Pat Forde on NU: "...most underachieving basketball program in America"


Did the Trolls go to the NW site to bash Carmody? Watching him put his head in his hands near the end, I just know he was thinking..."Oh no, not again..."
 

Certainly not more underachieving than Minnesota (not a Tubby comment, no NCAA tournament wins in 15 years, no NCAA seed higher than 7 in that same time span and I don't believe they've finished higher than 4th in the conference). I think most acknowledge that Northwestern competes with a hand tied behind their back, so I am not sure what else Carmody could/should do. I agree that you have to make a change at some point, but I don't think that time is now for Northwestern.
 

NU had three players named in the post season coaches awards including the all time leading scorer for NU.

I don't get the unconditional love for Carmody either. Team defense is very coachable even with a lack of athleticism.
 

From the NU board, sounds like a familiar rant.

"I was pretty much behind the NU bench today. Furthermore, I've been in regular attendance the past few years.

I have a few good friends on the team, though I'm not a Northwestern fan by trade (Michigan). I'm not here to "flame" you, or whatever. I just thought you guys have suffered enough, and deserve the truth.

The players just really, really don't like Bill Carmody. They have almost no respect for him whatsoever. And honestly, it's not hard to see why.

I'm sure you've all noticed his antics on the sidelines, and have probably dismissed them as no worse than any other coach. On the surface, no. But he's different. Coaches like Tom Izzo will get in their player's faces when it's called for, but more than anything, they teach. Carmody rants about the game to the players on the bench. Generally, he just sounds like a bitter fan. After a late turnover, myself and a bunch of the team parents heard him yell to the bench, "you guys don't want this. You just don't want this, it's over." This was a one possession game at that point, if you'll recall. But rather than controlling his temper and trying to pull out a victory, he just goes stream of consciousness to all the players sitting out. In overtime, he yelled, "we can't stop them. We've got nothing." Again, the entire family section heard him.

This is just a terrible attitude to take. A team's mentality usually reflects that of it's coach. Did you wonder why no one wanted the ball in the last 10 minutes? Or why NU keeps dropping close ones? It's because mental fortitude starts with the head coach, and Carmody has none.

There are guys on the team who, by nature, could be closers. Carmody beats it out of them early, albeit unintentionally. I'm sure you've all noticed his proclivity to pull young/non star players the instant they make a poor play, and then sit them for long periods. He coaches with his emotions, not his head. It absolutely ruins the confidence of a young player - sending the message to a guy that messing up means bench just tightens them up even more.

The team simply doesn't respect his childish demeanor on the floor, or understand many of his coaching decisions. He's just not a very friendly or social guy. The latter is one of the main reasons he's struggled recruiting high profile players. He's a very intelligent X's and O's coach, but he's just not good with people. A couple of the guys have told me he just doesn't get it - he doesn't understand how much his poor demeanor and reactionary subs affect the team. This isn't even getting in to his stubbornness with guys like Hearn, Luka, etc.

I don't mean to put all of this on him. Obviously, in the end, the players play. And there's no doubt he's a capable talent evaluator and strategic mind. But I'm telling you with the utmost of inside information that he will never be able to coach this team above it's current status. He's not a bad person, but he needs to go if NU basketball is ever going to take the next step.

Again, I have no affiliation with Northwestern besides it's players. I post this with no bitterness or post loss anger. I've held this stuff back for awhile, but tonight was somewhat of a boiling point. The families of the players are absolutely disgusted with him, and while they're obviously biased, that's a pretty telling sign. I'm sure the temptation exists to point to the players as soft. Truthfully, they arn't. They still give their all. They practice and play with every ounce of dedication they have. It isn't a state of outright revolt between players and coaches, or of primadonnas pouting. Not even close. These guys have been suffering Carmody's foolishness in silence; they do their best to follow his instruction. I just figured you all, who dedicate so much to this team, deserved better. "
 


Certainly not more underachieving than Minnesota (not a Tubby comment, no NCAA tournament wins in 15 years, no NCAA seed higher than 7 in that same time span and I don't believe they've finished higher than 4th in the conference). I think most acknowledge that Northwestern competes with a hand tied behind their back, so I am not sure what else Carmody could/should do. I agree that you have to make a change at some point, but I don't think that time is now for Northwestern.

For cripes sakes. Northwestern doesn't have a monopoly on tough academic standards. Other schools have tough standards and make the dance on a semi regular basis. (Stanford)
 

From the NU board, sounds like a familiar rant.

"I was pretty much behind the NU bench today. Furthermore, I've been in regular attendance the past few years.

I have a few good friends on the team, though I'm not a Northwestern fan by trade (Michigan). I'm not here to "flame" you, or whatever. I just thought you guys have suffered enough, and deserve the truth.

The players just really, really don't like Bill Carmody. They have almost no respect for him whatsoever. And honestly, it's not hard to see why.

I'm sure you've all noticed his antics on the sidelines, and have probably dismissed them as no worse than any other coach. On the surface, no. But he's different. Coaches like Tom Izzo will get in their player's faces when it's called for, but more than anything, they teach. Carmody rants about the game to the players on the bench. Generally, he just sounds like a bitter fan. After a late turnover, myself and a bunch of the team parents heard him yell to the bench, "you guys don't want this. You just don't want this, it's over." This was a one possession game at that point, if you'll recall. But rather than controlling his temper and trying to pull out a victory, he just goes stream of consciousness to all the players sitting out. In overtime, he yelled, "we can't stop them. We've got nothing." Again, the entire family section heard him.

This is just a terrible attitude to take. A team's mentality usually reflects that of it's coach. Did you wonder why no one wanted the ball in the last 10 minutes? Or why NU keeps dropping close ones? It's because mental fortitude starts with the head coach, and Carmody has none.

There are guys on the team who, by nature, could be closers. Carmody beats it out of them early, albeit unintentionally. I'm sure you've all noticed his proclivity to pull young/non star players the instant they make a poor play, and then sit them for long periods. He coaches with his emotions, not his head. It absolutely ruins the confidence of a young player - sending the message to a guy that messing up means bench just tightens them up even more.

The team simply doesn't respect his childish demeanor on the floor, or understand many of his coaching decisions. He's just not a very friendly or social guy. The latter is one of the main reasons he's struggled recruiting high profile players. He's a very intelligent X's and O's coach, but he's just not good with people. A couple of the guys have told me he just doesn't get it - he doesn't understand how much his poor demeanor and reactionary subs affect the team. This isn't even getting in to his stubbornness with guys like Hearn, Luka, etc.

I don't mean to put all of this on him. Obviously, in the end, the players play. And there's no doubt he's a capable talent evaluator and strategic mind. But I'm telling you with the utmost of inside information that he will never be able to coach this team above it's current status. He's not a bad person, but he needs to go if NU basketball is ever going to take the next step.

Again, I have no affiliation with Northwestern besides it's players. I post this with no bitterness or post loss anger. I've held this stuff back for awhile, but tonight was somewhat of a boiling point. The families of the players are absolutely disgusted with him, and while they're obviously biased, that's a pretty telling sign. I'm sure the temptation exists to point to the players as soft. Truthfully, they arn't. They still give their all. They practice and play with every ounce of dedication they have. It isn't a state of outright revolt between players and coaches, or of primadonnas pouting. Not even close. These guys have been suffering Carmody's foolishness in silence; they do their best to follow his instruction. I just figured you all, who dedicate so much to this team, deserved better. "

Was this a post from BigNorthwesternFan?
 


I think Illinois take the cake in terms of underachieving in the B1G.
 




I think Illinois take the cake in terms of underachieving in the B1G.

I was going to say the same thing, but in the three years prior to this one, they went 10-8, 11-7, and 9-9, better than we've done, but I don't believe they've had the same amount or quality of injuries and transfers that we have. However, they were 6-12 this year, and 5-13 the year before their three year stretch of non-losing conference records. It seems they've also brought in 6 guys 4 stars or higher (Meyers Leonard was a 5 star on Scout) in the last two years, and I think Jereme Richmond transferred. So that leaves 4 4 star freshmen, and a 4/5 star soph, so hopefully for them the next coach, assuming Weber is fired, will be able to make something of their young talented core, just like I hope Tubby is able to make something of out of Dre, Mo, Joe, Austin, Oto, Chip, and EE.
 

Vanderbilt is often in the top 25.

If 10+ years Carmody has gone .500 in the big ten once.


The most overrated coach in the country and he isn't even rated that high.
 

Now, I typically am on the "fire the underperforming coach" bandwagon when it comes to Big Ten coaches. But I don't feel that way for Carmody. His teams don't play games that are decided in the 30s or 40s, and he has an unusual style that I think adds something to the difficulty of the league. He is at a school with a history of being a doormat in the Big Ten and has had their winningest seasons in terms of win totals in their history. He is doing a good job at Northwestern. They need to upgrade their facilities and see how that improves recruiting before they should seriously consider letting Carmody go.
 






Top Bottom