Children shot and killed in Mlps

Pompous Elitist

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Riiigghtt. If someone makes you feel nervous, it's a justified shooting? There are sooo many other paths to take before you pull that trigger.

Go ahead, tough guy.

He had every option to not reach for the gun despite instruction, as well.
 

Nax5

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Go ahead, tough guy.

He had every option to not reach for the gun despite instruction, as well.
Unless he had the gun in his hand, it still ain't it, bud.

I have a somewhat better understanding of the training since I have cops in the family. If you kill a dude because you're nervous, you weren't cut out to be a cop.
 

Pompous Elitist

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An article contradicts your assertion (bolded) on CNN per the opinion from a medical professional, so I have no idea what you're referring to in your assertion (bolded).


Autopsy says Greene's death was "inconsistent" with car crash​

An autopsy from the Union Parish Coroner's Office states in its opinion section that lacerations of Greene's head were "inconsistent with motor vehicle collision injury and most consistent with multiple impacts from a blunt object."
The report also says, "no written incident report was provided despite requests" and that "no detailed information regarding the motor vehicle collision ... was provided. It notes that "no emergency services medical records were provided" to the coroner's office.


An officer at the scene described it thusly (he clearly thinks it was more than "roughed up")- from the same link -

Audio from Hollingsworth's body camera revealed a telephone exchange inside his patrol vehicle after the beating. He begins by saying Greene was drunk.

"And I beat the ever-living f*** out of him, choked him and everything else trying to get him under control and we finally got him in handcuffs when a third man got there and the son of a bitch was still fighting and we was still wrestling with him trying to hold him down because he was spitting blood everywhere," Hollingsworth says in the video.

"And then all of a sudden he just went limp," Hollingsworth said.

The above may well have been the moment he died.



Doesn't give anyone the right to beat someone to death the last time I checked.


I simply posted a name, please show me where I did anything else, oh snap, you can't because I didn't, however, I am posting the information which is out in the public purview at this point.

The Bodycam footage was just released so that's why this is gaining traction.



Hopefully if found guilty.



What? I posted a name that was it, and you classify that as me going on about this - SMH.
I simply posted a name and your rebuttal to that is some nonsensical potential scenario. I am dealing with the actual data of the case and not a possible outcome.

I assumed knowing the Old White Fellers that one of them would jump on it (I actually like your beard) and show their true colors on this subject matter, SO -

View attachment 12942

Di you actually read my post? Inconsistent with a car crash, as I stated. It’s not clear if there was a car crash, that’s how little information is out there right now. But never mind that, the frothing at the mouth brigade will fill in all the unknowns with their worst nightmares.

Neither you or anybody else here knows the facts of what happened. It’s under investigation, understand?
 

Gopher_In_NYC

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Unless he had the gun in his hand, it still ain't it, bud.

I have a somewhat better understanding of the training since I have cops in the family. If you kill a dude because you're nervous, you weren't cut out to be a cop.

Thank you.
 



Pompous Elitist

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Unless he had the gun in his hand, it still ain't it, bud.

I have a somewhat better understanding of the training since I have cops in the family. If you kill a dude because you're nervous, you weren't cut out to be a cop.

Every juror disagrees with you, and your police officer family members probably placate the family activist to keep the peace. The other possibility is they may end up like the guy in the video I posted.

Have you ever in your life been sucker punched, or had a gun pulled on you? How fast does that occur? What is your reaction time?

Why was he reaching into his pocket?
 

Pompous Elitist

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Get a load of the guys arguing officers aren’t or shouldn’t be nervous or on edge given the nature of their work dealing with the belligerent, violent dregs of society day after day.

Why don’t you join up and show them how it’s done?
 

Nax5

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Every juror disagrees with you
Disagrees about what? Did the jury decide the killing was justified? Or that the officer made a mistake and shouldn't be punished for it?
police officer family members probably placate the family activist to keep the peace
If all you have is assumption and conjecture, what are we doing here? It's almost like you think police are a hive mind that have to fall in and protect each other no matter what. Sounds familiar.
 

Pompous Elitist

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Nothing justified about the Castillo shooting. I guess being black, with a wide set nose, a four year old in the backseat, and an explanation that there is a firearm in the car made Castillo a major threat.

No, reaching into his pocket against instructions after announcing he had a gun did. Castile had every opportunity to deescalate the situation.
 



Nax5

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Get a load of the guys arguing officers aren’t or shouldn’t be nervous or on edge given the nature of their work dealing with the belligerent, violent dregs of society day after day.

Why don’t you join up and show them how it’s done?
You would crap your pants if I told you the kind of people my brother went to school with. A lot of people are not cut out to be cops. Yet they make it anyways. You need to stop putting professions on a pedestal.
 


Pompous Elitist

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Disagrees about what? Did the jury decide the killing was justified? Or that the officer made a mistake and shouldn't be punished for it?

If all you have is assumption and conjecture, what are we doing here? It's almost like you think police are a hive mind that have to fall in and protect each other no matter what. Sounds familiar.

That’s your interpretation? Of course it was justified given the situation and events, as the jury agreed.

I‘m the one with the hive mind? Some here can’t even wait for facts or a trial to occur before proclaiming guilt.
 

Nax5

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That’s your interpretation? Of course it was justified given the situation and events, as the jury agreed.

I‘m the one with the hive mind? Some here can’t even wait for facts or a trial to occur before proclaiming guilt.
In this argument, yes. You are treating police like a hive mind.
 



stocker08

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Unless he had the gun in his hand, it still ain't it, bud.

I have a somewhat better understanding of the training since I have cops in the family. If you kill a dude because you're nervous, you weren't cut out to be a cop.

Bingo. There was nothing in the audio clip that conveyed Castile being a threat. The second he said that he had a firearm in the car....the officer immediately started shouting and reached for his gun. We don't have video of what Castile was doing in the car with his hands. The officer said don't reach for it and both Castile and his girlfriend said that he wasn't.

I don't think that it was intentional.....but it's clear that the officer who shot Castile was FAR too quick to pull the trigger....towards someone who appeared to be complying.
 


Pompous Elitist

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They don't pay enough. Part of the problem why some of the force is not cut out for duty.

Why did Castile reach for his gun? Why was he acquitted? You are dodging.

You would crap your pants if I told you the kind of people my brother went to school with. A lot of people are not cut out to be cops. Yet they make it anyways. You need to stop putting professions on a pedestal.

I know many cops, from plebes to retired chiefs. Most are good people doing an impossible job with the worst sort of people. You should thank them instead of tearing them down. The ones that break the law should be prosecuted and imprisoned. Where we differ is you expect them to have precognition abilities.
 

stocker08

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No, reaching into his pocket against instructions after announcing he had a gun did. Castile had every opportunity to deescalate the situation.

Where is the video showing that he was reaching into his pocket? From the time that he said he had a firearm in the car....it was...what?....ten seconds TOPS before he was shot?

Your entire framing of this situation is wack. Castile was calm and collected....and the officer reacted in a overblown way towards Castile rightfully telling the officer that there was a gun in the car. LOTS of people have a conceal and carry. Castile telling the officer that there was a firearm in the car made him an immediate threat. But then again...the officer saw his wide set nose and assumed he was a robber.

Good god....you people.
 

Pompous Elitist

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Your opinion. You are entitled to it. We are to ours.

Edit: As alluded to, much of this comes down to an erosion of confidence.

The initial report.

The negative escalation.

The external training.

The assumption of malice.

All of these factors played a role.

BTW if he was that scared (training) perhaps he should not be an officer. Mohamed Noor comes to mind. Certainly if we took a similar route and assumed malice toward anyone out that time of night could say that Ms. Damond was in the wrong for lurking around a potential crime seen. Officer Noor was probably afraid too. She should have stayed in her home. She was most likely instructed to do so.

Going back to Yanez, changes were suggested and some were made. Some more may take place.

https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2018/05/15/bulletproof-mpd-rcs/


https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2020...ement-on-changes-to-minnesota-drivers-manual/

Thankfully we have cellphones.


"Take a frame by frame look at the video showing the death of Walter Scott at the hands of Officer Michael Slager. Does it match Slager's incident report and what is the unidentified object he leaves near Scott's body?"

Would the outcome have been the same without cellphone video?

You realize that officer went to prison, right?
 

Nax5

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Why did Castile reach for his gun? Why was he acquitted? You are dodging
We don't know if he was. We have no proof of that. But the jury must have believed that to be the case. Officers have traditionally always been acquitted after mistakes on the job. That will probably no longer be the case going forward.
Where we differ is you expect them to have precognition abilities.
We will agree to disagree. I do have higher standards of law enforcement. Considering I also know good officers.
 

Pompous Elitist

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Where is the video showing that he was reaching into his pocket? From the time that he said he had a firearm in the car....it was...what?....ten seconds TOPS before he was shot?

Your entire framing of this situation is wack. Castile was calm and collected....and the officer reacted in a overblown way towards Castile rightfully telling the officer that there was a gun in the car. LOTS of people have a conceal and carry. Castile telling the officer that there was a firearm in the car made him an immediate threat. But then again...the officer saw his wide set nose and assumed he was a robber.

Good god....you people.

I’m going off the posted video, audio, environment and circumstances. What are you basing your assessment on? Years/decades of anti-police stereotypes and prejudice.
 

Pompous Elitist

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We don't know if he was. We have no proof of that. But the jury must have believed that to be the case. Officers have traditionally always been acquitted after mistakes on the job. That will probably no longer be the case going forward.

We will agree to disagree. I do have higher standards of law enforcement. Considering I also know good officers.

That would probably be dead if put in a the wrong situation. Or, they are de-escalating the situation when discussing with you. I do this all the time. It’s not what they really think, they just don’t want to argue about it with highly opinionated people. Not worth the BP rise.
 

stocker08

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Get a load of the guys arguing officers aren’t or shouldn’t be nervous or on edge given the nature of their work dealing with the belligerent, violent dregs of society day after day.

Why don’t you join up and show them how it’s done?

Nobody is trying to say that they shouldn't be on edge. But you are completely ignoring the fact that some cops simply aren't cut out for the job. There was zero indication that Castile was a threat...and the officer reacted way too quickly. Jumpy people like that shouldn't be police officers.

What do you think of Noor getting twelve years for shooting Justine Damond? It was dark....she approached the vehicle without the officers realizing it.....Noor drew his gun and shot.
 

Pompous Elitist

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Nobody is trying to say that they shouldn't be on edge. But you are completely ignoring the fact that some cops simply aren't cut out for the job. There was zero indication that Castile was a threat...and the officer reacted way too quickly. Jumpy people like that shouldn't be police officers.

What do you think of Noor getting twelve years for shooting Justine Damond? It was dark....she approached the vehicle without the officers realizing it.....Noor drew his gun and shot.

Completely different scenario. She wasn’t reaching into her waistband or pocket against instructions, correct? Yes or no?
 

stocker08

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I’m going off the posted video, audio, environment and circumstances. What are you basing your assessment on? Years/decades of anti-police stereotypes and prejudice.

So you have zero evidence of anything. STP posted a video of an officer shooting. The report filed didn't match the video. The GF killing. Report didn't match what happened.

Funny that you are accusing me of stereotypes and prejudice. You are defending the officer who pulled over and shot a nutrition supervisor at a school....who he made a robbery suspect because of his wide nose and the color of his skin.
 

STPGopher

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You realize that officer went to prison, right?
which officer?

Edit: Since you haven't had the time to respond, I am going to assume that you meant both officers.

Officer Noor (Training? Bad fit?). Went to prison. Agree. The system worked.

The Officer that murdered Walter Scott. Also in prison. I asked if he would have went to prison without cellphone video? Most likely not. The only thing to base a decision on would have been a false police report. I member of the armed services would have been murdered in cold blood. The murderer would have went back to 'serving the public'.
 
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stocker08

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Completely different scenario. She wasn’t reaching into her waistband or pocket against instructions, correct? Yes or no?

Is it? They didn't see her walking up and then they just heard a noise. Quick reaction. Probably had no idea if she had anything in her hands. The difference here is that the officers in the Castile shooting had eyes on him the entire time.

But....there is another difference. Noor was black and he shot a white women.
 

Ogee Oglethorpe

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I have a somewhat better understanding of the training since I have cops in the family. If you kill a dude because you're nervous, you weren't cut out to be a cop.
There's certainly truth to this; the problem though, is that the narrative is that it's ALLLLLLLLLLLLL race related, not people being nervous, etc. When in doubt whatsoever, the answer must unequivocally be RACISM... that's just where we are as a country right now. And that's very sad, because it masks a lot of other things that are really going on.
 

Nax5

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That would probably be dead if put in a the wrong situation. Or, they are de-escalating the situation when discussing with you. I do this all the time. It’s not what they really think, they just don’t want to argue about it with highly opinionated people. Not worth the BP rise.
Police work is actually not that dangerous in terms of annual fatalities. So death should not be the expectation. Again, you're just throwing conjecture around.
 

Pompous Elitist

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“Emanuel Kapelsohn, a police training expert witness, took the stand during the defense portion of the trial to tell jurors that Yanez acted appropriately because he had reason to believe that Castile was reaching for a weapon. Kapelsohn told jurors that it takes less time for a suspect to reach for a gun than it typically does officers to process a weapon and react, meaning that police who suspect a gun may be in danger if they wait to see it.

To emphasize his point, Kapelsohn conducted a demonstration in the courtroom during which he placed a replica of Castile’s handgun into a pocket in a pair of shorts identical to the ones Castile was wearing on the night of the shooting. The gun protruded from the short pockets, which, as Kapelsohn pointed out, allowed easy access.

Kapelsohn recorded the time it took him to remove the gun from the shorts, and showed jurors that it takes only about one-third of a second for the weapon to become a threat — less than the roughly half a second it takes for officers to respond to a threat. Kapelsohn concluded that police officers, while not perfect, are trained to respond to the presence of weapons with deadly force in order to ensure their own safety.”
 

STPGopher

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So you have zero evidence of anything. STP posted a video of an officer shooting. The report filed didn't match the video. The GF killing. Report didn't match what happened.

Funny that you are accusing me of stereotypes and prejudice. You are defending the officer who pulled over and shot a nutrition supervisor at a school....who he made a robbery suspect because of his wide nose and the color of his skin.
I think we agree here. That bad policing plays a role. What is rarely discussed is the impact that poor policing has on good officers.

I find it odd that 'we' as a society are resistant to fixing something that is potentially fixable.
 




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