Walz is a Fraud on Covid LockDown

STPGopher

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One of the other Georgia reps....the one who said that Guam might tip over into the ocean....is the problem. Not QAnon MTG. Nope. Righties refuse to speak anything bad about the future of the party.
Maybe some long to lock arms with those in Georgia that desire to secede from the Union?
 



stocker08

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He totally wants to secede. As long as he doesn't have to leave his deep blue city in his blue state.

Vote with your wallet. Isn't that what he's said? Why the hell does he still live in his parents basement in Edina, then? Go to South Dakota where you can breath your covid in each others faces and talk about your successful online personas.
 

STPGopher

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Deuce has already stated the desire to secede. But he's a functioning moron.
Part of me thinks that he is unhappy with what has evolve and questioning/ wrestling. Maybe I am confused here. I thought he said he at one time either voted for or supported Trump, but no longer does.

My statement was intended to be more open ended. I don't think he is alone.
 


Gopher_In_NYC

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One of the other Georgia reps....the one who said that Guam might tip over into the ocean....is the problem. Not QAnon MTG. Nope. Righties refuse to speak anything bad about the future of the party.
LOOK CRG GOT ONE RIGHT REGRADING WHY SOME OF THEM SECRETLY LOVE HER -

1621965736995.png
 


stocker08

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Part of me thinks that he is unhappy with what has evolve and questioning/ wrestling. Maybe I am confused here. I thought he said he at one time either voted for or supported Trump, but no longer does.

My statement was intended to be more open ended. I don't think he is alone.

How long have you been on the OTB? He's one of the several right wing posters claiming to be a libertarian or an independent. However....it doesn't take a brilliant mind to see how deuce (who's been on this for YEARS) and spoof and a few of these other guys are completely blowing up their own claim. They post every once in a while about how they "didn't like the guy" (Trump).....but their foaming at the mouth defense of everything involving the guy says differently. But maybe they seriously didn't think many of his offenses were an issue. Sure....that would possibly fly if they weren't now freaking out about everything Biden.

Easily identifiable shills....too stupid to realize that everyone notices despite their claims to the contrary.
 

STPGopher

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How long have you been on the OTB? He's one of the several right wing posters claiming to be a libertarian or an independent. However....it doesn't take a brilliant mind to see how deuce (who's been on this for YEARS) and spoof and a few of these other guys are completely blowing up their own claim. They post every once in a while about how they "didn't like the guy" (Trump).....but their foaming at the mouth defense of everything involving the guy says differently. But maybe they seriously didn't think many of his offenses were an issue. Sure....that would possibly fly if they weren't now freaking out about everything Biden.

Easily identifiable shills....too stupid to realize that everyone notices despite their claims to the contrary.
Not terribly long. I'll take your word on this subject. I've only read a small selection of his posts. I read enough to figure out he possibly Identified with the Libertarian party/'independent'.
 



howeda7

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Part of me thinks that he is unhappy with what has evolve and questioning/ wrestling. Maybe I am confused here. I thought he said he at one time either voted for or supported Trump, but no longer does.

My statement was intended to be more open ended. I don't think he is alone.
In 2016 he was a deeply principled Gary Johnson voter. But he loved Trump so much he nearly broke the machine voting for him in 2020. Now he's back to waiting to see. But if Trump is the nominee in 2024, we know what will happen.
 

stocker08

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Not terribly long. I'll take your word on this subject. I've only read a small selection of his posts. I read enough to figure out he possibly Identified with the Libertarian party/'independent'.

Deuce has always fancied himself as a principled libertarian. However...it's easy to see that it's a total sham. He's quick to defend any republican who would go against a libertarian standpoint....yet is one of the first to condemn a democrat. Lies and hypocrisy from the right get nothing but defense and "yah buts"......but when it comes from the left....nothing but demonization. Spoof is newer to the OTB....but very similar in posting habits. Neither wants to admit that they are far righties....but the fact that they can't stomach the thought of criticizing anything right for more than a post or two.....all while spending the majority of their day melting down over everything left....tells you all you need to know.

I will say.....deuce 2-3 years back.....took a hard stance against the Trump tariffs. Showed a glimpse of that free trade mentality. I remember because it's one of the very few times that his claimed principles matched his posts when it pertained to the right.
 

STPGopher

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In 2016 he was a deeply principled Gary Johnson voter. But he loved Trump so much he nearly broke the machine voting for him in 2020. Now he's back to waiting to see. But if Trump is the nominee in 2024, we know what will happen.
Point taken. I didn't know the background that well. He's made some points that I have thought were/ are fair.

Thanks!
 

howeda7

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Point taken. I didn't know the background that well. He's made some points that I have thought were/ are fair.

Thanks!
Occasionally. But most of his Libertarian Utopia ideas only work in his fantasies and not in reality.
 



STPGopher

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Deuce has always fancied himself as a principled libertarian. However...it's easy to see that it's a total sham. He's quick to defend any republican who would go against a libertarian standpoint....yet is one of the first to condemn a democrat. Lies and hypocrisy from the right get nothing but defense and "yah buts"......but when it comes from the left....nothing but demonization. Spoof is newer to the OTB....but very similar in posting habits. Neither wants to admit that they are far righties....but the fact that they can't stomach the thought of criticizing anything right for more than a post or two.....all while spending the majority of their day melting down over everything left....tells you all you need to know.

I will say.....deuce 2-3 years back.....took a hard stance against the Trump tariffs. Showed a glimpse of that free trade mentality. I remember because it's one of the very few times that his claimed principles matched his posts when it pertained to the right.
Perhaps I have talked to many people like Section 2 and actually been okay with their differing points of view.
 

Section2

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Part of me thinks that he is unhappy with what has evolve and questioning/ wrestling. Maybe I am confused here. I thought he said he at one time either voted for or supported Trump, but no longer does.

My statement was intended to be more open ended. I don't think he is alone.
Trump sucks. And was a better option than Biden by far. There was no appealing candidate for president. Not voting was probably the best alternative. What Trump upset most was the instititional power structures in the US which are almost wholly evil and destructive. It wasn’t about owning the libs, that stopped being fun after Howies 500th thread.

The US should absolutely break up, and I hope will when the dollar is worthless, the debt spirals out of control, etc. it is a voluntary union, despite those who think the civil war settled it. The US globally is not a force for peace or good and hasn’t been for a long time. America as an idea is a powerful example and force for good, no military intervention required.

My family is old, when they are gone, I won’t be living in their basement anymore.
 

Section2

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Deuce has always fancied himself as a principled libertarian. However...it's easy to see that it's a total sham. He's quick to defend any republican who would go against a libertarian standpoint....yet is one of the first to condemn a democrat. Lies and hypocrisy from the right get nothing but defense and "yah buts"......but when it comes from the left....nothing but demonization. Spoof is newer to the OTB....but very similar in posting habits. Neither wants to admit that they are far righties....but the fact that they can't stomach the thought of criticizing anything right for more than a post or two.....all while spending the majority of their day melting down over everything left....tells you all you need to know.

I will say.....deuce 2-3 years back.....took a hard stance against the Trump tariffs. Showed a glimpse of that free trade mentality. I remember because it's one of the very few times that his claimed principles matched his posts when it pertained to the right.
There are zero examples of me siding with a Republican over a libertarian principle. Zero. Republicans are maybe 80% wrong, Democrats 98%. I will absolutely side with Democrats when they are right, which is rarer and rarer. Take an issue like immigration. There are really only two valid arguments: open borders, or closed controlled borders. I’m actually open to both. But Dems don’t have the guts to take a principled position. They just put on an act and cry about kids in cages, when the photos they use for emotional manipulation actually came under Obama. And they don’t bat an eye. Just move right on to the next outrage. And then they win, and change nothing except the messaging and optics, and it gets 10x worse. And now they just ignore it.
it’s not an ideology for the masses that is based on anything but emotion. But the state is force and violence. Those are it’s tools. Bleeding hearts are for charity, not the state. And the leaders and elites with few exceptions are only concerned with power and control. In both parties.
 

Spoofin

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Don't forget to wear your goggles boys. No one needs an eye infection.
 

STPGopher

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Trump sucks. And was a better option than Biden by far. There was no appealing candidate for president. Not voting was probably the best alternative. What Trump upset most was the instititional power structures in the US which are almost wholly evil and destructive. It wasn’t about owning the libs, that stopped being fun after Howies 500th thread.

The US should absolutely break up, and I hope will when the dollar is worthless, the debt spirals out of control, etc. it is a voluntary union, despite those who think the civil war settled it. The US globally is not a force for peace or good and hasn’t been for a long time. America as an idea is a powerful example and force for good, no military intervention required.

My family is old, when they are gone, I won’t be living in their basement anymore.
There is most likely the source of the problem. Trump was/ is kind of a catch all. Those who believed that the "South Shall Rise Again" he was their voice.

America's Original Victim...?

Trump Is Officially Our Guy, He Was Always Our Guy

Proud Boys Now Mock Trump

Proud Boys Mock Trump The Seattle Times take

"But since then, discontent with Trump, who later condemned the violence, has boiled over. On social media, Proud Boys participants have complained about his willingness to leave office and said his disavowal of the Capitol rampage was an act of betrayal."

Edit: The links were just a very small sample of the range of Trump loyalists.

I want to be very clear here. This is in now way saying these are your thoughts. I am just saying that Trump became many peoples guy. Some just looking for change. Some that never wanted this country to be whole. Others Just wanted their version of what the US should be to prevail.
 

Section2

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There is most likely the source of the problem. Trump was/ is kind of a catch all. Those who believed that the "South Shall Rise Again" he was their voice.

America's Original Victim...?

Trump Is Officially Our Guy, He Was Always Our Guy

Proud Boys Now Mock Trump

Proud Boys Mock Trump The Seattle Times take

"But since then, discontent with Trump, who later condemned the violence, has boiled over. On social media, Proud Boys participants have complained about his willingness to leave office and said his disavowal of the Capitol rampage was an act of betrayal."

Edit: The links were just a very small sample of the range of Trump loyalists.

I want to be very clear here. This is in now way saying these are your thoughts. I am just saying that Trump became many peoples guy. Some just looking for change. Some that never wanted this country to be whole. Others Just wanted their version of what the US should be to prevail.
Any good leader or successful politician makes a lot of people feel like he is fighting for them and speaks to them. Trump was the first successful politician in many years who spoke differently and bluntly. Most politicians speak in very carefully structured sentences with focus group tested phrases (I mean, listen to a Psaki presser, “community violence” is the new word). And they are so afraid of upsetting and offending literally anyone. I think and hope that most Americans are really fed up with that kind of language. But Trump was also rude and inarticulate. Someone smart could take the good from Trump and eliminate the bad and speak more plainly.
But, things like “drain the swamp” are so true, but Trump was probably never going to do it. He was unworthy of the faith his electorate put in him. Character matters. But he was right on a lot of things, and not nearly as bad as the left thought he was. You watch, the revisions will start in a year or two if Trump doesn’t run. DeSantis will be a far bigger threat, or whoever.
 

KillerGopherFan

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It is very amusing when the king of random inaccurate twitter posts takes a shot at the sources used by others. DHB.
Yeah, but using political cartoons is so different than expressing a point of view from someone else’s Tweets, right? Completely different. Well, different for howie.
 

STPGopher

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Any good leader or successful politician makes a lot of people feel like he is fighting for them and speaks to them. Trump was the first successful politician in many years who spoke differently and bluntly. Most politicians speak in very carefully structured sentences with focus group tested phrases (I mean, listen to a Psaki presser, “community violence” is the new word). And they are so afraid of upsetting and offending literally anyone. I think and hope that most Americans are really fed up with that kind of language. But Trump was also rude and inarticulate. Someone smart could take the good from Trump and eliminate the bad and speak more plainly.
But, things like “drain the swamp” are so true, but Trump was probably never going to do it. He was unworthy of the faith his electorate put in him. Character matters. But he was right on a lot of things, and not nearly as bad as the left thought he was. You watch, the revisions will start in a year or two if Trump doesn’t run. DeSantis will be a far bigger threat, or whoever.
Trump was some of the things you mention to some because they wanted him to be that. Trump IMHO used all groups to get what he wanted/ wants. Did he change from the same guy (swindler) he's always been? Or was he just repackaged or imaged for and by others?

I get that some longed for Frank talk, not weather vane politics, but instead, they got manipulated (my opinion). The only thing of note was the Tax bill. It helped the rich, but really only allowed the rest to take home a little more. Without deductions, it was basically a wash for many. A little more take home, a smaller tax refund (for those that got it).

Regarding the swamp, I've felt that whatever this swamp thing is, he was/ is the "creature from the black lagoon".
creature-from-the-black-lagoon-1954,2483905.jpg
 

Section2

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Trump was some of the things you mention to some because they wanted him to be that. Trump IMHO used all groups to get what he wanted/ wants. Did he change from the same guy (swindler) he's always been? Or was he just repackaged or imaged for and by others?

I get that some longed for Frank talk, not weather vane politics, but instead, they got manipulated (my opinion). The only thing of note was the Tax bill. It helped the rich, but really only allowed the rest to take home a little more. Without deductions, it was basically a wash for many. A little more take home, a smaller tax refund (for those that got it).

Regarding the swamp, I've felt that whatever this swamp thing is, he was/ is the "creature from the black lagoon".
creature-from-the-black-lagoon-1954,2483905.jpg
My post was about Trumps language. I don’t see how his rhetorical style factors into what people wanted him to be. Content and actions sure. But it was the blunt talk and willingness to talk about things that others wouldn’t, and propose simple straight forward solutions like build the wall.
All tax cuts favor the rich because they pay most of the taxes. The average person benefited from more jobs, looser regulations, etc. But Trump failed by not shrinking government. Everything he did is being quickly undone.
 

GopherRock

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While I am there, can I buy a compromised voting machine? I need a paper weight. BTW will Cyber ninja's reimburse the people of Maricopa county
I'll even throw in a bridge in New York for free.
 

stocker08

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There are zero examples of me siding with a Republican over a libertarian principle. Zero. Republicans are maybe 80% wrong, Democrats 98%. I will absolutely side with Democrats when they are right, which is rarer and rarer. Take an issue like immigration. There are really only two valid arguments: open borders, or closed controlled borders. I’m actually open to both. But Dems don’t have the guts to take a principled position. They just put on an act and cry about kids in cages, when the photos they use for emotional manipulation actually came under Obama. And they don’t bat an eye. Just move right on to the next outrage. And then they win, and change nothing except the messaging and optics, and it gets 10x worse. And now they just ignore it.
it’s not an ideology for the masses that is based on anything but emotion. But the state is force and violence. Those are it’s tools. Bleeding hearts are for charity, not the state. And the leaders and elites with few exceptions are only concerned with power and control. In both parties.

False. You've defended big government republicans for years. When it's pointed out....you "yah but". The same things you whine about and accuse democrats for.....you ignore and shrug off when the right does. No principles at all. You like to claim to be a libertarian....but you only back that up when it's convenient and doesn't impact your right wing love fest.
 

stocker08

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Trump was some of the things you mention to some because they wanted him to be that. Trump IMHO used all groups to get what he wanted/ wants. Did he change from the same guy (swindler) he's always been? Or was he just repackaged or imaged for and by others?

I get that some longed for Frank talk, not weather vane politics, but instead, they got manipulated (my opinion). The only thing of note was the Tax bill. It helped the rich, but really only allowed the rest to take home a little more. Without deductions, it was basically a wash for many. A little more take home, a smaller tax refund (for those that got it).

Regarding the swamp, I've felt that whatever this swamp thing is, he was/ is the "creature from the black lagoon".

Yup. Trump didn't care about the average American. Sure....he spoke more bluntly. But most of that was off the cuff trash that was almost entirely self promotion. How is that useful? Some people loved it because he didn't sound like your typical politician. But again....how the hell is that useful to anyone? Why would anyone celebrate that he had little idea what he was doing?

The tax cuts benefited the rich and the wealthy. Like you said....my taxes didn't change. Basically all of the deductions that I received for various things were replaced by the increased standard deduction. The tax cuts were sold under the guise of lower taxes for the average American....but really were a sham give away to the wealthy.

As for "drain the swamp".....has any group of people been duped harder than the repubs who parroted that lame quip? Trump didn't "drain the swamp" in any sense of the word. He installed his friends and family members in positions of power. He gave powerful positions to private industry wonkys like Devos and Dejoy.....both of whom had no business in those positions. Trump had the wealthiest overall cabinet in the history of the country. And still.....the rock biters continue to talk about "drain the swamp" as though it actually happened....just because Trump told them he did it.
 

STPGopher

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My post was about Trumps language. I don’t see how his rhetorical style factors into what people wanted him to be. Content and actions sure. But it was the blunt talk and willingness to talk about things that others wouldn’t, and propose simple straight forward solutions like build the wall.
All tax cuts favor the rich because they pay most of the taxes. The average person benefited from more jobs, looser regulations, etc. But Trump failed by not shrinking government. Everything he did is being quickly undone.
His 'straightforward' talk faded in a New York minute when he was asked about hate groups. If it wasn't obvious before, it became obvious then. That both sides statement would make most all politicians blush.

The wall? I don't know where to begin. Most of it would be opinion, so I will spare you. I will say ecological, and logistics concerns were of note. According to what was reported (at the time) from multiple sources including enforcement agencies, smuggling was happening at the crossings. The wall alone showed that there was a learning curve regarding the difference between running a business and governance.

I do think that you are dead on regarding his appeal. Not sure about the rest. I could see the average business owner benefiting from looser regulations and tax cuts, but I am not sure it did all that much for the average worker that was already employed. Perhaps someone could provide data on the working poor and unemployed. Minnesota is often harder to gage because typically Minnesota has an unemployment range that is below the national average.
 

Section2

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His 'straightforward' talk faded in a New York minute when he was asked about hate groups. If it wasn't obvious before, it became obvious then. That both sides statement would make most all politicians blush.

The wall? I don't know where to begin. Most of it would be opinion, so I will spare you. I will say ecological, and logistics concerns were of note. According to what was reported (at the time) from multiple sources including enforcement agencies, smuggling was happening at the crossings. The wall alone showed that there was a learning curve regarding the difference between running a business and governance.

I do think that you are dead on regarding his appeal. Not sure about the rest. I could see the average business owner benefiting from looser regulations and tax cuts, but I am not sure it did all that much for the average worker that was already employed. Perhaps someone could provide data on the working poor and unemployed. Minnesota is often harder to gage because typically Minnesota has an unemployment range that is below the national average.
I couldn’t disagree more on “both sides”. In every way.
not really worth discussing the wall. I’m talking political success as a political message and you aren’t.
it’s better for all Americans when more people are working and productive. Because we produce more goods and services which raises the standard of living in the country.
 

howeda7

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Yup. Trump didn't care about the average American. Sure....he spoke more bluntly. But most of that was off the cuff trash that was almost entirely self promotion. How is that useful? Some people loved it because he didn't sound like your typical politician. But again....how the hell is that useful to anyone? Why would anyone celebrate that he had little idea what he was doing?

The tax cuts benefited the rich and the wealthy. Like you said....my taxes didn't change. Basically all of the deductions that I received for various things were replaced by the increased standard deduction. The tax cuts were sold under the guise of lower taxes for the average American....but really were a sham give away to the wealthy.

As for "drain the swamp".....has any group of people been duped harder than the repubs who parroted that lame quip? Trump didn't "drain the swamp" in any sense of the word. He installed his friends and family members in positions of power. He gave powerful positions to private industry wonkys like Devos and Dejoy.....both of whom had no business in those positions. Trump had the wealthiest overall cabinet in the history of the country. And still.....the rock biters continue to talk about "drain the swamp" as though it actually happened....just because Trump told them he did it.
And "Build that Wall" was just a slogan someone told him to say. But people liked it. Same with "Drain the Swamp." He was a Carnival Barker saying what would get his crowd revved up. Nothing more.
 






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