SportingNews: Plan circulating to extend NBA entry to 3 years out of HS

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BleedGopher

BleedGopher

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per SportingNews:

In the dispute over what should be done about age limits for players coming out of college basketball and entering the draft, expect the NBA's D-League to become a major battlefield.

According to multiple sources, a proposed plan that is circulating now would see the age limit extended from its current position — one year after high school graduation — to three years, essentially barring most players from entering the NBA until they are 20 or 21.

The sources said that, in order to pave the way for raising the age limit, the league would be willing to expand salaries in the D-League, giving each team a salary cap and allowing executives with each team to sign players as they wish. Not only would that allow D-League teams to sign good young players, it would allow NBA clubs to size up young executives and player evaluators.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/sto...imit-one-and-done-ncaa-adam-silver-mark-cuban

Go Gophers!!
 

BleedGopher said:
per SportingNews:

In the dispute over what should be done about age limits for players coming out of college basketball and entering the draft, expect the NBA's D-League to become a major battlefield.

According to multiple sources, a proposed plan that is circulating now would see the age limit extended from its current position — one year after high school graduation — to three years, essentially barring most players from entering the NBA until they are 20 or 21.

The sources said that, in order to pave the way for raising the age limit, the league would be willing to expand salaries in the D-League, giving each team a salary cap and allowing executives with each team to sign players as they wish. Not only would that allow D-League teams to sign good young players, it would allow NBA clubs to size up young executives and player evaluators.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/sto...imit-one-and-done-ncaa-adam-silver-mark-cuban

Go Gophers!!
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So basically college recruiters will be competing with D League execs?
 

Is it the MLB model but if a kid goes pro right away he cannot play in the NBA until after his third year out of high school, or is it that the NBA development league cannot even take players until after their third year out of high school.
 

bemidjigopher said:
So basically college recruiters will be competing with D League execs?
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Well, college baseball has had to compete with minor leagues for many years and has done OK. Unless the D League has a major expansion I don't see this hurting college basketball much. The D League doesn't have that many teams.

There will still be plenty of very good players left for college basketball even if this change results in a small number of stars going directly to the D League or leaving earlier. It might even result in more three or four year players if the NBA prospects can't get the big money by jumping earlier. What it might result in, though, is a one or two pretty mediocre draft classes for the first year or two after the change.
 

BleedGopher said:
per SportingNews:

In the dispute over what should be done about age limits for players coming out of college basketball and entering the draft, expect the NBA's D-League to become a major battlefield.

According to multiple sources, a proposed plan that is circulating now would see the age limit extended from its current position — one year after high school graduation — to three years, essentially barring most players from entering the NBA until they are 20 or 21.

The sources said that, in order to pave the way for raising the age limit, the league would be willing to expand salaries in the D-League, giving each team a salary cap and allowing executives with each team to sign players as they wish. Not only would that allow D-League teams to sign good young players, it would allow NBA clubs to size up young executives and player evaluators.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/sto...imit-one-and-done-ncaa-adam-silver-mark-cuban

Go Gophers!!
Click to expand...

What a GREAT opportunity for a "Minor League" professional system to come in and fill the void. "Come play for the ABA right out of high school and then if you wish you can try out for an NBA team in three years." There would be a lot of money to be made by an alternate league of owners ready to market elite basketball players between the ages of 18 and 21.
 


tinyarch said:
What a GREAT opportunity for a "Minor League" professional system to come in and fill the void. "Come play for the ABA right out of high school and then if you wish you can try out for an NBA team in three years." There would be a lot of money to be made by an alternate league of owners ready to market elite basketball players between the ages of 18 and 21.
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The problem is even the most talented 18-21 year olds play pretty crappy basketball that makes the NBA look god awful. So I don't think you'll find a lot of fan support (and cities that want to host) another basketball league. If they do, it will look very similar to minor league hockey and baseball and not generate much income. Preferably, kids get 3-4 years in college, get a degree and are more mature before the NBA. That is best for the NBA and happens to benefit College Ball as well. Wonder if they'll make the same rule for the WNBA (which 99% of players stay the full 4 years in college anyway).
 

They're moving in the wrong direction. They should end this ridiculous experiment and remove the requirement altogether. If a player is ready to play, he's ready to play. If he's not, stick him in the D-League or let him go to college for however long he needs. If he screws up, he screws up. I'm tired of this paternalistic BS. I don't see how anybody could think the "at least one year" rule is anything other than a failure.

The evidence and numbers don't support the rationale for this. Baseball has an age limit of 18 and somehow they don't have this alleged trouble. It turns out that, shocker of shockers, players come up to the majors when they're ready to play, with no age requirements necessary. This system accomplishes nothing useful. All it does is line the pockets of College ADs at the expense of the players.
 

BBQ Platypus said:
They're moving in the wrong direction. They should end this ridiculous experiment and remove the requirement altogether. If a player is ready to play, he's ready to play. If he's not, stick him in the D-League or let him go to college for however long he needs. If he screws up, he screws up. I'm tired of this paternalistic BS. I don't see how anybody could think the "at least one year" rule is anything other than a failure. The evidence and numbers don't support the rationale for this. Baseball has an age limit of 18 and somehow they don't have this alleged trouble. It turns out that, shocker of shockers, players come up to the majors when they're ready to play, with no age requirements necessary. This system accomplishes nothing useful. All it does is line the pockets of College ADs at the expense of the players.
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Did you miss the part where they can play in the D league out of high school? And the NBA would be raising salaries, etc.
 

scher215 said:
Did you miss the part where they can play in the D league out of high school? And the NBA would be raising salaries, etc.
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No, I did not. But I didn't see anything that showed that the age restriction doesn't still apply to the D-League players as well. It's one step forward and two steps back. No matter what, you're going to be making less money in the D-League than in the NBA itself. This rule punishes the best players - the ones who are ready from the word "go" (they DO exist). And it's even costlier than that - starting out at age 18 compared to age 21 gives you one more FA period/new contract when you're still in your prime.

What's more, the rule is unnecessary because most of the unready players won't play until they're ready anyway, because teams have an obvious disincentive against filling their team with players who can't hack it in the NBA yet. MLB understands that. Why doesn't the NBA?
 



BBQ Platypus said:
No, I did not. But I didn't see anything that showed that the age restriction doesn't still apply to the D-League players as well. It's one step forward and two steps back. No matter what, you're going to be making less money in the D-League than in the NBA itself. This rule punishes the best players by costing them earnings. And it's even costlier than that - starting out at age 18 compared to age 21 gives you one more FA period/new contract when you're still in your prime.

What's more, the rule is unnecessary because the players who aren't good enough won't play before they're ready anyway, as teams have an obvious disincentive to fill their team with players who can't hack it in the NBA yet. MLB understands that. Why doesn't the NBA?
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MLB has an extensive minor league system where they can stash players for 10 years before they are ready for the bigs. Due to the smaller roster and overall number of players, the NBA is forced to take more chances on potential and therefore tends to end up with a less talented league. Truth is, the NBA is a private business and they can make any age requirement they want. Courts have upheld both their and the NFL's limit time and time again (with a few dissenting rulings as well). Personally, I think a 3 year limit is better for both college and the NBA. It isn't best for the players, but it is the cost of having a better NBA product which leads to larger attendance and increased salaries. If the players don't like it, they are welcome to sell their wares across seas.
 

Before the 1 year limit.

Almost nobody has an issue with the Moses Malone's, Lebron's, Garnett's, and Kobe's of the world who were ready to play minutes in the NBA right out of high school. But for every Lebron there were a few others who barely made a second NBA season. They were out of the league right away, you don't remember Korleone Young, Jonathan Bender, Leon Smith, Diop, Tony Key, Cisse. Not saying we need a limit but it at least enables those in that situation to entertain college. Maybe the evaluation and allowance by the NCAA to retain eligibility needs improvement?

I am a bit biased as college basketball is my favorite sport and NBA is maybe 6th on my list so I don't mind some of these players playing in college longer. But at the end of the day there are always good players in college no matter what the NBA stance is.
 

Sparlimb said:
MLB has an extensive minor league system where they can stash players for 10 years before they are ready for the bigs. Due to the smaller roster and overall number of players, the NBA is forced to take more chances on potential and therefore tends to end up with a less talented league. Truth is, the NBA is a private business and they can make any age requirement they want. Courts have upheld both their and the NFL's limit time and time again (with a few dissenting rulings as well). Personally, I think a 3 year limit is better for both college and the NBA. It isn't best for the players, but it is the cost of having a better NBA product which leads to larger attendance and increased salaries. If the players don't like it, they are welcome to sell their wares across seas.
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No, private businesses cannot do anything they want. However, they may establish work rules that would ordinarily violate labor laws if the rules are collectively bargained.
 

It is very smart for the NBA to do this. It grows the D-League, which may be necessary with massive changes that the NCAA will be forced to implement. Moreover, NBA evaluators will have more time to scout players, and it keeps more jobs for veteran players. So veterans will make more money and last longer in the league, and the game will be a better product because the younger players will be more polished.

This will make the college game a better product, although there will be less parity. We will be much less likely to see a a 7 seed v. 8 seed in the championship again. The NCAA will also look better because they give more empty speeches about how the game has been restored for the betterment of the virtuous "student athlete."

The people who lose are people who, by and large, are going to get rich anyway. I'd like to see them get paid, but truthfully, they're not ready for the big bucks. Plenty of players had their careers ruined the day they signed their deal at 18-years old, before they even stepped foot on the court.
 



For every Kobe, there are 1,000 Ndudu Ebi's. This is smart by the NBA, as it allows them to move away from making horrible investments on young guys with "Raw talent". And a player is only ready when the league hiring them states they are ready and willing to pay them for their services.
 

DLguy said:
For every Kobe, there are 1,000 Ndudu Ebi's. This is smart by the NBA, as it allows them to move away from making horrible investments on young guys with "Raw talent". And a player is only ready when the league hiring them states they are ready and willing to pay them for their services.
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Actually that's not true. On average, guys coming out if high school have been wildly more successful than those out of college.
 

This is good for the league. In the NFL, the 1st round is full of rookie starters. In the NBA, we have 2 players a year that come out of college NBA ready.

Keep them in college another year.
 

All this means is that the top 20 (give or take) recruits will find other routes to get to the NBA besides college. Programs like the Gophers will have even more competition for the recruits they get than they already have. Honestly, I don't see much positive for us in the future.
 

From a Gary Parish column-

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...t-is-right-and-wrong-about-college-basketball

And the larger point he made was spot-on and worth examining.

"There's been a lot of players who've come out of high school," Bryant said. "If you do the numbers and you look at the count, you'll probably see players who came out of high school ... were much more successful on average than players who went to college."

That was Bryant's larger point.

And it's 100 percent true, by the way.

For those unfamiliar with the numbers, 39 high school players were selected in the first or second round between 1995 and 2005. Here's a breakdown of how they did:

Ten became NBA All-Stars.
Three became NBA Most Valuable Players.
Thirty-three spent at least five years in the NBA.
That means only six out of 39 spent fewer than five years in the NBA, which means you were essentially twice as likely to get an All-Star as you were a flameout if you selected a high school prospect from 1995 until it was no longer allowed before the 2006 NBA Draft. Roughly 85 percent of the time, at the very least, you got a rotation player. So, like Bryant said, on average the prospects who skipped college and were selected have been much more successful in the NBA than the prospects who went to college before being selected.

It's not even close, actually.
Click to expand...
 

afurry91 said:
This is good for the league. In the NFL, the 1st round is full of rookie starters. In the NBA, we have 2 players a year that come out of college NBA ready.

Keep them in college another year.
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I agree, I love this idea. Go to the NBDL out of High School or it is college for 3 years. My question on the system though is if a guy could go to college for a year and then to the NBDL after that? I would think yes.
 

What a great idea... Put more kids in the league more college kids get drafted.. Less kids going over seas. It will make the NBA more balanced as a league in the long run. Not having rookies sitting at the end of each bench like shabazz and dieng. They will play in the D league have great success and be able to come and start day one. WOW awesome I hope this happens... There will be more college kids spread out around college basetball better players.
 

Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0 said:
All this means is that the top 20 (give or take) recruits will find other routes to get to the NBA besides college. Programs like the Gophers will have even more competition for the recruits they get than they already have. Honestly, I don't see much positive for us in the future.
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If I'm a high school senior I'm picking the NCAA and playing for a national championship over the D league 10 times out of 10.
 

Gopherguy0723 said:
No, private businesses cannot do anything they want. However, they may establish work rules that would ordinarily violate labor laws if the rules are collectively bargained.
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I did read an interesting take that the collective bargaining could be null and void since it is between two parties (pro league and player's union) and it is meant to disadvantage a 3rd party (young players) who are not represented by either party. But for whatever reason, that's never got anywhere in court...

Found it. https://laworgs.depaul.edu/journals/sports_law/documents/wurth nba age requirement.pdf
 

scher215 said:
From a Gary Parish column-
And the larger point he made was spot-on and worth examining.

"There's been a lot of players who've come out of high school," Bryant said. "If you do the numbers and you look at the count, you'll probably see players who came out of high school ... were much more successful on average than players who went to college."

That was Bryant's larger point.

And it's 100 percent true, by the way.

For those unfamiliar with the numbers, 39 high school players were selected in the first or second round between 1995 and 2005. Here's a breakdown of how they did:

Ten became NBA All-Stars.
Three became NBA Most Valuable Players.
Thirty-three spent at least five years in the NBA.
That means only six out of 39 spent fewer than five years in the NBA, which means you were essentially twice as likely to get an All-Star as you were a flameout if you selected a high school prospect from 1995 until it was no longer allowed before the 2006 NBA Draft. Roughly 85 percent of the time, at the very least, you got a rotation player. So, like Bryant said, on average the prospects who skipped college and were selected have been much more successful in the NBA than the prospects who went to college before being selected.

It's not even close, actually.
Click to expand...
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...t-is-right-and-wrong-about-college-basketball
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What a dumb article. Is anyone stupid enough to believe that comparing the average player who was good enough to go straight to the NBA and the average player coming out of college as apples to apples? It's absurd.

And that doesn't change the premise that even those players would be better players if they'd have a few seasons in college before the NBA.
 

Sparlimb said:
What a dumb article. Is anyone stupid enough to believe that comparing the average player who was good enough to go straight to the NBA and the average player coming out of college as apples to apples? It's absurd.

And that doesn't change the premise that even those players would be better players if they'd have a few seasons in college before the NBA.
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Correct. The comparison is entirely flawed. Bad column.
 

Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0 said:
All this means is that the top 20 (give or take) recruits will find other routes to get to the NBA besides college. Programs like the Gophers will have even more competition for the recruits they get than they already have. Honestly, I don't see much positive for us in the future.
Click to expand...

Almost all recruits will chose college over the D-league and the top 20 recruits already have otherher options besides college. College players at a major program already have it better then D leaguers anyway as it currently is. The gophers will have ess competition as well and it will be more similar to to football.
 

bemidjigopher said:
So basically college recruiters will be competing with D League execs?
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They already have been for a while and the only time that a HS player has haver chosen the D-league over NCAA that i can remember was Latavious Williams in 2009. An expansion and increased salary would only slightly increase their competitiveness over the NCAA but it still wouldn't be close. The only times where i can think of a player even considering to go over seas which currently can make you about six times more then a D-league salary as the article states just to feed his family and make money right away would be Jermaine Marshall at Penn State who originally declared to leave early to go play over seas but even that never ended up happening and he just decided to transfer to ASU. The other time is right now with Chris Jones at Louisville where he was considering player over seas to make a quick buck but he just announced he will return.

So as it is the only time a player choosing any other path besides the NCAA to get to the NBA would be Latavious Williams. Oh and Brandon Jennings, forgot about him. This will bolster the college game way more then it will hurt it.
 

afurry91 said:
If I'm a high school senior I'm picking the NCAA and playing for a national championship over the D league 10 times out of 10.
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die hard gopher said:
Almost all recruits will chose college over the D-league and the top 20 recruits already have otherher options besides college. College players at a major program already have it better then D leaguers anyway as it currently is. The gophers will have ess competition as well and it will be more similar to to football.
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If I'm a young recruit with all kinds of people telling me you're a can't miss NBA pro who will make more money than I could even fathom, a college championship isn't real high my list of goals. I'd put up with a year or two of college ball before making the jump. If someone's telling me, "Sorry kid, the NBA will have to wait three years. You can spend that time playing for Hoops Heaven U. enriching the coffers of its athletic department and paying the coaches multi-million dollar salary or playing for any number of teams in Europe, Asia, Australia, etc.", the latter option would have a great appeal to me Yes, there are other options than the D-League. They pay decent money and you play against high level competition.

I'll admit, there will be some who will go the college route because they value an education. Most of these kids just want to play NBA ball. If they no longer see the college route as a desirable means to get there, these options will become more popular. You can call me cynical, but players will pursue options that are the most desirable to attain their goal.

Speaking of which, saying this plan will make it more like college football is not how I see it, because there really is no option to the NFL but college football. College baseball and hockey would be more analogous. I think men's basketball could suffer quite a bit by this plan.
 

Well no player ever opts out to play Euro ball or d-league ball before their eligibility expires even if they do get paid. Its not really the free education that compels them i don't believe. Its the fame that they get with 15,000 fans at every game and the millions more watching you on nationally televised games when Euro ball isn't nearly as popular as college basketball. There are more scouts that watch you're college games as well and also the facilities, trainers and coaches usually better as well at least for blue blood programs. Playing in a foreign country miles and mile away from home where nobody speaks you're language can be scary as well i'm sure for somebody that is so young.

Also the Arena football league, Canadian football league and many more leagues actually do exist as an option to get the NFL.
 

die hard gopher said:
Well no player ever opts out to play Euro ball or d-league ball before their eligibility expires even if they do get paid. Its not really the free education that compels them i don't believe. Its the fame that they get with 15,000 fans at every game and the millions more watching you on nationally televised games when Euro ball isn't nearly as popular as college basketball. There are more scouts that watch you're college games as well and also the facilities, trainers and coaches usually better as well at least for blue blood programs. Playing in a foreign country miles and mile away from home where nobody speaks you're language can be scary as well i'm sure for somebody that is so young.
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What's his face on OSU did, but I think he's Italian
 


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