The effect of Dunbar's departure

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Continuity, continuity, continuity....

Changing offensive coordinators and offensive philosophy last spring was an absolute killer, it's becoming abundantly clear. If Dunbar were still running the offense, there's not a doubt in my mind that this team is 8-3 right now, at a minimum. Third year with the same offense and same coordinator, no reason to expect things wouldn't have been rolling, at the very LEAST enough to swing the tide in two games lost by a FG.

After two years under a spread offensive coordinator, Jed Fisch might as well be speaking Italian to this year's version of the Rodents. Successful programs are ones that have continuity on both sides of the ball.

Fisch may well turn out to be a very good offensive coordinator. We may start to see that next year, after this team has a month of bowl practices as well as an entire offseason to digest what he's trying to do on offense.

This is what happens when you completely change offenses. The Gophers go to the Spread offense, they go 1-11; the next year they start to figure it out and they become bowl eligible. Does what's going on at Michigan look familiar? They went to the Spread and they were horrendous last year, starting to figure it out this year.

In his second year with the offense, Weber actually looked pretty decent last year. This year, completely different offense. Do you think he suddenly just got a lot worse this year? He's the one that has struggled and underachieved the most this year which is no surprise since he's the one who was most affected by the offensive changes.

My only concern at this point is whether or not Fisch's offense is just too complicated for these guys to pick up. I would imagine that between now and next season, he waters things down a little in order to enhance the learning curve for these guys.

 

[andy]

I agree completely...

The decision to abandon the spread will likely bury Brewster. Under no circumstances do you reverse course in the third year of an almost complete rebuilding of the program.

As far as I recall, the only reason offered to adopt the pro-style was that we struggled in short yardage situations with the spread. Big deal! Improve the O-line a bit and work on some special plays... don't totally revamp the system.

Pound the rock, hahahaha. How about score once or twice?

 

[ButchNashGuy]

I agree the constant changing of OC's and DC's has hurt us more than anything. I am glad that we are away from the spread. Our offense has scored some points this year #4 scoring offense in the Big Ten. They are so terribly inconsistent that they have no confidence and ability to dominate a game. Yesterday was over the top abysmal.

 

[50PoundHead]

Continuity, continuity, continuity....

My only concern at this point is whether or not Fisch's offense is just too complicated for these guys to pick up. I would imagine that between now and next season, he waters things down a little in order to enhance the learning curve for these guys.

Agree completely. Maybe we should figure out how to run our plays using a balanced line as opposed to employing an unbalanced line. The complication of the offense may explain why defenses seem to know our plays, as counter-intuitive as that sounds. These are college kids learning a new offense and they may be "tipping" what's in store and opposing scouts have picked that up. In other words, Gopher players are "thinking" and not "playing." Not a good thing.

And from Butch Nash Guy

I agree the constant changing of OC's and DC's has hurt us more than anything. I am glad that we are away from the spread. Our offense has scored some points this year #4 scoring offense in the Big Ten. They are so terribly inconsistent that they have no confidence and ability to dominate a game. Yesterday was over the top abysmal.

Agree completely here as well. Going to the spread in the first place was borderline goofy (in my opinion). Even Ohio State is employing elements of the spread without going whole hog into that system. We went from the Mason system that had a junior high passing system to the spread, which had a junior high running game as employed by Dunbar. Some of that is personnel, but I just think the spread, as implemented by Dunbar, is a subpar offense. It moved us up and down the field, but it seemed to shy away from the physicality needed to pick up tough yards on the ground. But again, part of that is personnel.

Brewster is now hitched to Fisch. If Fisch's offense doesn't succeed, Brewster's tenure here will likely be over. Maybe (and let me stress the maybe) Fisch turns out to be a Shanahan-type who will go on to do great things, but it took Shanahan several stops before he reached his pinnacle.

 

[RodentRampage]

I agree that switching to the spread was probably too radical a departure, it took everything back to square 1. To then make another radical switch after two years just resets everything again. Brewster may not have enough time left to get things set. If Fisch leaves, do we make yet another radical change on offense? What's next, triple option?

 

[60 Cent]

I agree the constant changing of OC's and DC's has hurt us more than anything. I am glad that we are away from the spread. Our offense has scored some points this year #4 scoring offense in the Big Ten. They are so terribly inconsistent that they have no confidence and ability to dominate a game. Yesterday was over the top abysmal.

There isn't much difference between the #4 and #9 scoring teams in the Big 10 (a whopping 17 points, 2.3 points/week).

School PF
Wisconsin 205
Ohio State 201
Michigan State 191
Minnesota 179
Indiana 174
Penn State 172
Michigan 167
Purdue 166
Iowa 162
Illinois 148
Northwestern 145

It isn't Dunbar's departure itself that killed the team's offensive production, it was abandoning the spread for whatever Fisch is putting out there. The spread isn't a bad offense if it's used right and you have the right personnel. It takes time to adjust to new systems, yes, but Brewster ditching the spread thinking it would make his team better (assuming that was the rationale for changing schemes) is silly in the short-term and possibly not a sure thing in the long term.

 

[Governor Sibley]

Offensive yards and points per game--most worthless stat ever!

Worst decision of Brew's was walking into a program with one thing going for it (the running game) and ditching it.

 

[calminnfan]

The problem is the spread, though a descent offense, is no longer striking terror in defenses. Opposing teams know how to play against it. Dunbar needed to figure out a way to adapt it and refused to. Though his departure probably should have been handled better, it was not going to do much better.

Though everything with Fisch, especially the massive changes should have also been handled better, the team has been through most of the season and has actually gotten worse. The type of offense itself is not the problem. It is the play calling/execution. I think a good point was made concerning a base offense myself, but willing to acknowledge the problems may lie elsewhere.

BTW - what was that quote in a different thread referring to the firing of Brewster. Something like If it is right later, it is right early...Why not the same thing for Dunbar?

 

[UST82Gopher]

Finally - an intelligent thread where I feel I can post.

I did not get to go to the game yesterday - I watched on DVR last night. I gave me a chance, as an old coach, to look at several things more closely.

Multiple times, the pass plays called had flat out wide open receivers that were missed. Tow-Arnett was wide open by 10 yds in the end zone in the 1st quarter and Weber airmailed the ball. 10-0 at the 6 minute mark of the 1st quarter creates a lot more momentum.

The field was slick. 3 times, Whalely made the perfect cut for big yds in open space - only to slip. Someone needs to figure out what type of cleats work in different conditions and fit the backs accordingly.

No one on the line seems to make blocking assignment changes on the line of scrimmage. We were getting over load blitzed. I never saw a line man point out his assignment, or any other action that suggested that the blocking scheme called in the huddle was being changed. With a new system and lots of injuries, I am wondering if our staff has made the conscientious decision to simplify things by not allowing changes on the line. The downside is we were frequently 3 hats on 4 players (on on right side) which is not going to be successful.

Weber's 1st look on nearly every "non bubble screen" type pass is deep down field. Is that Weber or the system? Because deep is a 4 sec count to be open and, if not, you need 2 more seconds for the 2nd option. I don't care who the opponent - that is too much time to ask an offensive line for. Some of this is system - I don't see the underneath receiver. Or, is Fischer stuck with keeping the backs in to help block thus eliminating the underneath receivers? I don't know.

I think FIscher has the ability to run a successful multi faceted offense. It needs time. I also think that Weber will not be next year's QB.

Any other thoughts?

 

[50PoundHead]

I think Dunbar's iteration of the spread is just an incomplete offense, much like Mike Leach's spread at Texas Tech. It can take a team that lack top-tier personnel and make it competitive by exploiting match-ups, but, as we saw against Iowa last season, if you get pounded at the line of scrimmage, any match-up advantage you might be able to exploit in a perfect world simply evaporates.

Truth be told though, the same thing can be said about Mason's zone blocking schemes. It absolutely tore up inferior competition, but more often than not against the top-tier teams, superior athletes on the other team's defense would "blow it up."

What Brewster should have done, at least in my estimation (and I've never coached football so I defer to others with greater knowledge), is install an offense that would have maintained at least a semblance of a straightforward running game and elevate Mason's junior high passing offense to one that had a bit more sophistication.

 

[PlayHosea]

I agree the constant changing of OC's and DC's has hurt us more than anything. I am glad that we are away from the spread. Our offense has scored some points this year #4 scoring offense in the Big Ten. They are so terribly inconsistent that they have no confidence and ability to dominate a game. Yesterday was over the top abysmal.

Valentine and Hoese were/are really good college fullbacks. The spread made Valentine useless his Sr. year. If they'd go back to it next year, Hoese'd be useless as well.