How would you grade the Freshmen so far?

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Otis

Otis

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Just thought I'd see how you all felt about the freshmen's performance so far:

Oturu: Pre-season outlook: Frosh I expected to contribute the most. Saw him as a defensive presence and a rebounding help to Murph. Thought he would contribute consist opportunity points.
So Far Assessment: Defensively he has been good, providing a presence in the middle with decent block numbers. Has been susceptible to fouls. Disappointment in scoring/rebounding.
Grade: C-

Kalesheur: Pre-Outlook: Considered to be a potential 3 and D type player who could come in off the bench and provide good minutes.
SFA: Has at times looked like Gopher MVP! Playing well over his ranking, he has provided scoring, defense and heads up play that makes it hard to even consider him as a non-starter.
Grade: A+

Omersa: PO: considered a great "athlete" who would provide showtime dunking ability and back-up minutes. Considered raw in defensive and offensive ability. Would make his mark with hustle.
SFA: Has pretty much lived up to his Pre-season assessment. Looks lost at times playing defense and in the offense.
Grade: C

I'd throw Matz in here but he is not a Frosh. That being said I have been pleasantly surprised with his play! Glad he didn't transfer.

Once Curry is back and able to play I think we will see the end of Omersa's playing time and Curry will impact Matz' and Oturu's time going down. Although I think Matz has played well-enough to secure his time.

Big Question Going Ahead: How will all of these guys play going forward against B1G teams with more physically dominant players?
 

I think your comments are pretty accurate.

I will say that, fair or not, I'm disappointed in Oturu's athleticism. He seems to have trouble dunking in traffic from what I've seen. For a 6'10" guy with looong arms, I didn't expect that. But of course, he's a kid yet. It will likely be a totally different story in a year or two.

Kalscheur, I don't know if there's much to say. A great example of how there is way too much emphasis on recruiting rankings.

Omersa, I guess I expect a ceiling of a bigger, stronger Rodney Williams, which in many ways would be just fine. Not everyone can have the ball all the time.

I think the Gophers will miss the tourney. Murphy is in foul trouble all the time, and without them they struggle bigtime. Also, road games appear to be a major problem at this stage. Who knows, maybe they will improve, but at this point I think the tourney would be a stretch....just my opinion.
 

We all must remember that Oturo had shoulder surgery and couldn't be in the weight room as much as he and the team wanted. I expect gradual improvement over this season and a big leap next year given he stays healthy. Oturo was thrusted into the starting lineup because of Curry's procedure and would not have played as much as he is currently. Given this, Oturo may be playing better than expected????
 

The OP has Omursa graded higher than Oturu?
 

Oturo-

Present grade B- If I was told that he would be averaging 8.3 points, 6.5 rebounds and 2 blocks in his first 8 games - I'd have been happy.
Future upside A- He has the most future potential of any Gopher. In a few years he will be the strongest player on the court, like Murphy often is now but at 6'10" he will be a beast inside. He catches the ball well in traffic, has excellent hops and will be a great player here.

Kalscheur

Present grade A+ - Amazing start. He does everything well. He doesn't have the speed to separate himself so he is going to have to be set up.
Future upside B+ - He will get better at finding ways to get open and he will be a big scorer here- but he already does things right so the upside is a little limited.

Omersa

Present grade C - he is rough and if Curry were healthy- should have been sitting or redshirting.
Future upside B - If I were him I would work on being a GREAT defender and rebounder and develop some ball handling and shooting skills to make himself a dangerous midrange guy
 



Some guy said:
The OP has Omursa graded higher than Oturu?
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Probably in the same sense you'd give the Redskins a higher grade than the Vikings thus far this year. The better of the two is clear, but factoring in expectations...

OP is pretty spot on all around. Agree on Matz too
 

Oturu has some impressive footwork and would have quite a few more baskets if he'd been better at finishing - including two missed dunks. But I agree with whoever posted in another thread that he plays remarkably small for a 6-10 muscular guy. Matz has been the better center so far, and I wonder more every day why he's not starting.
 

Gopher Skipper said:
Probably in the same sense you'd give the Redskins a higher grade than the Vikings thus far this year. The better of the two is clear, but factoring in expectations...

OP is pretty spot on all around. Agree on Matz too
Click to expand...

Yes, this is how I was grading. Just like MSU would currently get a C- for their season so far and Wisconsin would probably get an A-.
 



Gabe: A+
Oturu:B (mainly due to foul trouble)
Omersa: C-

Omersa is lost out there much of the time, which is not totally unexpected for a freshman, and I expect this to improve. However, my biggest concern with him is the virtually non-existent rebounding. Seems to be a combination of positioning, hand strength, and not getting off the floor in traffic, which is really hard to fathom. I hope he makes this an area of emphasis because its the one area he could really make an impact. Rebounding against OSU was sad.
 

bga1 said:
Oturo-

Present grade B- If I was told that he would be averaging 8.3 points, 6.5 rebounds and 2 blocks in his first 8 games - I'd have been happy.
Future upside A- He has the most future potential of any Gopher. In a few years he will be the strongest player on the court, like Murphy often is now but at 6'10" he will be a beast inside. He catches the ball well in traffic, has excellent hops and will be a great player here.

Kalscheur

Present grade A+ - Amazing start. He does everything well. He doesn't have the speed to separate himself so he is going to have to be set up.
Future upside B+ - He will get better at finding ways to get open and he will be a big scorer here- but he already does things right so the upside is a little limited.

Omersa

Present grade C - he is rough and if Curry were healthy- should have been sitting or redshirting.
Future upside B - If I were him I would work on being a GREAT defender and rebounder and develop some ball handling and shooting skills to make himself a dangerous midrange guy
Click to expand...

Both this writeup and the one by the OP are well thought out. I would lean more towards your grade for Oturu though. You can see he has a lot of work to do but when he figures it out he will be a monster down low.

Gabe has been awesome, will need to get better at getting open as teams pay more attention to him but when he does get an open look he seems to hit it most of the time.

Omersa isn't ready yet but with the Curry injury he has to play. The experience should help him out long term but when Curry comes back I would expect Omersa's minutes to take the biggest hit.
 

If Murphy could play physical defense without fouling he would be the one guarding someone like K. Wesson.
6-9 270 versus 6-7 250.
Oturu the freshmen is guarding him giving up 45lbs. Of course if Curry was available he would be the best option. With Oturu's lateral quickness I am sure he could match up with Andre W. or Young.

Recruiting rankings tend to follow who has nba potential more than who can contribute right away in college. Look at every guy to wear a Gonzaga uniform, usually never rated in top 50 but sometimes ready day 1 and eventually make the league. Wisconsin is similar. Rankings are about athleticsm and ceiling. Davidson and Gabe will be solid 4 year guys, but with their lack of athleticism the nba is probably not in their future.

Oturu-preseason B, had some injuries. People confusing strength to hold position with athleticism.
current B, up and down like most players ranked in the 50's.
future A, best upside in a front court player since Humphries.

Gabe preseason B, thought he wouldn't play this year with Stull on the roster.
current A, big ten teams will take away his 3pt attempts
future A, he will be consistently good his entire career, but probably never 1st or 2nd team big ten.

Omersa preseason C.
current C, he relied on athleticism in h school. he needs more skill and understanding. He is a short 4, he is much bigger than Rodney whoever made that comparison.
future. Needs to battle Murphy every day and learn to love rebounding.
 




march madness said:
If Murphy could play physical defense without fouling he would be the one guarding someone like K. Wesson.
6-9 270 versus 6-7 250.
Oturu the freshmen is guarding him giving up 45lbs. Of course if Curry was available he would be the best option. With Oturu's lateral quickness I am sure he could match up with Andre W. or Young.

Recruiting rankings tend to follow who has nba potential more than who can contribute right away in college. Look at every guy to wear a Gonzaga uniform, usually never rated in top 50 but sometimes ready day 1 and eventually make the league. Wisconsin is similar. Rankings are about athleticsm and ceiling. Davidson and Gabe will be solid 4 year guys, but with their lack of athleticism the nba is probably not in their future.

Oturu-preseason B, had some injuries. People confusing strength to hold position with athleticism.
current B, up and down like most players ranked in the 50's.
future A, best upside in a front court player since Humphries.

Gabe preseason B, thought he wouldn't play this year with Stull on the roster.
current A, big ten teams will take away his 3pt attempts
future A, he will be consistently good his entire career, but probably never 1st or 2nd team big ten.

Omersa preseason C.
current C, he relied on athleticism in h school. he needs more skill and understanding. He is a short 4, he is much bigger than Rodney whoever made that comparison.
future. Needs to battle Murphy every day and learn to love rebounding.
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I think Gabe has the potential to be all B10. He is not hunting his shot as much as he should, nor is Pitino scheming to get him shots to the extent that he should. Some double screens leading to corner three attempts would be nice to see.

Agreed on Omersa and Oturu.
 

Gopher Skipper said:
Probably in the same sense you'd give the Redskins a higher grade than the Vikings thus far this year. The better of the two is clear, but factoring in expectations...

OP is pretty spot on all around. Agree on Matz too
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Why would one factor in expectations when evaluating players? Players will help or hurt you by the sum of their abilities, not by their performance vs. expectations. I can understand why Big Ten weekly power rankings use a relative-to-expectations angle (they want to give lower teams the opportunity to get a bump here and there) but such a system has little value when determining the quality of one's roster. If Jordan Murphy plays below expectations, he's still a pretty good player. If Bakary Konate played above expectations, he still wasn't that good.

I have the same problem with some compiled lists of NBA draft "busts." One either is a "bust" or isn't. One isn't a "bust" vs. relative expectations. Joe Smith often appears in these lists as a draft bust because he didn't perform like a #1 draft pick but Joe Smith had a long (played until he was 35) and reasonably productive NBA career. Joe Smith was not a bust. Anthony Bennett on the other hand was a bust. The only reason he lasted four years in the league was because he was a #1 draft pick.
 

I believe players should be evaluated relative to their peers. Since I haven't watched enough of other teams' freshman to form any sort of knowledgeable subjective opinion, I'm going to go with PER for Big Ten freshmen playing at least five games and 10 or more minutes per game.

There are 33 of these and the Gophers have all three of theirs on the list.

Four players have PER scores above 20 and the highest is the red-headed Lithuanian who plays for Michigan with an excellent 29.4. Jalen Smith (maryland) and Romeo Langford are the other two who have played big minutes. Brady Heiman of Nebraska is over 20 but he only averages 11.9 minutes per game. I would say you can call these freshman A+ to A.

The next group (6 players) range between 16.5 and 17.9 PER and there is a noticeable numerical break between this cluster and the next. The Gophers' two best freshman are in this group. Maybe you can call this group A- to B+.

The lowest PER (1.7) of the 33 players on this list belongs to the Gophers' third freshman. I won't give this a grade.
 

Even Joel Pryzbilla, a 5-star recruit, only averaged 6.7 PPG in his freshman season. I think Oturu will be fine in the end. The problem isn't that he's under performing as a starting freshman; the problem is that he's needing to start as a freshman.
 

On 247, for Michigan Ignas was ranked 40th, and now that appears low. Maryland:J. Smith #16, Wiggins #42, Indiana:Romeo Lanford #7, J. Hunter #59. Minnesota: Oturu #50. Omersa #196. Gabe #198.

Threw that out there as sometimes I think people hear about a "great recruiting class" and have unrealistic expectations. We had a solid in state recruiting class. We are ranked 8th in big ten and 45th nationally.

Expecting Oturu to play like a McDonald's all american out of the gate is unrealistic for the 50th ranked player. Let's be patient as we got a steal in Gabe.
 

I imagine everyone, including Humphries, would look bad guarding a physical player like Wesson on the block as a freshman.

Bad Gopher said:
Even Joel Pryzbilla, a 5-star recruit, only averaged 6.7 PPG in his freshman season. I think Oturu will be fine in the end. The problem isn't that he's under performing as a starting freshman; the problem is that he's needing to start as a freshman.
Click to expand...
 

Being very kind to Omersa in this thread. Other than a swat, his ripping that ball away against TAMU and an alley oop or two from Isaiah, I can't name one positive thing he's done this year.
 

Freshmen Grades

Kalscheur = SPPFABTG (Smart, poised, potential future All Big Ten guard)

Omersa = NRY (not ready yet)

Oturu = WBGBTPPBGOCE (Will be good Big Ten post player but getting on court education)
 

Bad Gopher said:
Matz has been the better center so far, and I wonder more every day why he's not starting.
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Matz tole is a function of conditioning. His transfer situation limited his offseason workouts. Thus, he is being used as much as he can while still playing effectively.
 

Bad Gopher said:
Even Joel Pryzbilla, a 5-star recruit, only averaged 6.7 PPG in his freshman season. I think Oturu will be fine in the end. The problem isn't that he's under performing as a starting freshman; the problem is that he's needing to start as a freshman.
Click to expand...

I'm thinking that the rating scale may have been elevated a little bit since Pryzbilla was considered a 5 star recruit. When you look at who's considered a 5 star talent nationally today, not sure Joel would be in that discussion.
 

Oturu simply needs to get strong, and needs a lot of work on his footwork. For now, focus on defense, blocking shots and rebounding. work on pivot moves in the off-season.

Gabe K is in the role he's going to have for 4 years - designated shooter. He appears to be at least a serviceable ball-handler and defender, but he will make his living at the 3-pt line. Gophers need to draw up some set plays to get him open off picks and screens.

Omersa is a real project. If Curry was not injured, I wonder if Omersa would have been red-shirted? right now, his only plus ability is jumping and dunking. everything else needs a lot of work. Not sure if he'll ever be a big scorer, but he can be effective by rebounding, playing defense, running the court and getting his dunks. Needs to get a lot stronger, just like Oturu.
 

big10guy said:
I'm thinking that the rating scale may have been elevated a little bit since Pryzbilla was considered a 5 star recruit. When you look at who's considered a 5 star talent nationally today, not sure Joel would be in that discussion.
Click to expand...

Joel was a consensus top ten recruit in the US. The foremost guru of the time - Bob Gibbons - rated him #3.
 
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short ornery norwegian said:
Oturu simply needs to get strong, and needs a lot of work on his footwork. For now, focus on defense, blocking shots and rebounding. work on pivot moves in the off-season.

Gabe K is in the role he's going to have for 4 years - designated shooter. He appears to be at least a serviceable ball-handler and defender, but he will make his living at the 3-pt line. Gophers need to draw up some set plays to get him open off picks and screens.

Omersa is a real project. If Curry was not injured, I wonder if Omersa would have been red-shirted? right now, his only plus ability is jumping and dunking. everything else needs a lot of work. Not sure if he'll ever be a big scorer, but he can be effective by rebounding, playing defense, running the court and getting his dunks. Needs to get a lot stronger, just like Oturu.
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Gabe is better than "serviceable" as a defender and I think it's premature to say his role won't expand over the years. No reason he can't at the very least develop more of a mid-range game. Could see him getting to the rim a little more as he progresses as well. Three point shooting and defense are his biggest assets, but his role could certainly expand. Agreed that we should try to get him more looks.
 

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