So about all the security, what is the real

[oak_street1981]

story?

The U must be spending thousands every week on this excessive screening at the gates.

At Williams, and Mariucci Arenas there is not anything close to this.

Do other D1 programs in the B10 and around the country screen the fans to this degree?

Is this really about Homeland Security requests or a desire to set a tough precedent in year one with regards to student and fan drinking?

Do you really think they pat down and question fans like this in the SEC, or the MAC for that matter? I do not recall anything like this at any Big Ten venue recently either.


I do not recall every waiting at the gate or being checked like we do to get into TCF at other college football stadiums I have been to in the last 8 years. (Kent St, Tulsa, Michigan, Wisc., Iowa, Mich. State, California plus bowl games)

I asked some supervisor (when I could speak between bull horn bellowing by the security person) at gate B why the security was so different than at Williams Arena, and he had no answer.

If it works at Williams and Marriucci why would football need to be treated differently?

 

[GoAUpher]

story?

The U must be spending thousands every week on this excessive screening at the gates.

At Williams, and Mariucci Arenas there is not anything close to this.

Do other D1 programs in the B10 and around the country screen the fans to this degree?

Is this really about Homeland Security requests or a desire to set a tough precedent in year one with regards to student and fan drinking?

Do you really think they pat down and question fans like this in the SEC, or the MAC for that matter? I do not recall anything like this at any Big Ten venue recently either.


I do not recall every waiting at the gate or being checked like we do to get into TCF at other college football stadiums I have been to in the last 8 years. (Kent St, Tulsa, Michigan, Wisc., Iowa, Mich. State, California plus bowl games)

I asked some supervisor (when I could speak between bull horn bellowing by the security person) at gate B why the security was so different than at Williams Arena, and he had no answer.

If it works at Williams and Marriucci why would football need to be treated differently?

I think folks need to start e-mailing about it because it sounds like its getting ridiculous. It hasn't been a thing for me but obviously my experience is not the same as many others.

 

[GopherJack]

I was in KC two weekends ago for the Twins series at Kaufmann stadium. Walked right in without ever being frisked or checked. Didn't really see any of it going on at the stadium.

 

[Ron Johnson Super Fan]

Personally I think that having security is a good thing. When you have a crowd of 50,000+ people tightly congregated in a small area I don't want people to come in carrying whatever they want. Consider how many people were killed on 9/11 and then consider how many people could be killed if something was tried inside a stadium or an arena. I think that being frisked by security is a small sacrifice to make to try and prevent something like that from happening.

Have the security checks really been that painful or is it just another thing for the professional complainers in this state to complain about?

 

[skoalvikings]

Personally I think that having security is a good thing. When you have a crowd of 50,000+ people tightly congregated in a small area I don't want people to come in carrying whatever they want. Consider how many people were killed on 9/11 and then consider how many people could be killed if something was tried inside a stadium or an arena. I think that being frisked by security is a small sacrifice to make to try and prevent something like that from happening.

Have the security checks really been that painful or is it just another thing for the professional complainers in this state to complain about?

I agree. Either they have no security or good security. Pick one. The first couple of games they had bad security, which is the worst option.

 

[Rick Mons]

So what's the real complaint? I've not had to wait more than a couple of minutes to get into the stadium using Gate B or the gate between B & C (where there's a ramp rather than the steps). We usually go into the stadium about 30-45 minutes before kick-off and there's really no major inconvenience or issue IMO.

Or is the real complaint that it's more difficult to bring in a flask or other container with alcohol?

 

[Hatsofftothee]

Personally I think that having security is a good thing. When you have a crowd of 50,000+ people tightly congregated in a small area I don't want people to come in carrying whatever they want. Consider how many people were killed on 9/11 and then consider how many people could be killed if something was tried inside a stadium or an arena. I think that being frisked by security is a small sacrifice to make to try and prevent something like that from happening.

Have the security checks really been that painful or is it just another thing for the professional complainers in this state to complain about?

Uh, Super Fan, I don't think they are frisking people to see if they are about to hijack a commercial airliner, so 9/11 may not be the exact problem they are worrying about.

Anyway, if "something was tried," it would be just as horrific outside the stadium, where there is a huge crowd of people waiting around to get through the security check.

 

[tjgopher]

So what's the real complaint?

I think the biggest complaint is that there have been at least 15,000 empty seats at the start of the game each of the last two weeks. This is happening while those 15,000 people are waiting in LONG lines outside to get in. That should not happen.

They are spending lots of money on security, so I have no idea why they don't spread them out and open all of the gates to let people in. It is so badly bottle-necked 15 minutes before kickoff it isn't funny. I know people will say try to get in earlier, but I still think you should be able to get to your seat by kickoff if you're trying to get in 15 minutes prior to kickoff. A brand new stadium should offer people that. I mean we're only dealing with trying to get 50,000 people into a state of the art, brand new facility that is designed to make things convenient. This isn't old, antiquated 100,000 seat joints like at PSU or OSU or Michigan. Those big gates on the plaza are PERFECT to get people in efficiently, yet they are closed. Hire more people to frisk and open those gates!

 

[Ron Johnson Super Fan]

Uh, Super Fan, I don't think they are frisking people to see if they are about to hijack a commercial airliner, so 9/11 may not be the exact problem they are worrying about.

Anyway, if "something was tried," it would be just as horrific outside the stadium, where there is a huge crowd of people waiting around to get through the security check.

I think that the Department of Homeland Security would disagree that 9/11 isn't relevant to a stadium setting. The next terrorist attack isn't likely to involve an airliner. It will be different.

I would have to disagree that more damage could be done outside the stadium. There are more people and more people per square foot inside the stadium. Sure, something horrific could happen outside the security checkpoints. However, the point is to make a stadium as hard of a target as possible. I don't think that the answer is to wave the white flag.

 

[Ron Johnson Super Fan]

I think the biggest complaint is that there have been at least 15,000 empty seats at the start of the game each of the last two weeks. This is happening while those 15,000 people are waiting in LONG lines outside to get in. That should not happen.

Then I think that they need to look at the flow of people at each gate because people seem to be having a different experience than I have had. The last two weeks we shut down the tailgate at 10:35, walked to Gate B and were in our seats almost 10 minutes prior to kickoff. Are there some gates that are being used by more people than others?

 

[tjgopher]

Then I think that they need to look at the flow of people at each gate because people seem to be having a different experience than I have had. The last two weeks we shut down the tailgate at 10:35, walked to Gate B and were in our seats almost 10 minutes prior to kickoff. Are there some gates that are being used by more people than others?

Gates E and D are absolutely ridiculous. HUGE lines.

 

[vinko bogataj]

Agreed

Gates E and D are absolutely ridiculous. HUGE lines.

I had a couple of unused tix (2 of our party backed out last minute), so I took off from our tailgate about 40 min prior to kickoof. Sold the tix about at kickoff. I expected to wait since I was much later than usual, but, I didn't get to my seat until there were 6 minutes left in the first quarter. I waited in line behind a very nice couple at Gate D, both of them were around age 75 if I had to guess. Well, guess what it was cold so they decided to gear up. The pat down was ridiculous. Lady goes first in ladies line, screener gives her the no pat down pat down. Husband next line over has to remove his hat, unzip his coat and explain his wallet and keys. He was clean. From a timing standpoint, this takes at least a minute. Unreal. Anyone who thinks this is about homeland security is a complete idiot, if it were the same precautions would be taken at Williams and the Mooch. THEY ARE NOT. This is fully about preventing folks from bringing in alcohol. While we can discuss the merits of the alcohol ban all we want, the fact of the matter is that the security set up is diminishing the gameday experience we want to build. While the easy answer is to get to the game earlier, that view is decidedly short sighted. One of the primary motivators for building the stadium was to create an atmosphere. That includes tailgating, hitting the bars, visiting MacNamara, or reliving old days on the Mall. The idea is not, nor never was to get folks to the game a half hour before and off campus a half hour after. The University has done a surprisingly good job with the move and all its affiliated challenges, but the lines are something that need to be dealt with for both the fan experience and to provide the team support from the first whistle. Lastly, while I don't smuggle booze into the game, if some 75 year old guy who has sat through decades of bad football wants a snoot of brandy and goes to the trouble of flasking up, I say let the man be.

 

[Rick Mons]

if some 75 year old guy who has sat through decades of bad football wants a snoot of brandy and goes to the trouble of flasking up, I say let the man be.

Couldn't disagree more. He's an "old fart" (to use the charming sobriquet that a presumed youngster tossed out in this week's thread on standing during the game).

As I approach Old-Fartness, I find that I just go crazy when intoxicated. I start humming Beatles songs but arranged for the Strings of Mantovani. I start dancing the Funky Chicken and the Twist. I complain about these new-fangled formations and how we need to go back to the classic T-formation. I tut-tut about how we simply cannot recruit "athletic" athletes and expect academic excellence and ruminate about the fallacy of Gary Russell. Sometimes I fall asleep and snore. Loudly.

We must protect the younger fans from scenes like this ... or they might opt out of becoming aged. (I'm sure some younger fans believe it's optional) ...

 

[Ron Johnson Super Fan]

Mark me down as a complete idiot if screening people entering stadiums has nothing do to with Homeland Security. Why did DHS issue a warning on 9/21/09 for stadiums around the country to be on alert? Why did Penn State recommend that their fans arrive at Beaver Stadium 30 minutes prior to kickoff due to increased screening as a result of the warning? SkoalViking noted that security was bad (less thorough) for the first couple of games. Those games happened to take place prior to 9/21/09. Maybe a coincidence, maybe not but screening people is about more than keeping alcohol out of the stadium.

 

[maliksealy]

Couldn't disagree more. He's an "old fart" (to use the charming sobriquet that a presumed youngster tossed out in this week's thread on standing during the game).

As I approach Old-Fartness, I find that I just go crazy when intoxicated. I start humming Beatles songs but arranged for the Strings of Mantovani. I start dancing the Funky Chicken and the Twist. I complain about these new-fangled formations and how we need to go back to the classic T-formation. I tut-tut about how we simply cannot recruit "athletic" athletes and expect academic excellence and ruminate about the fallacy of Gary Russell. Sometimes I fall asleep and snore. Loudly.

We must protect the younger fans from scenes like this ... or they might opt out of becoming aged. (I'm sure some younger fans believe it's optional) ...

There you go again Rick...using big words and what not, trying to impress everyone
Ha, I'm just messin'...I do get a kick out of reading your posts though.

 

[ulfr]

I have abandoned D in favor of B because tailgaters wait longer. The south side of the stadium has thousands streaming up from the shuttles and parking structures in that direction. Come 40 to 60 minutes before the game and breeze right in the north gates.

 

[Firejumper]

I sit on the visitor side, with a great view of McNamara Center and the adjacent streets. For the Wisky game, people in maroon/gold were wandering across the streets adjacent to McNamara towards the stadium halfway thru the first quarter. And I mean lots of people. So many of these types that they were backed up at the nearest plaza gate. Get to the damn game on time.

 

[vinko bogataj]

Couldn't disagree more. He's an "old fart" (to use the charming sobriquet that a presumed youngster tossed out in this week's thread on standing during the game).

As I approach Old-Fartness, I find that I just go crazy when intoxicated. I start humming Beatles songs but arranged for the Strings of Mantovani. I start dancing the Funky Chicken and the Twist. I complain about these new-fangled formations and how we need to go back to the classic T-formation. I tut-tut about how we simply cannot recruit "athletic" athletes and expect academic excellence and ruminate about the fallacy of Gary Russell. Sometimes I fall asleep and snore. Loudly.

We must protect the younger fans from scenes like this ... or they might opt out of becoming aged. (I'm sure some younger fans believe it's optional) ...

Funky Chicken!!! I like it. While I don't always agree with you Rick, I always appreciate your point of view. In this case, we are on the same page. I sit in 135 and we had as many or more younger fans leaving as we did older ones. I am part of the "lost generation" of Gopher fans in that 30-50 age group at 39 and think the age battle is a complete waste of time. Younger fans should have some appreciation for the loyalty that our older fans have. Consider, a 75 year old fan was around 27 when our program last went to a Rose Bowl. For that fan to perservere and stick with this program speaks volumes to that person's sense of loyalty. Conversely, older fans sometimes have trouble accepting that things change, attitudes change, etc... I think that the older fans sometimes need to roll with the changes and understand that the younger fan brings the energy and enthusiasm that our fanbase needs so very desperately. We can all learn from each other and we all bring something to the table (even Ron Johnson Super Fan ). Kudo's to Rick for bringing reasoned argument to the board on a regular basis (even if I don't always agree).

 

[vinko bogataj]

Mark me down as a complete idiot if screening people entering stadiums has nothing do to with Homeland Security. Why did DHS issue a warning on 9/21/09 for stadiums around the country to be on alert? Why did Penn State recommend that their fans arrive at Beaver Stadium 30 minutes prior to kickoff due to increased screening as a result of the warning? SkoalViking noted that security was bad (less thorough) for the first couple of games. Those games happened to take place prior to 9/21/09. Maybe a coincidence, maybe not but screening people is about more than keeping alcohol out of the stadium.

OK, maybe I overstated, you are not a complete idiot, only partial . Just kidding, I do however, disagree with a couple of points. I realize that you aren't SkoalViking, but the security at the Air Force game was anything but lax. Look back at the threads and also recall Maturi discussing at length the line situation both with respect to getting into the game and at concessions. Hence, the Cal game went much more smoothly. Things seem to have regressed since then IMO. Secondly, to use your own numbers against you... if Penn State is recommending their 109K fans get to the games 30 min prior to kick, it would seem reasonable to assume they feel if all 109K are there a half hour before the game they can be processed through security. Doing the quick math that equates to roughly 3,633 fans per minute. If we need the 45 minutes that some here suggest that works out to (@ 50,805) 1,129 fans per minute through the gates. Why would PSU be able to handle 3x the fans/minute than we do? Theoretically, we should be able to process our fans within 15 minutes using the PSU fan/minute logic. Anyways, I still would argue that even if we need to stick with the strict security, we can do it better and faster. Likewise, lets use some common sense, I am unaware of any NSA bulletins highlighting use of 75 year old caucasian couples from outstate Minnesota as al qaida or even Posse Comitatus as mules to carry WMD.

 

[Ron Johnson Super Fan]

I absolutely agree that screening isn't being done in the most efficient and intelligent manner. I was just making the point that I feel its a necessary process and something that needs to be done.

 

[Hatsofftothee]

I had a couple of unused tix (2 of our party backed out last minute), so I took off from our tailgate about 40 min prior to kickoof. Sold the tix about at kickoff. I expected to wait since I was much later than usual, but, I didn't get to my seat until there were 6 minutes left in the first quarter. I waited in line behind a very nice couple at Gate D, both of them were around age 75 if I had to guess. Well, guess what it was cold so they decided to gear up. The pat down was ridiculous. Lady goes first in ladies line, screener gives her the no pat down pat down. Husband next line over has to remove his hat, unzip his coat and explain his wallet and keys. He was clean. From a timing standpoint, this takes at least a minute. Unreal. Anyone who thinks this is about homeland security is a complete idiot, if it were the same precautions would be taken at Williams and the Mooch. THEY ARE NOT. This is fully about preventing folks from bringing in alcohol. While we can discuss the merits of the alcohol ban all we want, the fact of the matter is that the security set up is diminishing the gameday experience we want to build. While the easy answer is to get to the game earlier, that view is decidedly short sighted. One of the primary motivators for building the stadium was to create an atmosphere. That includes tailgating, hitting the bars, visiting MacNamara, or reliving old days on the Mall. The idea is not, nor never was to get folks to the game a half hour before and off campus a half hour after. The University has done a surprisingly good job with the move and all its affiliated challenges, but the lines are something that need to be dealt with for both the fan experience and to provide the team support from the first whistle. Lastly, while I don't smuggle booze into the game, if some 75 year old guy who has sat through decades of bad football wants a snoot of brandy and goes to the trouble of flasking up, I say let the man be.

The other problem with traffic flow is the little bar code readers they have for the tickets. They take too long to give the desired read-out (which presumably proves you don't have a counterfeit ticket). Even after you get through security, there's another significant wait before you actually get into the stadium.

 

[GoAUpher]

Ron Johnson~
The only issue with the "it must be DHS related" is that plenty of other stadiums (including the Dome during the same period of time) aren't running their security this way. The DHS alert was a blanket alert to stadiums so that means 1 of 2 things: 1) TCF security if over the top or 2) other stadiums aren't doing their jobs. Ultimately while I appreciate and respect the need for security, the kind of screening that the yellow coats at TCF can do is completely inadequate to stop anyone with half a brain and the motivation to cause trouble. It's security theater.

EDIT: And of course you responded to this point while I was posting it. =)

 

[GopherJack]

The other problem with traffic flow is the little bar code readers they have for the tickets. They take too long to give the desired read-out (which presumably proves you don't have a counterfeit ticket). Even after you get through security, there's another significant wait before you actually get into the stadium.

Agreed! At the dome, the ticket readers were super fast. They just scanned them at the turnstile and there was no aligning the laser light to the bar code by hand, etc......

 

[GoAUpher]

FWIW, Michigan is banning bags from Michigan Stadium for the rest of the season.