Heisman Race

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SWMNGOPHER

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Looking at the Heisman race, it looks like Collin Klein, Kenjon Barner, and AJ McCarron are the top 3 after this week. Manti Te'o, Braxton Miller, and possibly Johnny Manziel are still in the race though. If the voting was today I feel as if Collin Klein would take the award. If you look at the top 3 candidates' teams, I would think that Kansas State would struggle the most without Klein compared to Oregon and Alabama. They might struggle but I think that they still have many other weapons to use IMO. Just wanted to see what others thoughts are on this!
 

This year's Heisman race is wide open. Everyone's top five could look completely different in a few weeks. Most years you have a pretty good idea of the top 2 or 3, but this year I don't think there is any shoe-ins. I don't think Barner was hardly even in the discussion until this past week. If K-State, Alabama, Oregon, and Notre Dame stay undefeated, I think each team will have a representative at the Heisman ceremony: Klein, McCarron (and his mom!), Barner, and Te'o.
 


Stan The Caddy said:
Marquis Lee
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Certainly can be in the discussion. He's also one of the best kickoff returners in the country.

I'm kinda just looking around on sports-reference.com, and it's amazing how much the game has changed over the past two decades or so. The last two WR to win the Heisman are Desmond Howard ('91) and Tim Brown ('87). Neither one of them had 1,000 yards receiving in those years. Tim Brown had just 39 receptions. Howard did score 23 total TDs though. They were both incredible returners also.

What kind of numbers would a WR have to put up at a top 25 program for them to have a shot at winning the Heisman now days? Would it have to be like 120 receptions, 1800 yards, and 25 TDs?
 

GophersInIowa said:
Certainly can be in the discussion. He's also one of the best kickoff returners in the country.

I'm kinda just looking around on sports-reference.com, and it's amazing how much the game has changed over the past two decades or so. The last two WR to win the Heisman are Desmond Howard ('91) and Tim Brown ('87). Neither one of them had 1,000 yards receiving in those years. Tim Brown had just 39 receptions. Howard did score 23 total TDs though. They were both incredible returners also.

What kind of numbers would a WR have to put up at a top 25 program for them to have a shot at winning the Heisman now days? Would it have to be like 120 receptions, 1800 yards, and 25 TDs?
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I'd say your estimates are about right based on comparison to three I chose below.

Fitzgerald finished 2nd with 92 receptions, 1672 yds, 22 TD's
Blackmon finished 5th with 111 receptions, 1782 yds, 20 TD's
Crabtree finished 5th with 97 receptions, 1165 yds, 19 TD's

I think Heisman voting is completely dependent on a number of things. However, at the top of the list:

1. Amount of air time given by SEC NETWORK / ESPN highlighting each candidate and
2. Whether or not the candidate is from a helmet school.

It is an award that is flawed on so many levels, I don't know where to begin.

I enjoy watching Position Awards so much more. At least kids from non-helmet schools have a shot at being recognized as the best in their skill set. Plus, rarely do you see Jesse Palmer spewing out drivel on who he thinks is most deserving of the Outland Trophy or Mackey Award.
 


The fact that AJ McCarron is a heisman candidate speaks to the SEC bias in the media. He isn't a top 10 player on his own team.
 

My top 5 are:
Barner
Klien
teo
Geno smith
D Thomas



Outside the top 3 there is NOBODY
 

Rosemountian said:
The fact that AJ McCarron is a heisman candidate speaks to the SEC bias in the media. He isn't a top 10 player on his own team.
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No, they just have to pick someone from the #1 team. He certainly shouldn't win it but I think he deserves to be mentioned. 19 TD and 0 INT in the top conference is pretty dang good. This is coming from someone who hates the SEC.
 

Rosemountian said:
My top 5 are:
Barner
Klien
teo
Geno smith
D Thomas



Outside the top 3 there is NOBODY
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De'Anthony? His numbers are good, but he doesn't touch the ball nearly enough for him to be mentioned in my opinion. He's probably going to end up with less offensive yards (rushing & receiving) than last year.
 



Outside the top 3 there is nobody I said. I pick d Thomas because he is really good. Some people take McCarron because of his lack of ints. The top 3 seem like they should be a no brained at this point to me.
 

I would probably give to inside track to Barner and Klein, probably Klein if I had to choose one just because he is a quarterback. I think it will be really difficult for Te'o to win it as a linebacker, although if anyone is going to do it it would be him considering the unbelievable year he has had.
 

Rosemountian said:
My top 5 are:
Barner
Klien
teo
Geno smith
D Thomas



Outside the top 3 there is NOBODY
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Rose-

At this time last year RGIII was just becoming a blip on the Heisman radar. So, do not say there is nobody beyond the three you listed. Marqise Lee deserves mention IMO. He and D Thomas are the two most dynamic players in the country.

Te'o is a great kid, but he is only a candidate because he plays for Notre Dame. If he wins, the trophy should be named the Hypesman as a friend of mine coined it back in 1997 when Woodson beat Manning. Te'o is nowhere close to doing what Suh did a few years back.
 




Rosemountian said:
Suh is the most overrated player of the last decade IMO.
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I'm curious, why do you say that? IIRC he led his team in tackles. Seems pretty amazing for an interior lineman. Maybe it is not that unusual?
 

badgergopher said:
I'm curious, why do you say that? IIRC he led his team in tackles. Seems pretty amazing for an interior lineman. Maybe it is not that unusual?
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He was really really good. He was not close to the best player in the country that year. Terrell Suggs was a better college defensive player than Suh...because Suh played for Nebraska he was vastly overhyped. He was the top defensive player in the country. He was a top 5 player in the country. But he wasn't close to the best player. Gerhart, Ingram, McCoy, Kellen Moore, all had better seasons than him IMO.

In the last 15 years, Suh is not in my top 5 defensive players in college football.
I would have these guys better:
C Woodson
L Arrington
J Peppers
T Suggs
P Peterson
but that is just me

Someone called C Woodson Hype...Suh is the definition of hype. One game put him into serious contention (A game his team lost).
In 13 games he had 7.5 sacks (.57 per game), 17 tackles for loss (1.3 per game), and 73 tackles (5.6 per game)
In one game that his team lost (Big 12 championship) he had 4.5 sacks, 7 tackles for loss, and 12 tackles.
 

I would vote #1 Klein #2 Barner #3 Manziel #4 Braxton Miller #5 McCarron (I think McCarron finishes higher though)
 

Rosemountian said:
My top 5 are:
Barner
Klien
teo
Geno smith
D Thomas



Outside the top 3 there is NOBODY
Click to expand...

How is Geno Smith still in your top 5? I think Klien, McCarron, Manziel are more deserving and those are just the QBs. I'd throw Jordan Lynch in there too, one of the most under rated players in the country. The qb for the 1 loss northern illinois squad has thrown for 2175 yrds 19 tds and 3 ints and has ran for 1342 yrds (2nd in the country in rushing yards) and 16 tds.
 

With the finalists announced, Manziel looks to be the next Heisman winner. Te'o might be close, but even with playing in the National Championship, I don't think he will be able to pull it off.
 

I have a hard time giving the award to a freshman who finished 3rd in his division. But that is just me. Hope Teo wins...but you can't really go wrong this year. There is no obvious choice.
 

Rosemountian said:
I have a hard time giving the award to a freshman who finished 3rd in his division. But that is just me. Hope Teo wins...but you can't really go wrong this year. There is no obvious choice.
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So is the Heisman the best college football player, the best player on a team in contention for a national title (or close), the best player on a team that won their conference, the best senior or junior on a relevant team, or something else entirely?

I think Manziel, like RGIII last year, was easily the most valuable player to his team. Baylor also finished 3rd in their conference last year, with similar poll rankings. It's tough to say what A&M would be without JM because he'll be there for another 2-3 years. We see what Baylor is this year without RGIII.

I dunno, they're all great players. I think Teo may be the best linebacker in the country, and meets all the "off-field" requirements of a Heisman, but I feel like JM's performance against Alabama IN Tuscaloosa is more impressive than any single performance by Te'o. Just my thoughts...
 

RailBaronYarr said:
So is the Heisman the best college football player, the best player on a team in contention for a national title (or close), the best player on a team that won their conference, the best senior or junior on a relevant team, or something else entirely?

I think Manziel, like RGIII last year, was easily the most valuable player to his team. Baylor also finished 3rd in their conference last year, with similar poll rankings. It's tough to say what A&M would be without JM because he'll be there for another 2-3 years. We see what Baylor is this year without RGIII.

I dunno, they're all great players. I think Teo may be the best linebacker in the country, and meets all the "off-field" requirements of a Heisman, but I feel like JM's performance against Alabama IN Tuscaloosa is more impressive than any single performance by Te'o. Just my thoughts...
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I'm with you. Manziel. I believe the exact language is, the nation's most outstanding player.
 

Few relics that we know of have created more melodrama in college football than the Heisman Memorial Trophy, an award that is supposed to go to the outstanding football player in the United States every year, and sometimes does.

-former Sports Illustrated writer, Dan Jenkins, 1973
 

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