joe's ranked more comparable to ours than the teams they were beating in the CFP?
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It's hard to really compare them because they went so heavy in the portal but yeah, you're probably right.

8/11 starters on defense were transfers.
Heisman winning QB was a transfer
Both RBs
3 OL
TE
2 WR

That's not taking anything away from Cignetti. Maybe it's something we should consider and I don't believe it was just lightening in a bottle either (they were really good with O'Rourke at QB too).
 


upnorthkid said:
Their qb is about to go #1 overall, regardless of what he was ranked
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They also had two WRs that are ranked top ten at that position for this draft and another one that looks destined for something similar based on his tournament play.
 

STPGopher said:
They took a chance on each other. Don't see a big problem there. Going forward?

Either way, Colorado is most likely in a slightly better place for the next coach.

Regarding Coach Sanders, he paved the way for IU. Coach Cignetti managed his roster the same way with little to no pushback. Takes more than "Johnnies and Joes", but getting bunch of Johnnies and Joes in a short amount of time can help turn a program around in a hurry.
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I don’t think he paved the way for IU at all. I don’t recall Cignetti publicly pushing out players and going for wholesale roster churn. Sanders took 50 plus tranfers his first year and again last year and 40 plus his third year. Cig only took 31 his first year and has take less with each year after. I’m guessing pretty much every coach will have 30+ incoming transfers their first year, that’s just a result of current transfer rules.
 

btowngopher said:
I don’t think he paved the way for IU at all. I don’t recall Cignetti publicly pushing out players and going for wholesale roster churn. Sanders took 50 plus tranfers his first year and again last year and 40 plus his third year. Cig only took 31 his first year and has take less with each year after. I’m guessing pretty much every coach will have 30+ incoming transfers their first year, that’s just a result of current transfer rules.
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Sorry Curt.
 

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