Congrats Cretin on the state championship!!

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Gold Rush

Gold Rush

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They defeated Eden Prairie tonight 16-5 to win their second state
championship. Way to go guys!!!
 

I always like it when a minnesota team wins a football championship. woo hoo.

Seriously, congrats Cretin.
 


I think Cretin does not necessarily recruit so much as kids go there because they are
good. In other words, it doesn't go out and recruit kids because they are good football players
but good football players want to go there because they have a good
program. I coached a few of the kids that are on that team in baseball over
the last several years and I couldn't be more proud of them!! I also know of
a few very good athletes that tried to get in there and were denied due to
grades or other issues. If Cretin was all about the sports, those kids most definitely would have
gotten in there.

I think Cretin does have a few advantages by being able to get kids from outside
their district, but Eden Prairie has just as many advantages if not more! That school should
have been split up a long time ago due to its massive size just like Lakeville did
but they have chosen to stay on and add new wings to the school so they now
have a total enrollment of 3079. Cretin has an enrollment of 1322 by comparison.
I would not go that route as I would like to give more kids
the opportunity to play, but EP elects to do this and continues to bring home a
lot of trophies and state championships. I am not complaining about that at all,
that's their choice, but you should realize that NOBODY should feel sorry for
poor old EP. Cretin was a big underdog in this game and they pulled off a nice,
tough win!!
 

Congrats, Cretin, from an alum. Now if you could only send more players to the U!
 


I am not trying to defend EP, but at least they are public. Take a look at the HS tournaments in any sport. Very rarely does the tourney start without the private catholic school somewhere in the mix.

Breck, CDH, De La Salle, Totino Grace, Holy Angels, Hill Murray, Benilde St Margret, Blake, St. Cloud Cathederal, according to my quick google search.

I really dont follow high school sports that much, but you are talking about a state football champion in some class pretty much every year for the last 2 decades, and a bunch of hockey titles. I would bet the other sports I really, really dont watch are something similar.

My larger point is that these private schools make up maybe 25 schools in the state (if you include the other ones that dont pop up annually in the tourneys that I didnt want to type out)? How many public high schools do we have in MN? According to wikipedia (which i know isnt completely accurate, but this isnt coursework), there are about 500. So that means that these 25 schools win about half of the MSHSL state titles? Those are pretty good odds.

Let me put it another way...there have been about 100 world series. The Yankees have won it 27 times and have been in the WS 40 times. We in MN love to whine about the money the Yankees spend and how the Twins are a small market team, etc. Well, these private schools are more dominant than the Yankees have been.

I would congratulate them if they played the other private schools on a level playing field, until then i liken it to beating up on your younger siblings. Yeah, you won, but you were supposed to.
 

Let me also add this. I think people on here may be reluctant to chime in on this one because they they think that one Mr. Henderson reads this thread and will think that any negativity toward CDH will have a negative influence his decision to come to the U or not.

To them, I say this; I stand behind my words above. I truly believe that he will come, or he won't. Life will go on either way. However, I hope he does because we could really use him and think that he could become special here.

To Mr. Henderson, I would say this; this is a larger problem than you or anyone else on this stupid board can solve. Its more or less the same opinion of MSHSL stuff that i have had since I went to high school and got beat by the big catholic high school down the road every friggin time we played them in anything. You were presented with an opportunity to go to CDH, get an education and further your football career. You took it, and i sounds like you have done well with it on all accounts. Good for you. Make your decision to go to college whereever is best for you. I'd like to see you at the U next season.
 

amateurdwarftosser said:
I am not trying to defend EP, but at least they are public. Take a look at the HS tournaments in any sport. Very rarely does the tourney start without the private catholic school somewhere in the mix.

Breck, CDH, De La Salle, Totino Grace, Holy Angels, Hill Murray, Benilde St Margret, Blake, St. Cloud Cathederal, according to my quick google search.

I really dont follow high school sports that much, but you are talking about a state football champion in some class pretty much every year for the last 2 decades, and a bunch of hockey titles. I would bet the other sports I really, really dont watch are something similar.

My larger point is that these private schools make up maybe 25 schools in the state (if you include the other ones that dont pop up annually in the tourneys that I didnt want to type out)? How many public high schools do we have in MN? According to wikipedia (which i know isnt completely accurate, but this isnt coursework), there are about 500. So that means that these 25 schools win about half of the MSHSL state titles? Those are pretty good odds.

Let me put it another way...there have been about 100 world series. The Yankees have won it 27 times and have been in the WS 40 times. We in MN love to whine about the money the Yankees spend and how the Twins are a small market team, etc. Well, these private schools are more dominant than the Yankees have been.

I would congratulate them if they played the other private schools on a level playing field, until then i liken it to beating up on your younger siblings. Yeah, you won, but you were supposed to.
Click to expand...

I think you greatly overestimate the dominance of the private schools. First off, they should be
allowed to compete in the state tournaments as they are accredited institutions and everyone
benefits from having those kids in healthy competition. Let's take football for example. In the
large schools division, this was only the second time Cretin has won a state championship.
I do not think any other private school has ever won the largest tier in Minnesota for football.
While some schools such as St. Thomas or Totino-Grace do quite well in the next tier, most
of the rest of those private schools rarely win, if ever at any level. At the largest level of
competition in any sport, the private schools do not win too much at all in Minnesota.

In hockey, none of the private schools finished in the top 8 last year, but there were 3 that
finished in the next 8. In the Class A, there were 4 private schools in the top 15. This isn't
really dominating, but they usually have some good teams.

The private schools simply do not dominate at the higher level in any class, with the possible
exception of Cretin in baseball. Even then, I wouldn't necessarily say they dominate, just that
they are in the mix nearly every year.

Anyways, when you say there are 25 schools that win about half the state MSHSL tournaments
every year, that's not true at all. Actually, I think this Cretin win over Eden Prairie was a
win you don't see too often in the big schools division!
 

Goldrush,

What's with the format of your posts? they are always shorter than the actual message box. Do you write them in another program and the copy and paste them? What's the deal?
 



LOL - I guess I hit the return button before I get to the end of the line....
 

I would say the only real advantage would be in hockey with Shattack-St Mary's being a powerhouse.
 


I detest Cretin with a fiery passion. Always have, always will. Willing to forgive any Cretin players provided they come to MN.
 



amateurdwarftosser said:
Seriously, CDH should play with all the other private schools that recruit.
Click to expand...

No offense but this statement plus your logic in posts after this one are baseless, fact less and in general, ignorant.

The overwhelming majority of students at CDH enter the school having spent very little to no time as public school students (CDH starts at 9th grade); they enter having attended other private schools. So it is only natural they would attend a private high school for high school. Other institutions like say Breck start at kindergarten and so most of the athletes again have never gone to school anywhere else.

You mentioned recruitment? Let's see how does that work? Come to CDH and pay $15 - $20,000 (even kids that get some financial aid pay thousands per year) so your kid can win a state championship? Why wouldn't the same kid just attend one of the FREE public power houses? Schools like Wayzata have open enrollment and buses that will pick kids up from all over the metro area.

I was a Mpls North graduate and later highschool coach, I can tell you first hand that recruiting happens far more frequently in public schools were they can offer FREE enrollment to play for dominant sports teams. At North we routinely (like other city schools) lost B-ball players to surrounding suburban schools.
:cool02:
 

Would your tourey also include Hopkins with the private schools that recruit. Hopkins BB has MANY players from outside the districk.
 

watching this game is like picking between 2 evils. I usually just root for the team with more gopher commits. I can't wait until they split up the EP district and Grant doesn't have 4 times as many kids to choose from, and Cretain and Totino have to actually stop recruiting, then true Minnesota State Champions can be crowned.
 

I understand what you are saying about public schools that recruit. I know it does happen. I think this stinks and isnt fair. But the point that i am making is that the private schools all recruit, as opposed to the fewer public ones that do. Maybe it doesnt help the good public or private ones so much as it hurts the poorer public teams.

That being said, if you were offered free tuition to CDH, Hill-Murray, or whoever to play a sport or to go to play at the public school (still free) wouldnt you go to the private school? I know i would attend the private one.

I realize that i am not going to change your mind, and you arent going to change mine, but I still think that it is funny how the same 10 or so private schools are consistently so good always in the mix. Their enrollments are less than most (CDH vs EP), yet they always seem to be in the running. I think that it becomes more of a joke when the enrollments are somewhat the same and these schools consistently beat their similar sized rivals, as somewhat alluded to above in the second tier (3A?...Totino size). I know, it must be all coaching!
 

One last thought here. If we are going to congratulate CDH on their championship, why dont we congratulate Totino Grace, Stephen-Argyle Central, Minneota, Waterville-Elysian-Morristown,
New London-Spicer? After all, they won too?

I would also like to point out that we currently have 1 commit from TG (Pride) and their RB that we may be looking at (Crockett). How many commits do we have from Cretin this season? Oh yeah, none. Might it be that we are trying to kiss the talented behind of Sentreal Henderson?
 

amateurdwarftosser said:
I understand what you are saying about public schools that recruit. I know it does happen. I think this stinks and isnt fair. But the point that i am making is that the private schools all recruit, as opposed to the fewer public ones that do. Maybe it doesnt help the good public or private ones so much as it hurts the poorer public teams.

That being said, if you were offered free tuition to CDH, Hill-Murray, or whoever to play a sport or to go to play at the public school (still free) wouldnt you go to the private school? I know i would attend the private one.

I realize that i am not going to change your mind, and you arent going to change mine, but I still think that it is funny how the same 10 or so private schools are consistently so good always in the mix. Their enrollments are less than most (CDH vs EP), yet they always seem to be in the running. I think that it becomes more of a joke when the enrollments are somewhat the same and these schools consistently beat their similar sized rivals, as somewhat alluded to above in the second tier (3A?...Totino size). I know, it must be all coaching!
Click to expand...

My man, don't you think to make a statement that ALL private schools recruit is a bit irresponsible? Your making these outlandish statements and offerring up nothing to sustaniate your opinion. As a parent of a former private school athlete I can tell you first hand nobody EVER approached me or my son about attending Breck, CDH or any other private school nor have the families of any of the other D1 recruits that I have come to know on a personal level ever been appoached. I wll even give you last names Floyd, Eubanks, Carufel, Binns, Harris, Mauer, Bird, Anderson, Pride, Robinson to name a few.

No you won't change my mind because you are talking about something I have first hand knowledge of and I won't change your mind because it's already made up.

By the way, I don't know of a high school football staff as deep as CDH's with former D1 college players and coaches, this gives them a huge advantage when it comes to player development.

I notice you completely ignored my comments about the majority of private school athletes and students always being in the private school system not transferring in to play sports.
 

amateurdwarftosser said:
One last thought here. If we are going to congratulate CDH on their championship, why dont we congratulate Totino Grace, Stephen-Argyle Central, Minneota, Waterville-Elysian-Morristown,
New London-Spicer? After all, they won too?

I would also like to point out that we currently have 1 commit from TG (Pride) and their RB that we may be looking at (Crockett). How many commits do we have from Cretin this season? Oh yeah, none. Might it be that we are trying to kiss the talented behind of Sentreal Henderson?
Click to expand...

Absolutely! Congrats to all the state championship winners. I do not mean to take away
anything from the other kids. Winning a state championship is a very special thing in any
sport and something those kids will remember the rest of their lives.

Actually, I was not trying to suck up to Seantreal Henderson at all. As I stated earlier, I coached
several of the Cretin kids in baseball so I have a vested interest in those kids. I know I have
coached AGAINST some of the kids from EP, Totino Grace and possibly New London Spicer, but
that's not quite the same thing!
 

Sportsfan24, I understand your point. You are right, my mind is made up as is yours. The right answer is probably somewhat in the middle. I just tire of seeing my younger siblings getting throttled by the superior private catholic school teams every year that reside in the conference. You are seeing this from the parent's prosepctive. I get it.

Gold Rush, my apologies. I didnt reread the part about knowing the guys. Different story, sorry.
 

amateurdwarftosser said:
Sportsfan24, I understand your point. You are right, my mind is made up as is yours. The right answer is probably somewhat in the middle. I just tire of seeing my younger siblings getting throttled by the superior private catholic school teams every year that reside in the conference. You are seeing this from the parent's prosepctive. I get it.

Gold Rush, my apologies. I didnt reread the part about knowing the guys. Different story, sorry.
Click to expand...

Just curious, what school do your younger siblings go to??
 


Gold Rush said:
I think Cretin does not necessarily recruit so much as kids go there because they are
good. In other words, it doesn't go out and recruit kids because they are good football players
but good football players want to go there because they have a good
program. I coached a few of the kids that are on that team in baseball over
the last several years and I couldn't be more proud of them!! I also know of
a few very good athletes that tried to get in there and were denied due to
grades or other issues. If Cretin was all about the sports, those kids most definitely would have
gotten in there.

I think Cretin does have a few advantages by being able to get kids from outside
their district, but Eden Prairie has just as many advantages if not more! That school should
have been split up a long time ago due to its massive size just like Lakeville did
but they have chosen to stay on and add new wings to the school so they now
have a total enrollment of 3079. Cretin has an enrollment of 1322 by comparison.
I would not go that route as I would like to give more kids
the opportunity to play, but EP elects to do this and continues to bring home a
lot of trophies and state championships. I am not complaining about that at all,
that's their choice, but you should realize that NOBODY should feel sorry for
poor old EP. Cretin was a big underdog in this game and they pulled off a nice,
tough win!!
Click to expand...

How about the scholarships they get when they can't afford it? Fergie was quoted that Crawford was at Totino on a "academic need" scholarship. How good does that look when the school hasn't provided the kid with an education to qualify for D1 or D2 entrance?

How much is Seantrel paying to go to Cretin?

How do parents that these kids replace feel? I'd never send my kids to a private school but, I'd have a hard time paying $10,000 and my kid not getting a chance to play because the school I sent them to had better athletes that were on "need scholarships" replacing them.
 

amateurdwarftosser said:
I am not trying to defend EP, but at least they are public. Take a look at the HS tournaments in any sport. Very rarely does the tourney start without the private catholic school somewhere in the mix.

Breck, CDH, De La Salle, Totino Grace, Holy Angels, Hill Murray, Benilde St Margret, Blake, St. Cloud Cathederal, according to my quick google search.

I really dont follow high school sports that much, but you are talking about a state football champion in some class pretty much every year for the last 2 decades, and a bunch of hockey titles. I would bet the other sports I really, really dont watch are something similar.

My larger point is that these private schools make up maybe 25 schools in the state (if you include the other ones that dont pop up annually in the tourneys that I didnt want to type out)? How many public high schools do we have in MN? According to wikipedia (which i know isnt completely accurate, but this isnt coursework), there are about 500. So that means that these 25 schools win about half of the MSHSL state titles? Those are pretty good odds.

Let me put it another way...there have been about 100 world series. The Yankees have won it 27 times and have been in the WS 40 times. We in MN love to whine about the money the Yankees spend and how the Twins are a small market team, etc. Well, these private schools are more dominant than the Yankees have been.

I would congratulate them if they played the other private schools on a level playing field, until then i liken it to beating up on your younger siblings. Yeah, you won, but you were supposed to.
Click to expand...

What I find quite humorous, is you pontificate a lot about something you yourself admit to "not follow much." Instead of writing like you're an expert on this subject, maybe you should have brought it up asking for some input and opinions. As others have stated, with open enrollment, the "recruiting" by private schools is basically a mute point in the metro area. Now, out-state schools (both public and private) have a real good gripe. Kids living in rural areas don't really have much of a choice on which school they are attending.
 

"WAAAH, WAAAAH, WAAAH, my team lost to a better private school team so I'm going to cry foul!" "WAAH, WAAAH, WAAAAH..."

Is Cretin supposed to apologize for having an incredible tradition and great athletic and academic programs that attract kids that want to gain exposure to college coaches and good academic universities?

As for the kid who said he hates cretin with a fiery passion- why? Because they beat your ass in high school and your team just wasn't good enough? Its funny, you never hear the public school shills crying foul when good old public schools win, but when cretin wins a title in any sport its, "they recruit, the players don't pay to go to school, they get kids from everywhere in the state, etc etc etc." Give me a break. It's never mentioned that the kids show up at 7 am 5 days a week in the summer to work out.

As for Nemo's allusion to 'how do the parents of these kids feel who lost their spot to better athletes?' Well, I am assuming they realize that their kid isn't good enough to play in front of these athletes. Oh well. Some kids will bust their ass to be a part of a team, a GOOD team, and feel just as involved as the starting quarterback. And if they want to go somewhere where they can play and get a private education, go to St. Thomas or one of the other private schools that don't even play up with the Big Boys.

As for the need based scholarships, something like 70-80% of cretin kids are on need based financial assistance, with many students joining the work program to pay off their tuition.

Yeah, continue with the sour grapes. And touching on an earlier post, a person can not congratulate the AAAAA state champs without acknowledging all the other state champions? Maybe people just care more about EP-CDH than Stephen Argyle, Watertown whatever, and all the other small school programs. Jeez, I know we are in the era of 'everyone gets a trophy' but I didn't realize we were in the era of equal opportunity compliments as well.
 

I actually was rooting for CDH to win over EP. How come more non-athletic St. Paul kid's don't get scholarships to CDH if it's so great? Maybe they could solve the problems on the streets. Like I said, I would never send my kid to a private school, I don't see any benefits.
 

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