More expansion chatter..

[Gopher07]

This time from Tom Dienhart, Yahoo/Rivals writer:

Big Ten expansion buzz has league adding Mizzou, Nebraska, Pitt, Rutgers and Syracuse and splitting into four, four-team divisions.

The Big Ten divisions:
Syra, Pitt, Rut., Penn St.
Mich., Wisc., Mich. St., Mnn.
Ohio St., Pur., IU, Ill./North.
MU, Iowa, Neb., Ill./NU.

http://twitter.com/TomDienhart

 

[ButchNashGuy]

I would think MN should be with Mizzou, Iowa, Neb. Would love that.

 

[GoGophers2005]

Looks like we'd be screwed in that scenario. The Penn State division would be by far the easiest....
I have a hard time seeing Nebraska move conferences. As it currently stands they are in by far the weakest division in all of college football.

 

[Too Long in the Wasteland]

I agree, this is JoePa's wet dream (assuming he still has a prostate). I don't think SCum & tOSU would be too keen on splitting up their rivalry. Likewise for us & Iowa. Not sure how rivalry games would be protected.

Geographically, aside from the cupcake east, this doesn't make any sense. The other trick is coming up with divisions that are balanced for football & basketball. In buckets, that division would NU, Nebraskduh, et al would have a hard time competing in other schools' IM leagues

 

[NateDawgUM]

I agree, this is JoePa's wet dream (assuming he still has a prostate). I don't think SCum & tOSU would be too keen on splitting up their rivalry. Likewise for us & Iowa. Not sure how rivalry games would be protected.

Geographically, aside from the cupcake east, this doesn't make any sense. The other trick is coming up with divisions that are balanced for football & basketball. In buckets, that division would NU, Nebraskduh, et al would have a hard time competing in other schools' IM leagues

A lot of conferences that split divisions for football don't split up for basketball. The division thing is more to create a conference championship game.

On the topic of this idea of 4 divisions: stupid.

 

[dpodoll68]

I have a hard time seeing Nebraska move conferences. As it currently stands they are in by far the weakest division in all of college football.

Why? Can someone please tell me why? Why do people say things like this? Is it just being over-the-top to get a reaction? It has to be. No fully functional adult can be this obtuse.

 

[[censored]]

Why? Can someone please tell me why? Why do people say things like this? Is it just being over-the-top to get a reaction? It has to be. No fully functional adult can be this obtuse.

Agreed. That's a pretty ridiculous statement.

Why would Nebraska leave the Big XII? I don't see the benefit.

 

[RaT]

There are probably about 10-15 million reasons why Nebraska would heavily consider it. $$$$$$$$$

 

[GopherGod]

Agreed. That's a pretty ridiculous statement.

Why would Nebraska leave the Big XII? I don't see the benefit.

Do I think that Nebraska will leave the Big XII, no. However I would admittedly not be as shocked if they did as I would have been in the past. The reasons Nebraska might consider the move is:

1. Money
2. The Big XII is controlled and run by Texas and many other programs are getting sick of it. Some of the examples are when Texas complained and got the Big XII offices moved from KC to Dallas. They then were the main ones who opposed an earlier TV proposal for the Big 12 in favor of starting their own so they didn't have to share the wealth at all. They have campaigned to have the Big 12 championship game permanently moved to Dallas versus having it rotating around because they do not want to have to deal with the weather in KC in December. They also refused to allow schools such as Nebraska to admit partial qualifiers as they did in the Big 8 days. This gave Texas an even greater recruiting advantage over the other schools without all the in-state talent. I know that this was a huge point of contention that upset Osborne when the Big 12 was formed and there are more than a few former Big 8 schools that would like nothing better than to give Texas the big bird and say see ya later.

 

[NateDawgUM]

Big time on #2 GopherGod.

Pretty sure that's the reason Osborne retired so quickly after the Big XII was formed.

 

[howeda7]

I'll be shocked if they do this. I think a 12th will be added, but no chance they go all the way 16 in one swoop. For one thing, that eliminates ND ever coming on board.

As for the 4 divisions, that doesnt' really make sense. Will there be semi-finals between the 4 divisions and then a final? Or will two divisions still be grouped on each side with the overall winner going to the final? I guess it would make sense for Basketball in that you would play everyone once and your 3 divisional opponents twice.

 

[[censored]]

Do I think that Nebraska will leave the Big XII, no. However I would admittedly not be as shocked if they did as I would have been in the past. The reasons Nebraska might consider the move is:

1. Money
2. The Big XII is controlled and run by Texas and many other programs are getting sick of it. Some of the examples are when Texas complained and got the Big XII offices moved from KC to Dallas. They then were the main ones who opposed an earlier TV proposal for the Big 12 in favor of starting their own so they didn't have to share the wealth at all. They have campaigned to have the Big 12 championship game permanently moved to Dallas versus having it rotating around because they do not want to have to deal with the weather in KC in December. They also refused to allow schools such as Nebraska to admit partial qualifiers as they did in the Big 8 days. This gave Texas an even greater recruiting advantage over the other schools without all the in-state talent. I know that this was a huge point of contention that upset Osborne when the Big 12 was formed and there are more than a few former Big 8 schools that would like nothing better than to give Texas the big bird and say see ya later.

Interesting. I do think Nebraska would have a better shot at winning conference titles in the Big Ten.

But what does it matter where the offices are located? And since when does Texas have it's own TV deal? I'll agree that campaigning to have the conference title game only take place in Dallas is weak sauce. And why should any school be able to admit partial qualifiers? Either you qualify or you don't. I think you should "earn" that sports scholarship by taking care of your academics.

So all in all the only thing I see Nebraska might be pissed about that I agree with hasn't even happened: Big XII title game in Dallas annually.

If Nebraska left, they would be leaving tradition behind in hopes that they could do better in the Big Ten than in the Big XII. Doesn't seem worth it to me.

 

[NateDawgUM]

If Nebraska left, they would be leaving tradition behind in hopes that they could do better in the Big Ten than in the Big XII. Doesn't seem worth it to me.

Nebraska's biggest tradition was playing Oklahoma every year, and the Big XII did away with that. They could start a non-conference series with Oklahoma and play in the Big Ten.

 

[[censored]]

Nebraska's biggest tradition was playing Oklahoma every year, and the Big XII did away with that. They could start a non-conference series with Oklahoma and play in the Big Ten.

True, but it would more of a disadvantage schedule-wise to do so. And Nebraska still plays OU, just not every year.

I just don't want to see Nebraska go anywhere. They are the only North division team in the Big XII that's got great history and longstanding rivalries with other members.

How's this. We'll trade you Iowa State for Iowa. Deal?

 

[mnboiler]

I see a possiblity of the Big XII completely breaking apart with this round of expansion. If Mizzou or any other BXII North team leaves Texas is going to try to get TCU into the BXII(they could be the best choice) and Texas will most likely be successful. There is a possibility that the rest of the BXII North pops the bird to the Texas and they form a new conference. They could grab a few team like Boise State, Memphis, Colorado State, and come up a with a decent 8 team conference.

 

[GopherOnWheels]

I see a possiblity of the Big XII completely breaking apart with this round of expansion. If Mizzou or any other BXII North team leaves Texas is going to try to get TCU into the BXII(they could be the best choice) and Texas will most likely be successful. There is a possibility that the rest of the BXII North pops the bird to the Texas and they form a new conference. They could grab a few team like Boise State, Memphis, Colorado State, and come up a with a decent 8 team conference.

Completely agree. Big XII will fall apart it's just a matter of when. If we snag Mizzou, the North and therefore the rest of the Big XII will just implode

 

[GopherGod]

Interesting. I do think Nebraska would have a better shot at winning conference titles in the Big Ten.

But what does it matter where the offices are located? And since when does Texas have it's own TV deal? I'll agree that campaigning to have the conference title game only take place in Dallas is weak sauce. And why should any school be able to admit partial qualifiers? Either you qualify or you don't. I think you should "earn" that sports scholarship by taking care of your academics.

So all in all the only thing I see Nebraska might be pissed about that I agree with hasn't even happened: Big XII title game in Dallas annually.

If Nebraska left, they would be leaving tradition behind in hopes that they could do better in the Big Ten than in the Big XII. Doesn't seem worth it to me.

Moving the offices on the direction of Texas was just another example of Texas getting what they wanted, even on insignificant matters such as this. This just showed that Texas was not and is not willing to compromise on anything. Texas does not have its own TV deal yet but they are and were exploring it and therefore were against a Big XII conference wide TV deal when it was proposed. In essence, Texas cost the rest of the schools a lot of money and have contributed heavily to where the conference is now with being left out in the cold on a TV deal when the conference had the opportunity in the past. The insistance of Texas to get rid of the partial qualifers was just another example of Texas not being willing to compromise at all. Most schools only had 1-2 partial qualifiers at most in most seasons and the players were not eligible to play and had to get their academics in order to play the following year. The exclusion of partial qualifiers will never change again but again was just another example during the formation of the Big 12 of Texas threatening on every issue they received resistance on to take their ball and go to the Pac-10. It is also important to remember at that time that it was the Big 8 bringing in a Texas that was not good at the time and was in a dying conference(SWC).

 

[[censored]]

Moving the offices on the direction of Texas was just another example of Texas getting what they wanted, even on insignificant matters such as this. This just showed that Texas was not and is not willing to compromise on anything. Texas does not have its own TV deal yet but they are and were exploring it and therefore were against a Big XII conference wide TV deal when it was proposed. In essence, Texas cost the rest of the schools a lot of money and have contributed heavily to where the conference is now with being left out in the cold on a TV deal when the conference had the opportunity in the past. The insistance of Texas to get rid of the partial qualifers was just another example of Texas not being willing to compromise at all. Most schools only had 1-2 partial qualifiers at most in most seasons and the players were not eligible to play and had to get their academics in order to play the following year. The exclusion of partial qualifiers will never change again but again was just another example during the formation of the Big 12 of Texas threatening on every issue they received resistance on to take their ball and go to the Pac-10. It is also important to remember at that time that it was the Big 8 bringing in a Texas that was not good at the time and was in a dying conference(SWC).

The question remains, what does it matter where the offices are?

And as far as dealing with Texas, well that's the way it goes I suppose. If Texas has to share all its bowl money with the rest of the Big XII, then they should have a say in some things. I doubt they killed the TV deal with the Big XII. I'd really like to see an article about that. The Big XII is all over the TV. ABC, FSSW (which sucks), TBS, etc. It's not like Texas made a move to make it impossible for the rest of the Big XII to get on TV. They obviously didn't.

And who cares what shape Texas was in when the Big 8 brought in Texas. If they were in that poor of shape and shouldn't have had much say so in the conference rules etc, then why bring them in? Maybe the Big 8 people brought this on their selves and they are regretting it now because Texas is killing it. Seems like they brought this to their own front door.

 

[Zeppelin Gopher]

If Nebraska is invited into the Big Ten, they are 99% certain to accept. Same thing with Mizzou.

The Big XII is going to implode within a few years.

Censored, you're pretty out of the loop as far as expansion talk and the severe issues within the Big XII. Check out http://frankthetank.wordpress.com/. Its the best place for conference expansion speculation and features some very informed comments as well.

 

[GopherGod]

The question remains, what does it matter where the offices are?

And as far as dealing with Texas, well that's the way it goes I suppose. If Texas has to share all its bowl money with the rest of the Big XII, then they should have a say in some things. I doubt they killed the TV deal with the Big XII. I'd really like to see an article about that. The Big XII is all over the TV. ABC, FSSW (which sucks), TBS, etc. It's not like Texas made a move to make it impossible for the rest of the Big XII to get on TV. They obviously didn't.

And who cares what shape Texas was in when the Big 8 brought in Texas. If they were in that poor of shape and shouldn't have had much say so in the conference rules etc, then why bring them in? Maybe the Big 8 people brought this on their selves and they are regretting it now because Texas is killing it. Seems like they brought this to their own front door.

It doesn't matter really where they are but is often sighted as just another example of Texas always getting the final say on matters with the Big 12. Even on a tiny issue that is as insignificant as this, Texas advocated for this and got their way. They have not been willing to compromise on virtually anything, even the small items. This attitude is the main source of frustration for many Big 12 teams.

 

[[censored]]

If Nebraska is invited into the Big Ten, they are 99% certain to accept. Same thing with Mizzou.

The Big XII is going to implode within a few years.

Censored, you're pretty out of the loop as far as expansion talk and the severe issues within the Big XII. Check out http://frankthetank.wordpress.com/. Its the best place for conference expansion speculation and features some very informed comments as well.

I'll admit that I'm out of the loop with this stuff, so thanks for the link.

 

[JoeDirt]

Agreed. That's a pretty ridiculous statement.

Why would Nebraska leave the Big XII? I don't see the benefit.

at least $10,000,000 a year in added T.V. revenue, do you see the benefit now?

 

[magpie]

4x4 for 16 is the worst idea I've heard yet. Hopefully this "buzz" is bs.

 

[gophmeister]

4x4 for 16 is the worst idea I've heard yet. Hopefully this "buzz" is bs.

I really hope ND says yes and saves the rest of the college sports world the anguish and upheaval. I would say that's the best of all possible solutions not only for us, college football and the like, but for ND too. I doubt they'll like the consequences of not entering the fold. I would hate to see 16 teams. It would detract from the annual rivalries and really chew up and spit out the identity of the conference.

However, I know these changes are inevitable and when they come, the one thing I hope they do, is increase the number of conference games. Honestly, if we're going to have a super conference let's spare the individual ADs from having to schedule 4 non-conference games a year. Also the conference should try to work with other conferences to barter deals for non-conference games. You send Baylor to Indiana and we'll send Michigan to Oklahoma, etc.

 

[royboy]

Why? Can someone please tell me why? Why do people say things like this? Is it just being over-the-top to get a reaction? It has to be. No fully functional adult can be this obtuse.

He said weakest division. Why do you assume he meant Big XII and not Big XII North? If he meant Big XII North, he's right and you're calling people names for no reason.

 

[[censored]]

He said weakest division. Why do you assume he meant Big XII and not Big XII North? If he meant Big XII North, he's right and you're calling people names for no reason.

Actually he said weakest division in all of college football, which means both you and he are wrong. There are other divisions in college football that are weaker. Both divisions of the MAC are obviously weaker. Both divisions of Conference USA are weaker. All of the Sun Belt and WAC teams are weaker. You catch my drift.

I think the Big XII South is one of the strongest divisions in all of college football, so maybe it's strength just highlights how weak the North is in comparison. Texas, Oklahoma, Texas Tech, Oklahoma State, Texas A&M, and hell even Baylor is on the road to be decent now. That's tough.

 

[royboy]

Actually he said weakest division in all of college football, which means both you and he are wrong. There are other divisions in college football that are weaker. Both divisions of the MAC are obviously weaker. Both divisions of Conference USA are weaker. All of the Sun Belt and WAC teams are weaker. You catch my drift.

Use your head man. Most of d1 and all of d2 and d3 are much weaker but of course that's not what he meant.

The Big XII North is weak for BCS. Minnesota could even win it. Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, Colorado, Mizz, Neb. You could say Big East but they have 8 teams to beat and Big XII North only has 6.

 

[GoAUpher]

Use your head man. Most of d1 and all of d2 and d3 are much weaker but of course that's not what he meant.

The Big XII North is weak for BCS. Minnesota could even win it. Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, Colorado, Mizz, Neb. You could say Big East but they have 8 teams to beat and Big XII North only has 6.

You're telling him to use his head? The one who should use their head is the one making the statement that is totally false (as you agree is true). Hyperbole happens, I've been guilty of it before. But don't start pointing fingers at the people who call it out by saying we're obscuring what he meant. If he wants to clarify the ridiculous statement he can walk it back like the rest of us do when we realize we're being silly. Or he can double down and get more ridicule.

 

[royboy]

You're telling him to use his head? The one who should use their head is the one making the statement that is totally false (as you agree is true). Hyperbole happens, I've been guilty of it before. But don't start pointing fingers at the people who call it out by saying we're obscuring what he meant. If he wants to clarify the ridiculous statement he can walk it back like the rest of us do when we realize we're being silly. Or he can double down and get more ridicule.

I can't speak for him but I thought my own post was clear. If not I will clarify. The Big XII North is the weakest division in the major football conferences.

 

[AhliBobwa]

Completely agree. Big XII will fall apart it's just a matter of when. If we snag Mizzou, the North and therefore the rest of the Big XII will just implode

THIS is correct. It's also why the Big Ten would be stupid to break up the Big 12. If the Big Ten breaks up the Big 12 without snagging Texas, then it's only a matter of time before Texas goes to the Pac-Ten.

If the Pac-Ten has USC and Texas, then all the 'experts' will proclaim the SEC and Pac Ten to be superior to all the other conferences. The winners of those two conferences would usually meet in the National Title Game. And the Big Ten would be everybody's whipping boy.

That would be utter disaster.