Mbakwe first underachieving game since becomming healthy.

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march madness

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The starters played an incredible amount of minutes, especially in the second half.
Trevor only getting 5 shots, and I am guessing 1 was an offensive putback.

Some teams have not used the zone against us more because of our offensive rebounding, especially Trevor's. Iowa matched us on the boards.

Coaches can tell their teams "if you out-hustle minnesota on the boards and to loose balls we will win". As most teams can shoot better and take care of the ball better.

When you have only 2 3pt shooters on the court it is easier to zone a team. It is hard to get Mav and an improving overall Welch on the court as they have other deficencies with their defense.

It is scary that Iowa could have beaten us with White having a below average game and Marble being worthless. Iowa has lots of guys who can hit the three. McCabe is a hard matchup as Trevor isn't used to guarding post guys on the 3 pt line.

Andre has a nice all round game. His step back shot was off. I would have liked to see him try some cross overs into the lane. He has a good first step I would think he could beat Gesell to the basket?

I would triangle and 2 our starters, playing man on both Hollins guards. You could zone the rest as none of the other 3 can make an outside shot very often. Especially if we are not dominating the boards.

I wonder if we could start Welch, move Austin to the 3, and bring Coleman off the bench for some scoring?
 

A lot of points. I will respond to one. To me, it appears that Trevor is frustrated about not getting the ball. He should be the strength of the team inside and they are failing to get him the ball in a place where he can score. That has to be draining on him. He also looks exhausted to me and does not have the "motor" he had earlier in the season.
 

Holy Man said:
A lot of points. I will respond to one. To me, it appears that Trevor is frustrated about not getting the ball. He should be the strength of the team inside and they are failing to get him the ball in a place where he can score. That has to be draining on him. He also looks exhausted to me and does not have the "motor" he had earlier in the season.
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I think you are right HM. They should be looking ot get the ball into the post every time up court but it's not happening very often at all. Trevor had very few touches yesterday. If the ball goes into him repeatedly then you can play the inside out game. If he is kicking back out when double teamed the Hollins boys will knock wide open three down more often than not. Part of their problem seems to be that they reverse the ball so slowly that we can't get passing lanes into the bigs. It's ugly right now on offense. Stand around and then someone go one on one or shoot. They are trying to screen but the screens are not real timely or strong enough to spring anyone.
 

I thought part of Trevor's problem yesterday was he was going up against a player for much of the game that was about a half-a-foot taller than he was (Woodbury) and who was strong and physical. That's a lot to ask of Mbakwe (that's about 6-7 vs. 7-1). In addition, if you paid close attention, I'm guessing Iowa must have coached up their bigs to grasp at Mbakwe's hands/wrist/arms when he was rebounding on the defensive side. He had a couple of one-handed rebounds because his other hands was under the grips of an Iowa player. In fact, the one he lost out of bounds appeared to me be because he was getting his other arm held. I'm not a conspiracy guy, but I wonder if the Iowa coaches figured that approach would not only help them possibly rebound better, but knowing Trevor had a bad/injured wrist, would weaken him or get him out of the game.
 



tjgopher said:
I thought part of Trevor's problem yesterday was he was going up against a player for much of the game that was about a half-a-foot taller than he was (Woodbury) and who was strong and physical. That's a lot to ask of Mbakwe (that's about 6-7 vs. 7-1). In addition, if you paid close attention, I'm guessing Iowa must have coached up their bigs to grasp at Mbakwe's hands/wrist/arms when he was rebounding on the defensive side. He had a couple of one-handed rebounds because his other hands was under the grips of an Iowa player. In fact, the one he lost out of bounds appeared to me be because he was getting his other arm held. I'm not a conspiracy guy, but I wonder if the Iowa coaches figured that approach would not only help them possibly rebound better, but knowing Trevor had a bad/injured wrist, would weaken him or get him out of the game.
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Yes, I think you nailed. How many times did he only get one mitt on a rebound only to see it roll out of bounds. I have to think his bad wrist is getting pulled and hacked quite a bit now.

Trevor doesn't get the benefit of the doubt on foul calls either (in my opinion).
 

This is not directed at Trevor specifically, but the Gophs in general seem to let the officiating get them rattled. You frequently see players either talking to the refs, or doing the "wave arms around and look frustrated" routine. I can remember Coleman and Eliason both doing that vs. Iowa. They have to learn to play through the officiating, and adjust their game accordingly.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
This is not directed at Trevor specifically, but the Gophs in general seem to let the officiating get them rattled. You frequently see players either talking to the refs, or doing the "wave arms around and look frustrated" routine. I can remember Coleman and Eliason both doing that vs. Iowa. They have to learn to play through the officiating, and adjust their game accordingly.
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I totally agree and as a parent, I could see why the Refs wouldn't want to "reward" that type of behaviour.
 

I love B1G basketball, however I hate the officiating in the conference. Eliason had a crybaby moment, but other than that I thought the guys were as composed as could be. And if you get to watch the replay of that game. Watch the end of the game, Coleman makes driving layup after hurdling Basabe (who fell in the way) and shot over a guy that may or may not hit his hand. Timeout is called on floor immediately after basket. Coleman waves his hands like "where is the foul"....Jim Burr (I believe) does the same gesture right back at him. Despite your thoughts on whether that was a good no-call or not, what the hell is Jim Burr doing?
 



Shawn Bradley Guy said:
I love B1G basketball, however I hate the officiating in the conference. Eliason had a crybaby moment, but other than that I thought the guys were as composed as could be. And if you get to watch the replay of that game. Watch the end of the game, Coleman makes driving layup after hurdling Basabe (who fell in the way) and shot over a guy that may or may not hit his hand. Timeout is called on floor immediately after basket. Coleman waves his hands like "where is the foul"....Jim Burr (I believe) does the same gesture right back at him. Despite your thoughts on whether that was a good no-call or not, what the hell is Jim Burr doing?
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I saw Burr do that too and could not believe it. Completely unprofessional.
 


nokomismod said:
I totally agree and as a parent, I could see why the Refs wouldn't want to "reward" that type of behaviour.
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And yet they reward coaches like Bo Ryan and Coach K all the time. I think coaches are way out of hand more than the players. Refs mess up but it's a tough job and some coaches act like little 7 year olds having a temper tantrum whenever a call doesn't go their way. Part of it is the refs fault though as they allow it to happen. How many times has Bo Ryan been given a 't' in his career?
 

bleedsmaroonandgold said:
I thought the gesture was pretty immature from both people who did it.
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That's fine, but you're really going to compare a guy who has been reffing for years and years tons sophomore in college? Players do that ALL the time at ALL levels. You don't have to like it, but I have never seen a ref do that before, ever.
 



Welch

JimmyJamesMD said:
Huh?
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Improving is the sense that he started this year atrociously, and he is now at least hitting the occassional 3. When teams go zone on us, we need either Welch or Mav in the game to get us a 3rd long range shooter. I wish they were better at other parts of their game. I think either is fine as the second ball handler. I think either could guard Gesell as he is not a burner.
 

when trevor does get a post pass, its usually too late... the D has had a chance to re-establish and 'root' him out.

its very hard to work in the post 1-on-1 with a D that is set.. he could only come up with that one 'jump' move to his left hand.

it would be nice to see him get the ball 'on the move' a bit more.. but that would require either quick touch passes or a point guard getting into the lane... something very hard to do against good B1G D's.
 

WilliamsArenaGuy said:
That's fine, but you're really going to compare a guy who has been reffing for years and years tons sophomore in college? Players do that ALL the time at ALL levels. You don't have to like it, but I have never seen a ref do that before, ever.
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Remembering back to my high school hockey days, I think if I had an interaction like that with an official, my coach would have screamed at the ref, and as soon as the ref was gone, coach would have turned to me and said "don't ever %$&*ing do that again." Then I would have been given an opportunity to work on my endurance conditioning at the next practice.
 

Holy Man said:
A lot of points. I will respond to one. To me, it appears that Trevor is frustrated about not getting the ball. He should be the strength of the team inside and they are failing to get him the ball in a place where he can score. That has to be draining on him. He also looks exhausted to me and does not have the "motor" he had earlier in the season.
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I agree that he needs to get the ball inside more and probably has some frustration. I wonder if the guards are too scared of turnovers to get it into him. When Eliason and Mbakwe play together - Eliason usually has some nice passes into him. I wish they would set up some passes in from Rodney and vice versa instead of low bounce passes from the guards.
 

bleedsmaroonandgold said:
Remembering back to my high school hockey days, I think if I had an interaction like that with an official, my coach would have screamed at the ref, and as soon as the ref was gone, coach would have turned to me and said "don't ever %$&*ing do that again." Then I would have been given an opportunity to work on my endurance conditioning at the next practice.
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That has nothing to do withJim Burr's actions. And I've seen a million reactions worse than Coleman's. if Tubby talked to him about it, fine by me.
 

I'd like to see Trevor get some more minutes with EE at center so there's a little more room down low. It's so frustrating that he rarely gets the ball close to the rim unless he grabs an offensive board. It seems like it's now a bad cycle where Trevor doesn't work as hard as he used to to get open in the post because we never get him the ball even when he is open. We need Hoff back to get him the ball. We really should be running the offense through him. When he's anywhere near the basket and makes a move, it's usually always a basket or a foul if it's not a turnover.
 

GophersInIowa said:
And yet they reward coaches like Bo Ryan and Coach K all the time. I think coaches are way out of hand more than the players. Refs mess up but it's a tough job and some coaches act like little 7 year olds having a temper tantrum whenever a call doesn't go their way. Part of it is the refs fault though as they allow it to happen. How many times has Bo Ryan been given a 't' in his career?
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The NCAA needs to copy the NBA and have no tolerance when it comes to coaches complaining about calls. Obviously, Bo gets a lot of heat (well deserved) on this board because he cries about every single call, but Izzo does the same thing and it is really annoying.
 

underground629 said:
I'd like to see Trevor get some more minutes with EE at center so there's a little more room down low. We need Hoff back to get him the ball. We really should be running the offense through him. When he's anywhere near the basket and makes a move, it's usually always a basket or a foul if it's not a turnover.
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This issue with the high low with EE and Trevor together is the defense will pick up on that EE cannot shoot the high post shot and EE has no post scoring unless its a dunk. EE's man will back off him double teaming Trevor. This is why Colt and Trevor couldnt play together as at the time Trevor wouldnt shoot that high post shot. He has hit it this year though. EE needs to be able to make a 5 ft shot so Trevor and him could play this offense together. And yes Hoff had a great entry post feed.
 

WILLBGOPHER said:
The NCAA needs to copy the NBA and have no tolerance when it comes to coaches complaining about calls. Obviously, Bo gets a lot of heat (well deserved) on this board because he cries about every single call, but Izzo does the same thing and it is really annoying.
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I think part of the problem is is that the refs end up giving calls to Ryan and Izzo. If the refs want people to stop, make sure they don't reward the whining.

That goes for players as well as coaches. If I recall right, I think baseball has low-tolerance stance on baseball players gesturing after striking out. I think they generally allow a little look back and a comment as they walk away, but if a player were to turn and throw his arms up, he'd be ejected. If officials starting issuing technical fouls every time a player did the big arm gesture, I bet we'd see it stamped out quickly (either by the players stopping, or the coaches benching the players who don't stop).
 

You might be right--the logic makes sense. The reason I thought it might is because last year it seemed that Rodney had a ton of space down low when EE played with him. Then again, it may have just been against weaker NIT competition. He played well at pf in the BT but I forget how he did with Sampson in there (who could shoot) vs. playing with EE, who can't shoot.

march madness said:
This issue with the high low with EE and Trevor together is the defense will pick up on that EE cannot shoot the high post shot and EE has no post scoring unless its a dunk. EE's man will back off him double teaming Trevor. This is why Colt and Trevor couldnt play together as at the time Trevor wouldnt shoot that high post shot. He has hit it this year though. EE needs to be able to make a 5 ft shot so Trevor and him could play this offense together. And yes Hoff had a great entry post feed.
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Took a look at who is getting the ball to Mbakwe when he is assisted on a score... only 13 from Dre Hollins.

Mbakwe's shooting % (how often he shoots when on the floor) is under 18% this year.. two years ago it was over 20% and with this team you might want it closer to 22%.

He's been assisted on about 58% of his makes this year... two years ago it was approximately 70%.

That's the summary... a couple of odds and ends and ugly pie charts are at LNH for those interested.

The comment earlier in this thread re: Hoffarber rings true based on the 2010-11 data.
 

Gopher Warrior said:
Took a look at who is getting the ball to Mbakwe when he is assisted on a score... only 13 from Dre Hollins.

Mbakwe's shooting % (how often he shoots when on the floor) is under 18% this year.. two years ago it was over 20% and with this team you might want it closer to 22%.

He's been assisted on about 58% of his makes this year... two years ago it was approximately 70%.

That's the summary... a couple of odds and ends and ugly pie charts are at LNH for those interested.

The comment earlier in this thread re: Hoffarber rings true based on the 2010-11 data.
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Interesting analaysis but seems very flawed when comparing this year to previous years. A team with Hoff feeding post vs Hollins is going to be apples to oranges. Hollins creates his own shot and is a combo guard, therefore will feed the post less than a player like Hoff who is a spot up shooter thus he is not going to pull up that often.. he is going to look to pass first.

The team stats on assists and points are what matters more. Actually, I think everyone can agree that Trevor needs to score more or at least take more looks, but part of that is on Trevor getting free for a look. Also, when Trevor plays with Sampson, its easier for him to get open. This is where the pairing Trevor with Elliot has some merit..

Anyway, stats are great as they say what you want them to say.. and I do like the link GW. I just don't think blanket statements (not that you made one) are accurate. But interesting.
 

Rouser - thanks for your comments.

I don't think we're all that far off in our thinking on the main assertion - Mbakwe taking more shots would probably be good for this team.

In addition to the idea of Mbakwe playing alongside a traditional "center", I still like the idea of having Welch on the court with Dre and Austin as it gives you three 3-point threats and may give Trevor just a bit more room to operate.

Andre Hollins' assist rate this season is higher than Hoffarber's in 2010-11... but there's a difference in where on the court they've gotten the ball to their teammates.
 

Mbakwe has a quickness and explosive strength advantage on almost all centers.

Gopher Warrior said:
Rouser - thanks for your comments.

.In addition to the idea of Mbakwe playing alongside a traditional "center", I still like the idea of having Welch on the court with Dre and Austin as it gives you three 3-point threats and may give Trevor just a bit more room to operate.

Andre Hollins' assist rate this season is higher than Hoffarber's in 2010-11... but there's a difference in where on the court they've gotten the ball to their teammates.
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I like the idea of Welch starting with Austin at the 3 position. IF Welch is getting killed you bring in Coleman who would automatically provide bench scoring.

Nolen averaged a lot of assists. He excelled at transition passing and driving and kicking it out for 3's. He was not a good passer into the post however. Some have said height, angles, etc. When we played Duke Plumlee must have had 15 touches on the block. Where there is a will, there is a way.
 

Trevor's wrist

I thought it looked like Trevor's wrist was injured. He made a lot of one -handed grabs.
 

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