Why are coaches leaving Wisconsin? - From ESPN

[Iceland12]

But there are certainly cons that come with the Wisconsin job, from a shallower recruiting pool in its backyard to high academic standards that can potentially trim its options to fill out the roster. But those didn't stop Andersen or Bielema from winning games, competing for championships or heading to prestigious postseason bowls. The issues in retaining those two coaches appear to be things Wisconsin actually has some control over and could change.


Is there really no room for flexibility in terms of getting in a few more recruits who might not have traditionally qualified? There's nothing wrong with a program rigorously holding itself to tough academic standards, but that makes it tougher to put together the best possible team and to possibly keep coaches who could more easily craft a squad in their image elsewhere.


Why doesn't Wisconsin have an assistant ranked higher than No. 77 in the nation in annual salary, according to the most recent USA Today database? There's no cap on spending for coaches, which makes it the one commodity in which schools with title aspirations should never get thrifty. How can Wisconsin expect to keep a coaching staff together if it doesn't rank any higher than No. 9 in the league in combined compensation for assistant coaches, behind the likes of Maryland, Rutgers and even rival Minnesota? Bielema had already railed against the lack of financial support to keep his assistants around when he left to take over the Razorbacks.


So what else is there? Perhaps the problem is with the boss, with Alvarez looming over a program he led for so many years. Given that he was able to win at a high level despite some of those limitations, might he or the athletic department be unwilling to make concessions that the game has truly changed since Alvarez was on the sideline? That question might be more difficult to answer and even more challenging to fix, given Alvarez's iconic stature with Wisconsin.

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/112603/why-are-coaches-leaving-wisconsin

 

[Gopher028]

I'd hate to be that guy.....but I think what might help us retain Coach Kill in a big way, is his very public and on the field health issues.
Things like that could and would scare most schools from the risk of it reoccurring and likely would deter them from hiring him away
from us, because if Becky could lose Bret Enema and Gary Andersen to Arkansas and Ore St, then we could lose Kill to ***** school.

Thankfully, Kill seems to really have his epilepsy under control and has done a FANTASTIC job this season and will in seasons to come.

 

[EG#9]

I have a hard time believing it's any tougher to get kids in to Wisconsin than in to the vast majority of B1G schools. Assistant pay is almost certainly a long term issue, but I think it would be less of one for a coach coming in from Utah State whose assistants just got a big raise 2 years ago in coming to the B1G.

 

[AF_Howie_2180]

Having to work with MicroManager Barry Alvarez is probably the main reason everyone is jumping ship....Can you imagine working in an enviroment where the AD pretty much trys to still be the coach from the AD's office. Removing Barry and I imagine things run far smoother in Buckytown

 

[414GopherFan]

I have a hard time believing it's any tougher to get kids in to Wisconsin than in to the vast majority of B1G schools. Assistant pay is almost certainly a long term issue, but I think it would be less of one for a coach coming in from Utah State whose assistants just got a big raise 2 years ago in coming to the B1G.

I obviously dont know for sure why Coach A left. I do know for sure that there was 5-7 kids I can name off the top of my head that he wanted and couldnt get them through admissions. The Bizarre part is there kids that both Bielema & the Alvarez regime were able to get admitted.

 

[disco]

I don't know how it is now, but I know 20 years ago, it was much tougher to get into the UW system at any of the schools than it was to get into any of the U of M or MnSCU schools. I remember classmates having to take entrance tests that didn't exist here, even to go to River Falls or Stout.

 

[Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0]

But there are certainly cons that come with the Wisconsin job, from a shallower recruiting pool in its backyard to high academic standards that can potentially trim its options to fill out the roster. But those didn't stop Andersen or Bielema from winning games, competing for championships or heading to prestigious postseason bowls. The issues in retaining those two coaches appear to be things Wisconsin actually has some control over and could change.


Is there really no room for flexibility in terms of getting in a few more recruits who might not have traditionally qualified? There's nothing wrong with a program rigorously holding itself to tough academic standards, but that makes it tougher to put together the best possible team and to possibly keep coaches who could more easily craft a squad in their image elsewhere.


Why doesn't Wisconsin have an assistant ranked higher than No. 77 in the nation in annual salary, according to the most recent USA Today database? There's no cap on spending for coaches, which makes it the one commodity in which schools with title aspirations should never get thrifty. How can Wisconsin expect to keep a coaching staff together if it doesn't rank any higher than No. 9 in the league in combined compensation for assistant coaches, behind the likes of Maryland, Rutgers and even rival Minnesota? Bielema had already railed against the lack of financial support to keep his assistants around when he left to take over the Razorbacks.


So what else is there? Perhaps the problem is with the boss, with Alvarez looming over a program he led for so many years. Given that he was able to win at a high level despite some of those limitations, might he or the athletic department be unwilling to make concessions that the game has truly changed since Alvarez was on the sideline? That question might be more difficult to answer and even more challenging to fix, given Alvarez's iconic stature with Wisconsin.

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/112603/why-are-coaches-leaving-wisconsin

Bingo!!!

 

[Seany]

Obviously the shadow (and ego) of Barry looms very large over Wisconsin football, and maybe that weighs on coaches, as I would imagine that must make it all the more difficult to put your own imprint upon a program and establish a team and an identity as you see fit to establish it. To me it would beg the question, whose team really is this, Barry's or mine?

Barry Alvarez and Wisconsin football reminds me in many ways of Jerry Jones specter hanging over the Dallas Cowboys, as in he's always there, always micro-managing everything, and you can't get away from him, and good coaches with an independent streak ala Jimmy Johnson and Bill Parcells tend to chafe very hard against that.

 

[AF_Howie_2180]

Obviously the shadow (and ego) of Barry looms very large over Wisconsin football, and maybe that weighs on coaches, as I would imagine that must make it all the more difficult to put your own imprint upon a program and establish a team and an identity as you see fit to establish it. To me it would beg the question, whose team really is this, Barry's or mine?

Barry Alvarez and Wisconsin football reminds me in many ways of Jerry Jones specter hanging over the Dallas Cowboys, as in he's always there, always micro-managing everything, and you can't get away from him, and good coaches with an independent streak ala Jimmy Johnson and Bill Parcells tend to chafe very hard against that.

I have heard and had this same discussion with a couple of my Badger friends from my time UW Eau Claire....They say the same things about the program

 

[MDGopherFan]

But there are certainly cons that come with the Wisconsin job, from a shallower recruiting pool in its backyard to high academic standards that can potentially trim its options to fill out the roster. But those didn't stop Andersen or Bielema from winning games, competing for championships or heading to prestigious postseason bowls. The issues in retaining those two coaches appear to be things Wisconsin actually has some control over and could change.


Is there really no room for flexibility in terms of getting in a few more recruits who might not have traditionally qualified? There's nothing wrong with a program rigorously holding itself to tough academic standards, but that makes it tougher to put together the best possible team and to possibly keep coaches who could more easily craft a squad in their image elsewhere.


Why doesn't Wisconsin have an assistant ranked higher than No. 77 in the nation in annual salary, according to the most recent USA Today database? There's no cap on spending for coaches, which makes it the one commodity in which schools with title aspirations should never get thrifty. How can Wisconsin expect to keep a coaching staff together if it doesn't rank any higher than No. 9 in the league in combined compensation for assistant coaches, behind the likes of Maryland, Rutgers and even rival Minnesota? Bielema had already railed against the lack of financial support to keep his assistants around when he left to take over the Razorbacks.


So what else is there? Perhaps the problem is with the boss, with Alvarez looming over a program he led for so many years. Given that he was able to win at a high level despite some of those limitations, might he or the athletic department be unwilling to make concessions that the game has truly changed since Alvarez was on the sideline? That question might be more difficult to answer and even more challenging to fix, given Alvarez's iconic stature with Wisconsin.

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/112603/why-are-coaches-leaving-wisconsin

The entire argument of let's dumb down our academic standards to allow us to recruit players is the most asinine argument ever from my perspective. Perhaps these academic requirements at some of our BIG schools should be applied across the country and young kids and high schoolers will realize that if they want to play college ball they need to care about their academics rather than banking on getting in through relaxed academic requirements for them. Sorry for waxing philosophical but I always grumble when people make that argument.

 

[year of the gopher]

The entire argument of let's dumb down our academic standards to allow us to recruit players is the most asinine argument ever from my perspective. Perhaps these academic requirements at some of our BIG schools should be applied across the country and young kids and high schoolers will realize that if they want to play college ball they need to care about their academics rather than banking on getting in through relaxed academic requirements for them. Sorry for waxing philosophical but I always grumble when people make that argument.

Ok but I call BS on the argument that Wisconsin has harder academic standards than other schools for athletes. First the overall student body profile is roughly the same as Minnesota. All schools make exceptions for athletes to an extent. Hell, Ron Dayne got in.

 

[MDGopherFan]

Ok but I call BS on the argument that Wisconsin has harder academic standards than other schools for athletes. First the overall student body profile is roughly the same as Minnesota. All schools make exceptions for athletes to an extent. Hell, Ron Dayne got in.

I didnt state that Wisconsin has higher standards, so I will assume your point is towards some general assumption or in response to others

 

[year of the gopher]

I didnt state that Wisconsin has higher standards, so I will assume your point is towards some general assumption or in response to others

It was, yes, sorry I should have clarified that.

 

[gopher7]

Wisconsin has had a lot of players drafted the last 5 years (almost as many as Ohio State) so I doubt that admission standards are driving the coaches away.

When Bielema left it was rumored that assistant coaching salaries were a big part of the reason, so I doubt that Anderson would take the job right after him and then leave two years later for the same reason.

 

[Gopherdrummer]

The argument that "there is no cap on coaching salaries, so you shouldn't get thrifty there" is absolutely absurd. Of course there is a cap on coaching salaries. It is called managing your expenses so you can still operate an effective business. You can't just keep throwing money out the window, even in college sports. That is how Athletic Departments implode and the people writing the check will be taxpayers (for public institutions) and the student body.

How is this hard to understand? Alabama contends for National titles almost every year. They have the boosters lined to continuously provide donations in order to pay the coaches' salaries. Ticket prices and donation levels are increased in order to pay for expenses (see the U as of last week). Perhaps Barry Alvarez needs to raise his donation levels to keep up.

Or the bottom line is, Barry Alvarez is probably not a great guy to work for. UW fans hold him in high regard and he had some terrible seasons, and quite a few losing seasons. He is probably the guy that micromanages the crap out of everything, and it never really is your program if you work there. At the end of the day, you have to think about your career and if your boss puts you in the best position to succeed.

 

[SelectionSunday]

I get a hoot out of how some of the talking heads (looking at you Gerry DiNardo) are turning this into an UW "academic standards" thing. Give me a break. You'd think Wisconsin was right up there academically with Northwestern, Stanford, Harvard, and Yale listening to DiNardo's blabbering last night on the BTN.

 

[atsgopher]

The entire argument of let's dumb down our academic standards to allow us to recruit players is the most asinine argument ever from my perspective. Perhaps these academic requirements at some of our BIG schools should be applied across the country and young kids and high schoolers will realize that if they want to play college ball they need to care about their academics rather than banking on getting in through relaxed academic requirements for them. Sorry for waxing philosophical but I always grumble when people make that argument.

+1, it's a goofy argument. So is the assistant coaches argument. How can they sit and whine about that for a team that has been more than solid for the past 20 years. If anything it makes the cheese chasers appear better, as their success is despite poorly paid assistants. Moreover, 1 coach left after 2 years. Butt face had 7 years there.... It seems the're equivocating with that concept. Wisconsin had 2 coaches leave in 9 years, or another new coach after 2 years. However, to state 2 coaches in 2 years is far more grave. It implies a trend, instead of what just could ultimately be Gary Anderson not fitting well.

I think the job is a coaches dream. Look at the last 2 coaches. All you gotta do for a good payday, is go in a recruit, while listening to what BA dictates. At The end is national recognition, a shot at a power 5 conference title. You can parlay that into a job elsewhere. Why not throw your hat in the ring?

 

[badgerdoc]

Having to work with MicroManager Barry Alvarez is probably the main reason everyone is jumping ship....Can you imagine working in an enviroment where the AD pretty much trys to still be the coach from the AD's office. Removing Barry and I imagine things run far smoother in Buckytown

Run far smoother than what exactly? 3 Big Ten title games in 4 years with 2 championships? Multiyear streak of January 1st bowl games? Final Four MBB appearance?

People are making too much of a very simple situation.

Bielema wanted to spread his wings and move to a better conference. ( I was happy to see him go. He was a true tool)

Andersen didn't feel comfortable in Madison. (Seems like a nice guy who had major communication issues with the media and the players).

That being said, the next Badger football coach hire is huge for the program. Definitely in danger of a big slide. I would feel much more comfortable if we had JK in Madison.

 

[Vandy]

Academic Standards

The entire argument of let's dumb down our academic standards to allow us to recruit players is the most asinine argument ever from my perspective. Perhaps these academic requirements at some of our BIG schools should be applied across the country and young kids and high schoolers will realize that if they want to play college ball they need to care about their academics rather than banking on getting in through relaxed academic requirements for them. Sorry for waxing philosophical but I always grumble when people make that argument.

YES. I have thought this same thing for quite a while... equal playing field as far as academic and entrance standards. There is no doubt that B1G schools are behind the 8 ball vs the standards of other conferences. Locally, it is the reason some really good athletes have gone to NDSU and had success.... B1G schools like MN left them alone because there was no way in H*** that they were getting in here.

 

[Winnipegopher]

Personally, I wish Andersen stayed. I really think he had the potential to trend Wisconsin back to mediocrity once Bielema recruits cycled through. I have a bad feeling Barry will make a better hire this time.

 

[Governor Sibley]

Anderson was 13-3 in the conference.

I'm happy rolling the dice with another hire.

 

[FireDaveLee]

Anderson was 13-3 in the conference.

I'm happy rolling the dice with another hire.

Larry Coker was 35-3 with a national title, could have easily had another, & another BCS bowl victory.

I'm not sayin'...I'm just sayin'

 

[fryguy22]

Even if the next coach is a similar or slightly better hire, 2 instances of turnover in 3 years obviously hurts momentum, recruiting, etc.

The important thing to remember is we aren't the 2010 Gophers. We don't need Wisconsin to crumble to pass them, hell we may not even need them to get worse - just stagnate. They can have an 8-4 season every year for all I care as long as we win 9+ and the axe.

 

[BarnBoy]

The argument that "there is no cap on coaching salaries, so you shouldn't get thrifty there" is absolutely absurd. Of course there is a cap on coaching salaries. It is called managing your expenses so you can still operate an effective business. You can't just keep throwing money out the window, even in college sports.

The line between "some of the lowest paid assistants" and "throwing money out the window" is not a fine one.

 

[watertown 1987 guy n]

I'd hate to be that guy.....but I think what might help us retain Coach Kill in a big way, is his very public and on the field health issues.
Things like that could and would scare most schools from the risk of it reoccurring and likely would deter them from hiring him away
from us, because if Becky could lose Bret Enema and Gary Andersen to Arkansas and Ore St, then we could lose Kill to ***** school.

Thankfully, Kill seems to really have his epilepsy under control and has done a FANTASTIC job this season and will in seasons to come.

Yes, you are now that guy and incorrect. There are 30 or more college programs in the U.S. that JK & assistants could move to and get the same comp as MN regardless of health. If he were to move on it would be because he feels unappreciated and not having the support of the administration to build a competitive program long term.

 

[Spoofin]

Yes, you are now that guy and incorrect. There are 30 or more college programs in the U.S. that JK & assistants could move to and get the same comp as MN regardless of health. If he were to move on it would be because he feels unappreciated and not having the support of the administration to build a competitive program long term.

Every bit of what you posted is speculation. That is 100% fine on a message board, IMO, but let's call a spade a spade.

 

[Lakeville Goldy]

I thought Coach Andersen's official statement that thanked "Coach Alvarez" rather than "AD Alvarez" was fairly telling. It's not like he ever was an assistant or player under Barry. I doubt Andersen even knew Alvarez before becoming AD. I don't think that was an accident - I think it was a shot at Barry.

Andersen said he moved because of "his family". I'd be curious to know what family since he grew up in Utah and lived most of his life there. Not that he couldn't have family in the area, just smells a little fishy at first blush.

 

[justthefacts]

http://30mileradius.com/2014/12/speculating-on-wisconsins-admissions-question/

 

[Iceland12]

http://30mileradius.com/2014/12/speculating-on-wisconsins-admissions-question/

The author found one guy who couldn't get in and came to the conclusion that Anderson left because Wisconsin's admission standards would never let him win there despite his record to the contrary.

Pure bullshat, but on a day where we've started another thread full of posters who weren't there telling us what happened in Mankato, can't castigate him for it.

<img id="ums_img_tooltip" class="UMSRatingIcon">

 

[WAGopher]

There are only 2 differences between the U and UW:
1. Wisconsin does require one additional year of a language over Minnesota.
2. Wisconsin requires 2 years of additional academic or arts classes. This either or, so an applicant can have 2 years of academics and no arts. Minnesota requires one additional year of arts.