Which Players on the Gophers would have been out of reach for Jerry Kill at NIU?

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EE_Gopher

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Okay, it’s May. So I’m bored at work and have time for this kind of stuff. In this, I’m kind of assuming the the U doesn’t exist. In this way, if a players only BCS offer was Minnesota, they are in reach of Jerry Kill at Northern Illinois. An exception is for those in stater’s who really wanted to go to the U and committed early. There are some who had maybe one other BCS offer which I thought probably still could have ended up in the MAC.

2009
Ra’shede Hageman
Ed Olson – (Early Commit)

2010
Lamonte Edwards
Donnell Kirkwood
James Manuel

2011
Michael Amaefula
Tommy Olson – (Early Commit)

2012
Andre McDonald
Philip Nelson – (Early Commit)
Jamel Harbison
Martez Shabazz
Isaac Hayes
Nick Rallis – (Early Commit)
Maxx Williams – (Early Commit)

Note that I left off Josh Campion. If Minnesota wasn’t available, one has no idea where he would have ended up.

The list is much shorter than I would have thought. It is interesting to note that players like Zac Epping, Ed Olson, Marek Lenkiewicz, Drew Goodger, Marcus Jones, etc… were recruited by Northern Illinois and it is easy to see how each of them could have been playing there today. Also, the list does show the importance of instate recruiting not only by who is on this list, but who is not on it. Note the walk-ons such as Caleb Bak, Jon Christenson, Derrick Engel. Likewise, give Kill credit for those who he found such as Derrick Wells.

Okay, I put this out here. I assume I’ll get ripped, but hey! It’s Friday!
 

Well we would have one hell of a MAC program, but I get the impression that we need to get an upgrade in talent. It's nice to have some diamonds in the rough, but that can't be your only formula in a power six conference. Need to upgrade the talent and coach it up, not one or the other.
But I guess the trick is do you have to win to get the talent or do you have to get the talent to win? The million dollar question.
 

Kill and LImegrover have talked about daydreaming about Marquies Gray, though he was out of their reach - but I spose he was in the year before the 2009 where you started.
 

EE_Gopher said:
Okay, it’s May. So I’m bored at work and have time for this kind of stuff. In this, I’m kind of assuming the the U doesn’t exist. In this way, if a players only BCS offer was Minnesota, they are in reach of Jerry Kill at Northern Illinois. An exception is for those in stater’s who really wanted to go to the U and committed early. There are some who had maybe one other BCS offer which I thought probably still could have ended up in the MAC.

2009
Ra’shede Hageman
Ed Olson – (Early Commit)

2010
Lamonte Edwards
Donnell Kirkwood
James Manuel

2011
Michael Amaefula
Tommy Olson – (Early Commit)

2012
Andre McDonald
Philip Nelson – (Early Commit)
Jamel Harbison
Martez Shabazz
Isaac Hayes
Nick Rallis – (Early Commit)
Maxx Williams – (Early Commit)

Note that I left off Josh Campion. If Minnesota wasn’t available, one has no idea where he would have ended up.

The list is much shorter than I would have thought. It is interesting to note that players like Zac Epping, Ed Olson, Marek Lenkiewicz, Drew Goodger, Marcus Jones, etc… were recruited by Northern Illinois and it is easy to see how each of them could have been playing there today. Also, the list does show the importance of instate recruiting not only by who is on this list, but who is not on it. Note the walk-ons such as Caleb Bak, Jon Christenson, Derrick Engel. Likewise, give Kill credit for those who he found such as Derrick Wells.

Okay, I put this out here. I assume I’ll get ripped, but hey! It’s Friday!
Click to expand...

I don't understand what you are trying to say. Other than Eric Jacques and MAYBE Nick Rengel, there was nobody in the 2009 class that Jerry Kill would have had a shot at. All of the other guys were going somewhere better than the MAC.

For 2010, it's extremely unlikely that Kill could have landed Lenkiewicz given that he had a Colorado State offer, was offered by the almost all of the MAC, and committed to Minnesota in July. It's pretty easy to see that he was going somewhere. There zero chance Ed Olson ended up in the MAC, same goes for Devon Wright, and Brock Vereen. There's also multiple guys who would not have been available to Northern Illinois who are no longer at Minnesota due to transfer, injury, etc.


For 2011, you missed Crawford-Tufts, the McAvoy twins, probably Max Shortell, Peter Westerhaus...
 

I meant to have Crawford-Tufts on my list. Somehow left it off. I didn't put the McAvoy twins or Westerhaus because they haven't played. On Lenkiewicz and Epping who were both recruited by Northern Illinois, I can see at least one of them ending up there.
 


I'll add...

2012:
- Jordan Hinojosa had offers from Michigan State, Wake Forest, and West Virginia coming out of Miami Central and offers from Penn State and (I think) Miami coming from Coffeyville CC.
- Roland Johnson had an offer from Illinois and just about every MAC.
- Kansas said they were going to offer Alex Keith if he didn't commit to Minnesota the weekend he did.
- Jack Lynn committed fairly early and blew up his senior year. He also had offers from just about every MAC.
- KJ Maye had an offer from Kentucky. He also had offers from almost all the Sunbelt teams which may have been more appealing than NIU given that he's from the South.
- Timms had an offer from Syracuse. He also had several Sunbelt/Conf. USA offers (he's from Florida).
- Rodrick Williams had an offer from Utah and picked up a late offer from Iowa.
 

I don't get this thread. . .

Are you asking which players on our roster wouldn't have gone to Northern Illinois out of HS? Like who as recruits were out of reach for Kill at Northern Illinois. . .

The answer. . .almost all of them.
 

Bob_Loblaw

Bob_Loblaw said:
I don't get this thread. . .

Are you asking which players on our roster wouldn't have gone to Northern Illinois out of HS? Like who as recruits were out of reach for Kill at Northern Illinois. . .

The answer. . .almost all of them.
Click to expand...

I will trust your judgement on your answer to this question but I would love to know why EE_Gopher asked the question. I don't know what his intention is but there are some peoples here who have questioned whether Kill can recruit at this level. For others the question is more will he be able to recruit players capable of taking Minnesota to the next level, i.e. competing for championships.

We all have our opinions as to the answer to these two questions. I expect you have yours and I have mine. It would be great to have a rational discussion on this topic but I am worried it would turn into a Mason type discussion. We do know a great deal about Kill and his staff now and how they plan to turn this program around. I would be curious to hear what other people think the answer is to these two questions and why they feel that way. Hopefully, this would be a civil discussion with few references to Mason an Brewster.
 

Perhaps we could figure this out if we knew how many B1G wins Northern...

EE_Gopher said:
Okay, it’s May. So I’m bored at work and have time for this kind of stuff. In this, I’m kind of assuming the the U doesn’t exist. In this way, if a players only BCS offer was Minnesota, they are in reach of Jerry Kill at Northern Illinois. An exception is for those in stater’s who really wanted to go to the U and committed early. There are some who had maybe one other BCS offer which I thought probably still could have ended up in the MAC.

2009
Ra’shede Hageman
Ed Olson – (Early Commit)

2010
Lamonte Edwards
Donnell Kirkwood
James Manuel

2011
Michael Amaefula
Tommy Olson – (Early Commit)

2012
Andre McDonald
Philip Nelson – (Early Commit)
Jamel Harbison
Martez Shabazz
Isaac Hayes
Nick Rallis – (Early Commit)
Maxx Williams – (Early Commit)

Note that I left off Josh Campion. If Minnesota wasn’t available, one has no idea where he would have ended up.

The list is much shorter than I would have thought. It is interesting to note that players like Zac Epping, Ed Olson, Marek Lenkiewicz, Drew Goodger, Marcus Jones, etc… were recruited by Northern Illinois and it is easy to see how each of them could have been playing there today. Also, the list does show the importance of instate recruiting not only by who is on this list, but who is not on it. Note the walk-ons such as Caleb Bak, Jon Christenson, Derrick Engel. Likewise, give Kill credit for those who he found such as Derrick Wells.

Okay, I put this out here. I assume I’ll get ripped, but hey! It’s Friday!
Click to expand...

Illinois recruits would win against B1G opponents. If that answer is one...we know Coach Kill has recruited players he could not have recruited at Northern Illinois. If the answer is two, then the recruiting has been about the same. If the answer is more than two, this season's B1G schedule will tell us if the trend is headed in the right direction.

Three or more B1G wins in the 2013 season would be an indication that in all likelihood, the trend is our friend. One or two B1G wins in 2013 would conversely be somewhat discouraging.

Four or more wins in B1G play would indicate to me that not only is the recruiting level above what Coach Kill could have achieved at Northern, but also he and his staff have "coaching them up...down to a science. The third year in the same system should allow for a very positive "coaching 'em up" factor!

As always, none of the intellectual...or pseudo-intellectual discussions on this recruiting subject will prove anything. the ONLY thing that can give us concrete evidence will be the B1G record....B1G wins vs. B1G losses will tell us exactly where our program stands vs. the other B1G Conference Members, coaches and squads. These numbers take EVERY factor into consideration. They can not be spun. They can not be argued. They will be what they are...no more and no less.

We need at least 3 B1G wins in 2013 to show continued progress. More would be GREAT!

; 0 )
 



Let's keep things in perspective. Turning around small schools and a MAC school is one thing, but against B1G competition that recruits the nations best kids -- that will likely take a little longer. I think next year is the year to focus on.
 

Killjoy said:
I will trust your judgement on your answer to this question but I would love to know why EE_Gopher asked the question. I don't know what his intention is but there are some peoples here who have questioned whether Kill can recruit at this level. For others the question is more will he be able to recruit players capable of taking Minnesota to the next level, i.e. competing for championships.

We all have our opinions as to the answer to these two questions. I expect you have yours and I have mine. It would be great to have a rational discussion on this topic but I am worried it would turn into a Mason type discussion. We do know a great deal about Kill and his staff now and how they plan to turn this program around. I would be curious to hear what other people think the answer is to these two questions and why they feel that way. Hopefully, this would be a civil discussion with few references to Mason an Brewster.
Click to expand...

First of all, I am a big Kill fan. Second, I am an engineer and therefore a little nerdy. I look at the local competition of Iowa and Wisconsin and in their recruiting through the years, don't see a lot of highly ranked recruits. Some yes, but for the most part, they have their share of 2 star recruits and walk-ons. For instance, Micah Hyde was a 2 star and Abreddaris was a walk-on. I therefore, try to make sense of it. Of course, most people are smart enough to keep their ideas to themselves, but heck, this is a Gopher blog... it's supposed to be fun. Amazing the wrath one can take for putting out a poorly written report. (I've learned my lesson.) Wisconsin and Iowa have systems that they recruit to and they work in the Big 10. Kill obviously has a system and we’ll find out if it works in the Big 10. Wisconsin and Iowa recruit well within their border. Minnesota did well in 2012 and I’m hoping it will reap rewards in the coming years.

What I am most excited about the Gophers team is in fact the depth. I remember that South Dakota game where one of Brewster’s excuses was that both his starting safeties were out. Seriously, if we have a game this year where both starting corners and safeties were out, I wouldn’t think all was lost. A Big Ten team should be expected to have several starters that are better than a high level MAC team along with better depth. It isn’t that every starter on the Big Ten team is better than the MAC team, it’s that they have better depth and a couple of stars that the MAC team can’t match up against. For the Gophers, I see this as players like Philip Nelson, Ra’shede Hageman, etc… and for depth, it’s players like Marek Lenkiewicz or Martez Shabazz who if they had gone to NIU, would have been starting.

Go Gophers!
 

EE_Gopher said:
First of all, I am a big Kill fan. Second, I am an engineer and therefore a little nerdy. I look at the local competition of Iowa and Wisconsin and in their recruiting through the years, don't see a lot of highly ranked recruits. Some yes, but for the most part, they have their share of 2 star recruits and walk-ons. For instance, Micah Hyde was a 2 star and Abreddaris was a walk-on. I therefore, try to make sense of it. Of course, most people are smart enough to keep their ideas to themselves, but heck, this is a Gopher blog... it's supposed to be fun. Amazing the wrath one can take for putting out a poorly written report. (I've learned my lesson.) Wisconsin and Iowa have systems that they recruit to and they work in the Big 10. Kill obviously has a system and we’ll find out if it works in the Big 10. Wisconsin and Iowa recruit well within their border. Minnesota did well in 2012 and I’m hoping it will reap rewards in the coming years.

What I am most excited about the Gophers team is in fact the depth. I remember that South Dakota game where one of Brewster’s excuses was that both his starting safeties were out. Seriously, if we have a game this year where both starting corners and safeties were out, I wouldn’t think all was lost. A Big Ten team should be expected to have several starters that are better than a high level MAC team along with better depth. It isn’t that every starter on the Big Ten team is better than the MAC team, it’s that they have better depth and a couple of stars that the MAC team can’t match up against. For the Gophers, I see this as players like Philip Nelson, Ra’shede Hageman, etc… and for depth, it’s players like Marek Lenkiewicz or Martez Shabazz who if they had gone to NIU, would have been starting.

Go Gophers!
Click to expand...

My only issue with the thread is that I really didn't understand the question.

Was it about the caliber of recruits we brought in?
Was it about the development of those recruits (and therefore of current depth)?

In general, a Big 10 team is going to get who they want when competing with a MAC school. However, that's only part of the puzzle. Generally, recruiting ends on NSD. But there are a slew of issues that come about after that day. This is where the player development, roster attrition, etc., come into play. The U, at it's lowest wasn't losing recruits to Northern Illinois at their best. However, it's fairly obvious that over the last 3 years we haven't had a roster as deep/talented as Nothern Illinois.

So out of Northern Illinois's roster, we could probably have had every single one of their players as recruits out of HS. Additionally, I doubt there is a player on our roster who would have chosen Northern Illinois over the U.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
My only issue with the thread is that I really didn't understand the question.

Was it about the caliber of recruits we brought in?
Was it about the development of those recruits (and therefore of current depth)?

In general, a Big 10 team is going to get who they want when competing with a MAC school. However, that's only part of the puzzle. Generally, recruiting ends on NSD. But there are a slew of issues that come about after that day. This is where the player development, roster attrition, etc., come into play. The U, at it's lowest wasn't losing recruits to Northern Illinois at their best. However, it's fairly obvious that over the last 3 years we haven't had a roster as deep/talented as Nothern Illinois.

So out of Northern Illinois's roster, we could probably have had every single one of their players as recruits out of HS. Additionally, I doubt there is a player on our roster who would have chosen Northern Illinois over the U.
Click to expand...
I would agree we would win every recruiting battle. Actually it's interesting Wisconsin did lose one to Northern Illinois. but if Jerry Kill stays at Northern Illinois, there's a reasonable chance that Derrick Wells ends up there among others.
 







Unregistered User said:
Good. Now if they would step in and delete the garbage left here from msphawk in the countdown thread, and then ban his @ss, I would be happy.
Click to expand...

Do your job monitors. It is ridiculous that he is still allowed to post here.
 

Parski1 said:
Depends on the Moderator....last night they were deleting everybody's comments.
Click to expand...

Saturday nights are busy at Admin. I haven't had any deleted for quite awhile, because I have been a good boy.

I agree with comments directed at mpshawk on countdown thread.

I just checked the Countdown Thread, and MplsHawk's comments have crashed and burned. Thank you Mods.

:cool02::cool03::rockon:
 

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