College Soccer is Looking at Becoming a Pro League

[GopherGrit]

Yes, but the European schedule goes from August through May. That means if they changed it to be like Europe like they're saying you would have to play games outside in MN in Dec, Jan, Feb, and March.

Currently, the preseason starts in Feb and they are us usually in California the entire preseason Then the first game is usually in March. They usually schedule the Loons on away games heavier in the early part of the season due to the weather. So right now they have two months of cold weather where they don't usually have a lot of home games early on.

Again, do you think players from Mexico, South & Central America want to play soccer outside in MN in the coldest months? Not even most Europeans would want to do that.

Maybe money and a chance to play at a higher level (than where they were) would be factors?

Play some of the coldest games at USBS?

 

[mcrow47]

Maybe money and a chance to play at a higher level (than where they were) would be factors?

Play some of the coldest games at USBS?

There are several leagues world wide that have as much or more money and are as high or higher level than the MLS. The MLS wants to compete for players in the higher leagues. Playing in MN or any northern state in the winter would be a huge negative for many players. And no, they would not play at USBS, they spent a lot of money building soccer specific stadiums all over the country for a reason and they will not play on turf.

 

[Word]

There are several leagues world wide that have as much or more money and are as high or higher level than the MLS. The MLS wants to compete for players in the higher leagues. Playing in MN or any northern state in the winter would be a huge negative for many players. And no, they would not play at USBS, they spent a lot of money building soccer specific stadiums all over the country for a reason and they will not play on turf.

There are a few turf stadiums in MLS but it's definitely not preferred. Turf is a huge deterrent for superstar players.

 

[mcrow47]

There are a few turf stadiums in MLS but it's definitely not preferred. Turf is a huge deterrent for superstar players.

Yes, there are a few but that's just because they are teams that don't have a soccer specific stadium yet. But players hate playing on turf and they simply don't do that in Europe or other places in the world.

I just don't see players wanting to play soccer in MN in -20 temps and snow on a regular basis. I like the idea of a fall to spring schedule but most of the European leagues are in areas much less extreme weather wise than most of the North in the US.

 

[GopherGrit]

There are several leagues world wide that have as much or more money and are as high or higher level than the MLS. The MLS wants to compete for players in the higher leagues. Playing in MN or any northern state in the winter would be a huge negative for many players. And no, they would not play at USBS, they spent a lot of money building soccer specific stadiums all over the country for a reason and they will not play on turf.

List of Major League Soccer stadiums - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I found five on FieldTurf and four more on some kind of non-fully natural field.

This includes Seattle playing in an NFL stadium, I believe one of the most (financially?) successful teams in the league? Portland also non-natural, though their stadium was converted from a baseball/football stadium to a soccer stadium.

Atlanta, Charlotte, New England, and Chicago (Fire) also play in NFL stadiums, some of which are grass. Vancouver plays in a stadium similar to our old Metrodome on a synthetic surface.


And I'm only talking about for some of the games, not all. Just the coldest months.

 

[GopherGrit]

Yes, there are a few but that's just because they are teams that don't have a soccer specific stadium yet. But players hate playing on turf and they simply don't do that in Europe or other places in the world.

I just don't see players wanting to play soccer in MN in -20 temps and snow on a regular basis. I like the idea of a fall to spring schedule but most of the European leagues are in areas much less extreme weather wise than most of the North in the US.

Allianz has an advanced system of grow lights that also melt snow, and heat the field.

Minnesota United uses heat lamp technology to help melt snow, prepare pitch at Allianz Field

The Allianz Field staff received assists from the warm sun and some heat lamps to melt the snow on the pitch before home matches in March.

www.fox9.com

Unless it happens to blizzard during a game, they won't be playing in snow.

 

[Word]

Allianz has an advanced system of grow lights that also melt snow, and heat the field.

Minnesota United uses heat lamp technology to help melt snow, prepare pitch at Allianz Field

The Allianz Field staff received assists from the warm sun and some heat lamps to melt the snow on the pitch before home matches in March.

www.fox9.com

Unless it happens to blizzard during a game, they won't be playing in snow.

They played a game in KC last night in 5 degree weather. That's not a sustainable way to play the game and attract talent. Switching to the European schedule helps in some ways but the problems it creates are too many to justify IMO.

 

[GopherGrit]

They played a game in KC last night in 5 degree weather. That's not a sustainable way to play the game and attract talent. Switching to the European schedule helps in some ways but the problems it creates are too many to justify IMO.

Well again, my naive answer is to play the "cold season" in USBS.

I know there are some against that for the reasons laid out, seems mainly being against playing on artificial surface.

I don't know what "top players" think about playing in Seattle, in an NFL stadium on artificial surface, but they seem to be a fairly successful franchise in MLS and they do that all season.

 

[Word]

Well again, my naive answer is to play the "cold season" in USBS.

Where would St. Louis, KC, Cincinnati, Columbus, Philadelphia, NYC (x2), and New England play in the winter?

And I don't think the Loons would love the idea of not playing in their own stadium with their own revenue. They'd probably prefer to just be on the road for 2 months instead of that, which I don't think is viable either.

And again, I think if we are talking about switching to a European schedule so that we can inch closer to competing with European leagues the turf issue will become a bigger deal. Seattle is good for the MLS, they aren't good at all compared to the top 5 European leagues. We are talking about attracting top talent, not formerly good players finishing their careers in their mid to late 30s.

Only way I could see it working is if they took January and February off completely and maybe push all December games to the South.

 

[Jack jones]

Who cares?

 

[Word]

Who cares?

Could probably say that about every single post you make.

 

[GopherGrit]

Where would St. Louis, KC, Cincinnati, Columbus, Philadelphia, NYC (x2), and New England play in the winter?

And I don't think the Loons would love the idea of not playing in their own stadium with their own revenue. They'd probably prefer to just be on the road for 2 months instead of that, which I don't think is viable either.

And again, I think if we are talking about switching to a European schedule so that we can inch closer to competing with European leagues the turf issue will become a bigger deal. Seattle is good for the MLS, they aren't good at all compared to the top 5 European leagues. We are talking about attracting top talent, not formerly good players finishing their careers in their mid to late 30s.

Only way I could see it working is if they took January and February off completely and maybe push all December games to the South.

OK. I was focused on the Loons but you have a much broader view of how it could be bad as a whole for MLS. I will have to defer to you on that.

Is the US really that much colder than Europe? England? (I honestly don't know that answer.)

 

[Word]

OK. I was focused on the Loons but you have a much broader view of how it could be bad as a whole for MLS. I will have to defer to you on that.

Is the US really that much colder than Europe? England? (I honestly don't know that answer.)

England is in the 30s and 40s for most of winter (Spain, France, Italy even warmer). Northern US obviously drops below freezing frequently.

 

[GopherGrit]

England is in the 30s and 40s for most of winter (Spain, France, Italy even warmer). Northern US obviously drops below freezing frequently.

Without looking (yes I'm being lazy), I assume STL, KC, Columbus, Cinci on average don't get cold like here.

Not sure about New England and NYC.

 

[mcrow47]

Allianz has an advanced system of grow lights that also melt snow, and heat the field.

Minnesota United uses heat lamp technology to help melt snow, prepare pitch at Allianz Field

The Allianz Field staff received assists from the warm sun and some heat lamps to melt the snow on the pitch before home matches in March.

www.fox9.com

Unless it happens to blizzard during a game, they won't be playing in snow.

The field not being frozen doesn't mean the players aren't freezing and keeping the field warm will be an additional cost across the league and many stadiums are not even able to heat the fields.

The fact is you can argue all you want that it's not a major problem but it is. Northern US is much colder in the Winter than it is in any place there is major league. It's not workable and will never happen.

 

[GopherGrit]

The field not being frozen doesn't mean the players aren't freezing and keeping the field warm will be an additional cost across the league and many stadiums are not even able to heat the fields.

The fact is you can argue all you want that it's not a major problem but it is. Northern US is much colder in the Winter than it is in any place there is major league. It's not workable and will never happen.

I don't think I've argued that it wouldn't be a major problem, I don't known enough to argue that, especially for the whole league that I don't follow closely. I will have to defer to folks like you, Word, etc. who do.

All I was trying to think and discuss was the idea that the Loons could play in USBS during colder months.

And actually, the thread was about major college soccer. However the Gophers do not have a men's varsity team, and unfortunately I'm guessing won't get one any time soon unless men's college soccer picks up in popularity.

 

[Word]

I don't think I've argued that it wouldn't be a major problem, I don't known enough to argue that, especially for the whole league that I don't follow closely. I will have to defer to folks like you, Word, etc. who do.

All I was trying to think and discuss was the idea that the Loons could play in USBS during colder months.

And actually, the thread was about major college soccer. However the Gophers do not have a men's varsity team, and unfortunately I'm guessing won't get one any time soon unless men's college soccer picks up in popularity.

I think there is zero chance the U adds men's soccer. More likely to cut sports than add.

 

[disco]

Where would St. Louis, KC, Cincinnati, Columbus, Philadelphia, NYC (x2), and New England play in the winter?

And I don't think the Loons would love the idea of not playing in their own stadium with their own revenue. They'd probably prefer to just be on the road for 2 months instead of that, which I don't think is viable either.

And again, I think if we are talking about switching to a European schedule so that we can inch closer to competing with European leagues the turf issue will become a bigger deal. Seattle is good for the MLS, they aren't good at all compared to the top 5 European leagues. We are talking about attracting top talent, not formerly good players finishing their careers in their mid to late 30s.

Only way I could see it working is if they took January and February off completely and maybe push all December games to the South.

St. Louis still has the dome the Rams played in.
In case anyone was wondering, MLS currently ranks 9th in terms of league strength on the world stage.

 

[mcrow47]

St. Louis still has the dome the Rams played in.
In case anyone was wondering, MLS currently ranks 9th in terms of league strength on the world stage.

View attachment 35935

Best case it becomes the #6 behind the French top League. There's just too much competition in the US with the NBA, NFL, NHL, MLB....ect. There's not really any major sport in Europe that comes close to rivaling soccer. Rugby is pretty popular in some areas and basketball has grown but still not a real competition in any way.

 

[GopherGrit]

Best case it becomes the #6 behind the French top League. There's just too much competition in the US with the NBA, NFL, NHL, MLB....ect. There's not really any major sport in Europe that comes close to rivaling soccer. Rugby is pretty popular in some areas and basketball has grown but still not a real competition in any way.

What are those numbers based on?

If it's viewership/tickets sold type of thing, then I could agree. But if it's just money invested and spent on players, I could see MLS money continuing to grow.

 

[Word]

What are those numbers based on?

If it's viewership/tickets sold type of thing, then I could agree. But if it's just money invested and spent on players, I could see MLS money continuing to grow.

Here is the explanation but still not super clear. I think the rankings make sense for the most part though, IMO. I agree with mcrow that the best MLS will ever be is 6th. But that would still be really good soccer.

The Strongest Leagues in the World: What the Opta Power Rankings Say | Opta Analyst

Want to know which are statistically the strongest leagues in the world? The Opta Power Rankings can help there.

theanalyst.com

 

[SomeGopherFan]

Here is another article on the original topic. I was curious as to why the universities would sink more money into a non-revenue sport, but it seems USSF would be injecting potentially a lot of money to make it work.

Anyway, the article suggests this change isn't imminent or particularly close to happening.

Can U.S. Soccer’s Support Kick Year-Round College Model Into Gear?

U.S. Soccer, the Big Ten and ACC are exploring the idea of launching a 32-team pilot program for two-semester men's college soccer.

www.sportico.com

 

[mcrow47]

What are those numbers based on?

If it's viewership/tickets sold type of thing, then I could agree. But if it's just money invested and spent on players, I could see MLS money continuing to grow.

I'm not sure what the rankings are based on but they seem accurate to the overall popularity and quality of the leagues.

I know if you look at revenue alone it looks pretty accurate.

EPL $9b
La Liga $6.7b
Bundesliga $5.7b
Serie A $4.6b
Ligue 1 $3.1b
MLS $2.8b

So MLS by revenue is about #6 at the movement but that's after a large growth period in revenue and they brought in multiple new franchises the last few years which increases the revenue a lot. They are getting to the number of teams where adding more teams is difficult, leagues just get too unwieldy. They grew 16% in revenue each of the last four years but I think that's going to slow quite a bit now with reaching just about the max number franchises. Now the gain or loss in revenue will be more of a reflection of popularity of the product , rather than just adding more franchises.