Last minute commit(s) - a few thoughts

[calminnfan]

Whether or not the Gophers get commits from McDonald or one or two other recruit hopefuls, under Kill I do not get this end of the world or letdown feeling if he does not get them.

First is the last half season. Gray and the rest of the team started playing like "they got it" especially with impressive wins over Iowa and Illinois. I know both schools were on the downward slide, but still compared to how the Gophers had been playing pre-Nebraska, the improvement has been very noticeable. With the off -season to work with current players, the opportunity to develop recruiting and the stability in staff unheard of in Minnesota for years, this is a great moment of hope for MN football.

Hopefully some of the recruits catch into that and appreciate what is being developed.

Second - Kill does know what he is doing...though on these boards we can fall in love with our own opinions. Kill and company are not out recklessly throwing Scholarships around. They seem deliberate about the type of players they are after. Though some of the bigger name recruits may not consider MN as worthy of attention at this time, the difference between stars may simply be a matter of the quality of coaching and the system...JMO.

MN has in the past scored big with some lessor players (albeit if only 10 - 20%) of overall 2 star recruits, it can and does happen. Decker, Elsinger, Barber...a few names that come to mind...

Third reason is that Football players who have reason to have pro potential want to go the schools that will help them get there. As Coach Kill and company start getting the team showing something in the win/loss column...more will come. Nothing like current success to attract attention.

In summary, Coach Kill and his staff know what they are doing for the program as a whole and not everything is going to depend on one or two recruits in hope of making a name for himself or the program.

 

[howieramone]

Whether or not the Gophers get commits from McDonald or one or two other recruit hopefuls, under Kill I do not get this end of the world or letdown feeling if he does not get them.

First is the last half season. Gray and the rest of the team started playing like "they got it" especially with impressive wins over Iowa and Illinois. I know both schools were on the downward slide, but still compared to how the Gophers had been playing pre-Nebraska, the improvement has been very noticeable. With the off -season to work with current players, the opportunity to develop recruiting and the stability in staff unheard of in Minnesota for years, this is a great moment of hope for MN football.

Hopefully some of the recruits catch into that and appreciate what is being developed.

Second - Kill does know what he is doing...though on these boards we can fall in love with our own opinions. Kill and company are not out recklessly throwing Scholarships around. They seem deliberate about the type of players they are after. Though some of the bigger name recruits may not consider MN as worthy of attention at this time, the difference between stars may simply be a matter of the quality of coaching and the system...JMO.

MN has in the past scored big with some lessor players (albeit if only 10 - 20%) of overall 2 star recruits, it can and does happen. Decker, Elsinger, Barber...a few names that come to mind...

Third reason is that Football players who have reason to have pro potential want to go the schools that will help them get there. As Coach Kill and company start getting the team showing something in the win/loss column...more will come. Nothing like current success to attract attention.

In summary, Coach Kill and his staff know what they are doing for the program as a whole and not everything is going to depend on one or two recruits in hope of making a name for himself or the program.

+1

 

[ruppertflywheel]

Totally agree for now. Will that be the same spin down the road? I think we will know after these kids are 2-3 years in the program

 

[calminnfan]

Totally agree for now. Will that be the same spin down the road? I think we will know after these kids are 2-3 years in the program

I try to discipline myself to the right decision at the time mentality, though I appreciate the sentiment. Hindsight always is better vision..

 

[46Gophers]

Whether or not the Gophers get commits from McDonald or one or two other recruit hopefuls, under Kill I do not get this end of the world or letdown feeling if he does not get them.

First is the last half season. Gray and the rest of the team started playing like "they got it" especially with impressive wins over Iowa and Illinois. I know both schools were on the downward slide, but still compared to how the Gophers had been playing pre-Nebraska, the improvement has been very noticeable. With the off -season to work with current players, the opportunity to develop recruiting and the stability in staff unheard of in Minnesota for years, this is a great moment of hope for MN football.

Hopefully some of the recruits catch into that and appreciate what is being developed.

Second - Kill does know what he is doing...though on these boards we can fall in love with our own opinions. Kill and company are not out recklessly throwing Scholarships around. They seem deliberate about the type of players they are after. Though some of the bigger name recruits may not consider MN as worthy of attention at this time, the difference between stars may simply be a matter of the quality of coaching and the system...JMO.

MN has in the past scored big with some lessor players (albeit if only 10 - 20%) of overall 2 star recruits, it can and does happen. Decker, Elsinger, Barber...a few names that come to mind...

Third reason is that Football players who have reason to have pro potential want to go the schools that will help them get there. As Coach Kill and company start getting the team showing something in the win/loss column...more will come. Nothing like current success to attract attention.

In summary, Coach Kill and his staff know what they are doing for the program as a whole and not everything is going to depend on one or two recruits in hope of making a name for himself or the program.

Very good post CMF!

 

[chubbygopher]

I try to not get too wrapped up in recruiting rankings. I think the nations top recruits...you can tell they are going to be good. So you know Alabama, LSU etc will have good classes. However, with schools like Minnesota and Northwestern..its so hard to really rank their classes. Eric Decker is a case in point....recruiting is an educated guess..especially when you are not talking about the nations top recruits. I have faith in Kill because his staff is much more experienced than Brewsters and Kill has a definite gameplan that he will follow. I was always worried about Brewsters recruits because the schemes would change every year. Kill has a plan and he will follow it.

 

[TrapperDoo]

Well all sense it - good things are coming our way because of Coach K's straight talk, workman-like attitude, and the strange charm he seems to possess. I gotta believe he'll start reeling in recruits based on his personality alone, and the recruiting will really take off when the Ws start to come. My confidence is obviously high, but I sense the same all around from most everyone else.

 

[denguegopher]

First is the last half season. Gray and the rest of the team started playing like "they got it" especially with impressive wins over Iowa and Illinois. I know both schools were on the downward slide, but still compared to how the Gophers had been playing pre-Nebraska, the improvement has been very noticeable. With the off -season to work with current players, the opportunity to develop recruiting and the stability in staff unheard of in Minnesota for years, this is a great moment of hope for MN football. Hopefully some of the recruits catch into that and appreciate what is being developed..[/QUOTE
+1
This is exactly what I have been hanging my hat on. The improvement that I saw at the end of the season was a thing of beauty. I kept thinking, "this Kill guy can really coach, he may be the one to lead us to greatness." Then I slap myself back into reality - but I still think that Kill is one hell of a coach, and I can't wait for the Gophers to get out here to Vegas on Sept 1. As of right now I have 5 of my Rochester childhood friends planning on coming out. Can't wait!!

 

[John Galt]

It's always funny how the fan base gets behind whatever the new coach wants to do. I remember this board back in the early Brewster years, and everyone posted on how we would never win without highly regarded recruits. It was argued that coaching barely mattered, it was the players who won games. Now with Kill, the thinking goes that he is such a genius that he can take a class filled with 2 star recruits and turn them into a 10 win football team.

 

[victor04]

@ John Galt

Of the 27 players signed for this class (or showing on the most reliable site Rivals), 20 of those commits are 3 star players, with 3 of those players being borderline 4 stars( P. Nelson, Pirsig, and Mcdonald). Is that a class filled with 2 star talent? If you have a problem with Kill's recruting its your own opinion of course, but at least throw out some factual information to prove such a statement, rather than just spouting off what's on the top of your head as validation.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

It's always funny how the fan base gets behind whatever the new coach wants to do. I remember this board back in the early Brewster years, and everyone posted on how we would never win without highly regarded recruits. It was argued that coaching barely mattered, it was the players who won games. Now with Kill, the thinking goes that he is such a genius that he can take a class filled with 2 star recruits and turn them into a 10 win football team.

That's really not true.

First, I remember when Brew was hired, one of the things that a lot of people liked was that he was also bringing in top notch coordinators (something that had been missing on defense during the Mason years). We eventually realized that it would be a coardinator carousel, but I remember a lot of talk about being pumped up for Mike Dunbar and Everett Whithers. I agree that people got the most excited about the recruits but that's the nature of any sport.

Second, the class isn't loaded with high end talent (in terms of Big 10) per the recruiting websites, but it's nonsense to say it's filled with 2 star recruits. The other thing people like is that we are doing a good job with the local kids. People in MN are going to get pumped up about that. Some people probably put too much of an emphasis on it.

Lastly, I think why people like Kill is that they liked last years class despite it being forced to be "hodge podge". Marcus Jones looked good for a true freshman, Michal Amaufula (Spelling?) impressed, supposedly Foster Bush and Cockran have looked the best, Wells played nicely for us. It's impressive to think that all of these kids were definite LATE offers and they all impressed. I think some people, including myself, are giving him a ton of lee way on athletes that he likes. He liked Eric Murray so much in June that he offered him? Works for me!

 

[minngg]

I try to not get too wrapped up in recruiting rankings. I think the nations top recruits...you can tell they are going to be good. So you know Alabama, LSU etc will have good classes. However, with schools like Minnesota and Northwestern..its so hard to really rank their classes. Eric Decker is a case in point....recruiting is an educated guess..especially when you are not talking about the nations top recruits. I have faith in Kill because his staff is much more experienced than Brewsters and Kill has a definite gameplan that he will follow. I was always worried about Brewsters recruits because the schemes would change every year. Kill has a plan and he will follow it.

Eric Decker is a case in point. He also an exception, not the rule.

 

[Killjoy]

It's always funny how the fan base gets behind whatever the new coach wants to do. I remember this board back in the early Brewster years, and everyone posted on how we would never win without highly regarded recruits. It was argued that coaching barely mattered, it was the players who won games. Now with Kill, the thinking goes that he is such a genius that he can take a class filled with 2 star recruits and turn them into a 10 win football team.

If you don't understand the difference between Brewster and Kill you really are clueless. You might want to go back and look at Kill's record in turning programs around and how long he has retained his staff. Then go look at Brewster's record in turning programs around and how long he maintained the same staff. Let me know what you find.

 

[John Galt]

My fault, I should have been more clear with my post. It wasn't meant to knock Kill or the recruits in any way. I'm extremely excited with the offensive recruits, and think it might be the best class we've ever had. Defense seems to be a little more of a question mark, but I'll trust Kill because he's got a track record. My intent was to show the difference in his style vs. Brewster, and how the fan base clung to each one in the early years, even though they were very different. Bob, I agree that people were excited about the coordinators initially, but we overlooked the turnover in the staff for a long time and many on this board were convinced that getting good recruits alone would be enough to improve the program.

I wear maroon colored glasses and am very optimistic about the future, but I get the impression that some on here think Kill could turn the roster of St. Thomas into a 10 win team in the B1G.

 

[50PoundHead]

Any idea on where Jazzmar Clax will end up? I want Jazzmar to join Shabazz and Balthazar on the Z-fense.

 

[t-docious]

Any idea on where Jazzmar Clax will end up? I want Jazzmar to join Shabazz and Balthazar on the Z-fense.

lmao.

 

[paulser21]

Any idea on where Jazzmar Clax will end up? I want Jazzmar to join Shabazz and Balthazar on the Z-fense.

nice

 

[MNVCGUY]

My fault, I should have been more clear with my post. It wasn't meant to knock Kill or the recruits in any way. I'm extremely excited with the offensive recruits, and think it might be the best class we've ever had. Defense seems to be a little more of a question mark, but I'll trust Kill because he's got a track record. My intent was to show the difference in his style vs. Brewster, and how the fan base clung to each one in the early years, even though they were very different. Bob, I agree that people were excited about the coordinators initially, but we overlooked the turnover in the staff for a long time and many on this board were convinced that getting good recruits alone would be enough to improve the program.

I wear maroon colored glasses and am very optimistic about the future, but I get the impression that some on here think Kill could turn the roster of St. Thomas into a 10 win team in the B1G.

Kill is still in the honeymoon phase for the next year or so. At this time he is a program builder that can do no wrong. As we enter next season if the results are not starting to show on the field you will start to see more people calling him a mid-major coach that can't cut it at this level but still the majority will say give him another year to build his program like he did in his previous stops. As we enter 2014 if the results from 2012 and 2013 have not shown significant improvement the majority of the fan base will be calling for his head and the next big thing.

On the flip side if the results are there on the field Kill can punch his ticket as the Gophers coach for as long as he wants to be which in that case will hopefully be a very long time.

Right now I like the general direction things are headed in. This class will give us a pretty good feel for whether or not Kill's recruiting will cut it in the Big Ten long term. Despite the excitement of guys like Nelson and McDonald I think the jury is definitely still out on Kill the recruiter.

 

[Killjoy]

Right now I like the general direction things are headed in. This class will give us a pretty good feel for whether or not Kill's recruiting will cut it in the Big Ten long term. Despite the excitement of guys like Nelson and McDonald I think the jury is definitely still out on Kill the recruiter.

Yea you are right. That is what they are also still saying at all the other schools where he has turned their program around. I don't know if you invest in stocks but if you do, I expect you say a stock is a buy after it has doubled. I can understand why you may want to be cautious after Brewster but this guy is the real deal. He may not turn it around but if he can't it is unlikely Minnesota will be able to recruit a coach who can. Repeat after me: Buy low, sell high.

 

[minngg]

If anyone wants another change after two years of modest to baad records, they are nuts. Kill needs time. This program has been mediocre to bad for 50 years. Anyone thinking two years is going to bring change is crazy. Hand the keys to Kill. Give him 6 years. He will do it. The impatient? Well, let them whine. Kill can coach. That is why the President extended him when he didn't need to. He sees it.

 

[Ole]

I've lurked on NIU and SIU boards quite a bit, getting info on Kill and how he left their programs.
Alot of hero worship at SIU, alot of bad blood at NIU, but I've taken a few things away from it all.

Kill left SIU in great shape, it's now struggling a bit, not bad, but his kids gave the new coach a nice few years and as soon as Kill's recruits left the program sank a bit. That's a good sign even at an FCS level.

At NIU, his recruits and kids he developed have given them a VERY solid base to expand on, even his detractors agree he left the team speed much improved overall, few give him credit for Harnish, but his staff absolutely developed great quality players there from Novak's recruits and stockpiled speed and athletes.

Their D did struggle this year(MACtion games in the 60's), but I wonder if that is a remnant of scheme change from Claeys to Doeren. We saw similar issues here in 07 when the new scheme simply couldn't be run with the kids on the team. They had a very good D in 10'.
I tend to think Kill has succeeded in recruiting by finding fast kids and teaching them to play football in his schemes, they may not be the right fit for every program, hence the struggles on D at NIU, but the kids he finds appear to have talent and a niche to fill.

 

[MNVCGUY]

If anyone wants another change after two years of modest to baad records, they are nuts. Kill needs time. This program has been mediocre to bad for 50 years. Anyone thinking two years is going to bring change is crazy. Hand the keys to Kill. Give him 6 years. He will do it. The impatient? Well, let them whine. Kill can coach. That is why the President extended him when he didn't need to. He sees it.

I agree 100% that coaches need time to get programs going in the right direction. However given the current culture of college athletics time and patience are two virtues that are seen less and less each season. There are coaches getting canned after two years in some cases. Not sticking up for Brew but he was canned after 3 1/2 seasons. While giving Kill 6 years makes all the sense in the world if 2012 and 2013 are mediocre with minimal signs of improvement the media, fans, and boosters will be all over Kill and calling for a change. Doesn't make it right but it is the way of the world right now in athletics.

I sincerely hope that the administration is patient and does everything possible to avoid making a change too soon. At the same time there is going to be a new AD coming on board at some point and we are all kidding ourselves if we think that AD is going to be patient if he doesn't see the kind of improvement he deems as necessary from the football program. Kill will not be "his guy" and anyone who thinks that doesn't matter has not been paying attention to college athletics in recent years.

I think Kill can be the guy to get things back on track in Minnesota but there will be a lot of pressure on him to show significant and steady improvement each year. Hopefully his staff is up to the task because the level of pressure they will face at Minnesota is going to be so much higher then the pressure they faced at SIU and NIU. The turnaround at SIU was very impressive. It was also done at a place with minimal media scrutiny and very low expectations. His time at NIU was also impressive but having only been there 3 years it is a little tough to say if he could have sustained it with his guys leading the team. Again I don't say any of this a way of taking a shot at Kill just saying I have not totally bought into the hype, although I am hopeful that he is the right guy to get it done.

 

[howieramone]

I think we all know the pitchforks and torches are still out in the garage. Have you noticed we are no longer referred to as the Gopher faithful?

 

[corcoran1]

I agree 100% that coaches need time to get programs going in the right direction. However given the current culture of college athletics time and patience are two virtues that are seen less and less each season. There are coaches getting canned after two years in some cases. Not sticking up for Brew but he was canned after 3 1/2 seasons. While giving Kill 6 years makes all the sense in the world if 2012 and 2013 are mediocre with minimal signs of improvement the media, fans, and boosters will be all over Kill and calling for a change. Doesn't make it right but it is the way of the world right now in athletics.

I sincerely hope that the administration is patient and does everything possible to avoid making a change too soon. At the same time there is going to be a new AD coming on board at some point and we are all kidding ourselves if we think that AD is going to be patient if he doesn't see the kind of improvement he deems as necessary from the football program. Kill will not be "his guy" and anyone who thinks that doesn't matter has not been paying attention to college athletics in recent years.

I think Kill can be the guy to get things back on track in Minnesota but there will be a lot of pressure on him to show significant and steady improvement each year. Hopefully his staff is up to the task because the level of pressure they will face at Minnesota is going to be so much higher then the pressure they faced at SIU and NIU. The turnaround at SIU was very impressive. It was also done at a place with minimal media scrutiny and very low expectations. His time at NIU was also impressive but having only been there 3 years it is a little tough to say if he could have sustained it with his guys leading the team. Again I don't say any of this a way of taking a shot at Kill just saying I have not totally bought into the hype, although I am hopeful that he is the right guy to get it done.

At this point, Kill basically reports to Kaler,and I'm not kidding. The new AD has problems to solve in M&W bball, and a few other sports where results are not great. The next guy will not spend a lot of time worrying about football other than attendance for the next couple of years. The 3.0 GPA is a big deal. It shows Kill is serious about results everywhere. Kaler is a smart guy, when he sees Kill gets results and stays focused on the things he says he will do, he will stick with him.

 

[MNVCGUY]

At this point, Kill basically reports to Kaler,and I'm not kidding. The new AD has problems to solve in M&W bball, and a few other sports where results are not great. The next guy will not spend a lot of time worrying about football other than attendance for the next couple of years. The 3.0 GPA is a big deal. It shows Kill is serious about results everywhere. Kaler is a smart guy, when he sees Kill gets results and stays focused on the things he says he will do, he will stick with him.

It is a no brainer that if the results are there we are not going to have any issues. Kill will be secure and things will roll along. The question is what happens if the results are not there, how much leash then do you give a guy that was hired under the previous administration? Again outside of the first part of the season all the signs have been positive, the GPA thing is important but a high GPA won't save Kill if he struggles to win conference games. We don't know how it will all play out, clearly we all hope for the best I am just looking at the other side of the coin that says if there are struggles I can't see the administration giving a lot of lee way to a guy they didn't hire.